Normal Antorus Boss Difficulty

[Jastall]

I think my biggest criticism is that Argus did not feel like a final boss in terms of tuning, for normal. The fight itself is pretty epic, but it doesn't have a ton of mechanics, what mechanics there are don't hurt a lot, and it just doesn't feel like a step-up from the previous bosses in most respects. Normal KJ was also easy but he could still wipe even geared groups if they were careless day 1, we wandered into the fight like headless chicken and lost one person beyond the automatic group wipe. Hopefully Heroic changes that.

[GreenJesus]

Our raid (we were 6/9M last tier) almost one shotted everything with only a couple people watching the videos. We just kind of did what seemed/looked right. After raiding for so long you recognize similar mechanics and can just figure out what to do.

Eonar was a complete joke. The adds blew up from 100 to 0 in like a couple seconds. Even though adds was the whole fight. It was probably the worst fight Blizzard ever made.

[Otrew]

Garothi: Easy but more fun than skorpion, nythendra or goroth
dogs: Easy and fun
high comand: Long fight and i think at least for me was the hardest fight of normal
hasobel: Easy if poeple now what they are doing
eonar: Most boring fight of Legion, i really hate adds fights
imonar: is a face roll if you are overgeared, literally people eat all the traps in second bridge and we still kill the boss
kingaroth:long fight becasue beam killing people the rest is not hard
coven: a few wipes so people can see all the adds and learn to deal with them. Bosses skill are easy to deal with it.
varimithras: 99% tanks responsability, dps just move from left to right and pew pew pew the boss
Agrammar: i had 2 wipes , one to see all his skill and the second because to many melee dps die for jumping on the boss before tanks. Pretty easy but fun fight
Argus: To easy, a lot easier than normal kj , guldan, avatar, botanist, kingaroth, covent, cenarius or high comand. Is the last boss of the exp should be the harder even in normal

[Deleted]

Bit worrying considering we'll have this raid for another 12 months..... Don't really want to be clearing heroic with pugs in the first month and then have nothing to do for 11 months except farm it....

[Varolyn]

I really wouldn't judge a raid's overall difficulty from just looking at normal alone (unless if you only do normal mode, and no heroic or mythic). I remember these very forums saying how Normal ToS was extremely easy and how much easier KJ was compared to Gul'dan on normal and heroic. People thought Mythic KJ was going to be Xavius 2.0, and we all know how that went.

[Seramore]

I want to get some of this amazing highly inflated titanforged gear the forums keep talking about. A significantly titanforged piece drops here and there for our raid, resulting is probably a 5 ilvl increase per player. And 5 ilvl when you're 940+ anyway is a pretty small percentage so clearly we're doing something wrong.

Normal Antorus drops 930-940 items, you just said the majority of your raid is at 940+. It's almost as if your entire raid massively outgears the level of tuning that normal Antorus was based around, considering how most normal and heroic raids are tuned for gear that is lower than the items that are dropped. Factor in the fact that there are far less punishing mechanics, your entire raid has tons of AP, you're shifting from Mythic to Normal, and you outgear the point of tuning, and you have an easy raid.

[Onikaroshi]

I really wouldn't judge a raid's overall difficulty from just looking at normal alone (unless if you only do normal mode, and no heroic or mythic). I remember these very forums saying how Normal ToS was extremely easy and how much easier KJ was compared to Gul'dan on normal and heroic. People thought Mythic KJ was going to be Xavius 2.0, and we all know how that went.

It's an issue with these forums, people judge Normal based off Heroic+ guilds/geared clearing it and Heroic off Mythic guilds clearing... It's only supposed to pose difficulty to the people it's aimed at.

[Ophenia]

Of course we should not judge Normal after running it overgeared, but Eonar looked like a waste of development, and I don't see how it could be a challenge even for 880i-geared people, honestly

[MrExcelion]

Bit worrying considering we'll have this raid for another 12 months..... Don't really want to be clearing heroic with pugs in the first month and then have nothing to do for 11 months except farm it....

Yeah, this thread is about normal, but honestly heroic argus is super easy too. Maybe we'll see mythic stealth buffed before tues

[Razorice]

Had more wipes on High Command that Argus (1 shot it). that wasn't right.
Eonar was a complete joke.

[xcess]

I think Argus is gonna be way more pug friendly. From what I can see there isnt really anything significant new in heroic so it should be quick to learn. Also most people dont have their 4 set and legendarys at 1000 yet. I think the mid bosses are gonn give more trouble for pugs

[Deleted]

You should try and PUG it with no communication. it will feel like MYTHTIC progress Specially varimathras and aggramar until tanks learn how to do "mechanics"

[Kazlofski]

You should try and PUG it with no communication. it will feel like MYTHTIC progress Specially varimathras and aggramar until tanks learn how to do "mechanics"

Yeah with complete pugs (no groupings inside) and no voice communication, it was definitely a fun challenge haha though nowhere near impossible of course.

High command and even more so Kin'garoth gave pugs from my experience most troubles, the rest were extremely easy

[Deleted]

I just think blizzard tuned it so low because they didn't want another ToS, and they probably wanted everyone to see this raid asap.

Seeing the raid asap, mainly because of the lore, I don't think we've ever had