That stat squish.

[Jtbrig7390]

It's been a while, but if I remember correctly the first one was during Cata or MoP, and there was another one around the 6.0 patch.

There has only been one and it was the Pre-Wod patch at the end of MOP.

[Swizzington]

Item squish is good, but they need to keep the growth in check too. Like, after the last squish it didn't take long for the numbers to go back to being insane.

Actually, you know what? Let's have a squish after every expansion.

[Daws]

The stat squish is nothing but avoiding the flaw in there game. The last one came in with the pre patch for WoD and now we're likely getting a fresh on in the pre-patch for the next expansion (otherwise at launch of next xpac). The rate this has come round is way to fast and in fact the idea that they need to perform any squish just highlights that there not handling the system correctly. In a properly built game the pacing should be enough to go on indefinitely as the increase shouldn't be so dramatic that with each new raid tier you add between 500k and 750k to your dps). If they would just stop with the massive power jumps this problem goes away.

[Deleted]

I'd just like to know why we're getting this squish in the first place. The first one was due to technical reasons but I thought those were resolved at this point in time? So why then? The previous squish just obliterated the last shred of low level balance and progression the game had left, with level 30 items sometimes having more str/stam than some level 40 items among other issues. And the "big numbers are ridiculous" arguement is riduculous itself, we're level 110 with some artifacts like the scepter of sargeras being able to tear the world apart but people want to do level 60 dps.

Btw, also would like to point out Blizzard has Diablo in which you see numbers like 2000B(illion) pop up, yet in WoW apparently a mill is too much?

[Aaronioslo]

lol what are decimals.

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What clusterfuck?

have you ever seen people do 3.5 damage in THIS game?

old mobs randomly one shotting people?

[huth]

The issue isn't the stat squish it's that power inflation has gotten stupid.

In Vanilla you needed around 500 dps to beat Patchwerk. By Festergut, the last "dps check" boss in Wrath, you needed 7200. So from the end of Vanilla to the end of Wrath, 2 expansions, DPS had increased by a factor of around 14.

Now go back and look at butcher, the first big dps check boss in Wod. World first was done with people doing 30k dps. Now, an expansion and a half later, we have people doing 1.5 million dps. That's 50X the DPS in an expansion and a half!

Two mistakes. First, you're comparing different things(first to last DPS check vs. first DPS check clear to current max. DPS), second, you have Artifacts on top of iLvl this expansion inflating gains beyond what you would normally have.

You'd have to at least calculate the gain from Artifacts and remove that before comparing to get anything remotely useable.

I'd wager a guess the difference wouldn't actually be all that big if you did.

Item squish is good, but they need to keep the growth in check too. Like, after the last squish it didn't take long for the numbers to go back to being insane.

Actually, you know what? Let's have a squish after every expansion.

Growth is completely under Blizzard's control. It is the way it is because they want it to be.

[Polarthief]

I'm glad we're getting another squish, but man it must be awkward going from 1-110 and barely getting a single upgrade even without Heirlooms.

[Mirishka]

Now here's hoping they don't fuck it all up only one or two expansions later only to have to do it again.

Until they fix the underlying issue that is causing us to have to be repeatedly squished, it will.

[huth]

Why would I remove artifacts? The point is that the power inflation has gotten too high, source doesn't matter. And I know I'm not comparing like to like, but the point is that over 2 expansions our dps increased by a factor of 14 back then, and in less than 2 expansions now our dps has increased by a factor of 50.

Because where that inflation comes from is a relevant factor. A large part of that inflation will be removed at the end of the expansion due to us losing the Artifacts and as such won't have any long-term effects on the game.

[Metacrias]

Honestly though, the thing is, it only appears daunting, but it's really not. In the Vanilla era of the game, 2 weeks of in game play time was what it took to get a character from 1 - 60. TBC and WotLK also continued the "leveling is part of the experience" trend. Once Cata rolled around, things changed so that max level was where the focus went. This is especially true today in Legion, where it is fairly easy to level from 1 - 110 in under 4 in game played days without heirlooms. So the only thing that scares people is the number they see on screen, not actual difficulty / time commitment.

I agree that leveling isn't nearly as daunting as it appears; I'm arguing, in part, that the appearance itself is what matters though. In order for WoW to continue on, it has to maintain a relatively strong and reliable playerbase. We know that subscriptions have declined significantly over time - though I'm guessing that decline has slowed or even reversed as WoW reaches new markets in Asia and Europe. WoW is such a big game, with such huge amount of history and lore, that it can appear daunting and overwhelming to people considering trying it out for the first time. This matters more and more - as gaming becomes more diversified and sophisticated, WoW is likely suffering from a sense of being outdated compared to other options available to potential customers. Compare FFXIV to WoW in terms of just basic introduction, graphics, immersion and story-writing and you can see one reason WoW hasn't been all that successful in attracting new players to the franchise, at least here in the USA. Continued updates to the game engine can certainly help, at least.

However, the number of levels and size of the world is also a barrier to entry. Imagine being a casual gamer who is about to open up WoW for the first time ever, today. No heirlooms, no gold... 120 levels seems like an enormous amount of time to reach the part of the game 99% of the playerbase is focused upon. Sure, new players get one boosted toon but how many choose the right class and spec? And how much easier is it to be thrown into WoW fully leveled rather than learn the ropes while leveling? I can see how this would be a huge turn-off for a lot of people, especially as quality competition is increasing.

Blizzard would do well to find a way to make the leveling experience feel like it matters and is relevant. I'm leveling a few toons on a new server right now, and it is really obvious how trivial everything I'm doing is - and that makes it a lot less enjoyable than it used to be. I'm not sure what the best solutions are... but I do think a whole expansion dedicated to overhauling the entire world, from level 1 to 120, would be great. It would be a means of making WoW into WoW2 without the problems of actually making a new WoW. Streamline the story, fix the writing (honestly, the 'story' and 'lore' for much of the game - at least through Outland - is horribly written and so disjointed as to be nonsensical), make professions matter at all levels...

[chubbybunny]

Without the other stat squashes we've had, i wonder what the last tier on legion would have given the tanks right now... I'd say about 1 Billion or more...

[Deleted]

Growth is completely under Blizzard's control. It is the way it is because they want it to be.

Considering they are having to do squishes......how does that work?

[Deleted]

I was never really that bothered with numbers, but it can't hurt to lower them a little bit again.

[Al Gorefiend]

Finally. If it weren't for the WoD stat squish we'd be critting for like 400 mil right now.

By expansion 10 food would restore 4.2 Quadrillion health over 20 seconds

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I'm glad we're getting another squish, but man it must be awkward going from 1-110 and barely getting a single upgrade even without Heirlooms.

I think the weights are going to remain the same, just the number displayed will be lower.

So if 1 stamina post squish = 100 stamina now, getting a leather belt with +2 stamina is effectively the same as going from 100 stamina belt to 200 stamina belt.

[dopefishz]

It doesn't matter that it isn't a nerf, it FEELS like a nerf and that's what matters. When something hits for 1,500,000 before and patch and 1,500 after, it FEELS like a huge power decrease.

How something feels matters as much or more then what it actually is.

Do you have nothing better to when playing WoW than to look at all the numbers that pop up ? Disable the numbers and look at the healthbar/targetframe. The health will disappear as fast as before the statsquish. There, I just fixed your little, laughable problem for you.

[Aaronioslo]

He was talking about percentage damage to a boss that will stay the same. Once again, what are decimals lol

you are making less than 0 sense.

but do enlighten me, WHAT ARE DECIMALS?

and people still think saying lol is cool in 2017?

[Bladesyphon]

Good, it looks like BFA is going to bring stats back down to Wrath of the Lich King's era. And with the ilvl being brought down too, Blizzard can (hopefully) maintain the power creep better this time by not having a massive increase in ilvl with each tier.

..Oh who am I kidding, by the expansion after BFA we'll probably be back to Legion level stats.

[Kittahsmash]

Nice screenshot, lol. Not just a stat squish, but an ilvl squish? Wearing green item level 195's at 110?

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you are making less than 0 sense.

but do enlighten me, WHAT ARE DECIMALS?

and people still think saying lol is cool in 2017?

Why do you not know what decimals are?

.... Do you always try to make it so that what you type seems "cool"? The fuck? (Oh shit I can't say lol, people will think I'm not cool anymore.) You're trying *way* too hard dude.

[Aaronioslo]

Nice screenshot, lol. Not just a stat squish, but an ilvl squish? Wearing green item level 195's at 110?

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Why do you not know what decimals are?

.... Do you always try to make it so that what you type seems "cool"? The fuck? (Oh shit I can't say lol, people will think I'm not cool anymore.) You're trying *way* too hard dude.

how does this concern you in anyway? someone quoted me , i replied, and he replied, what the fuck does that have to do with you? gtfo

[Shutyertrap]

Considering they are having to do squishes......how does that work?

It works like this..they kick the can down the road. Every business works this way for one thing or other. They know they will have to do a squish, so they keep on going with the exponential growth for now and tackle the problem only when something is about to break.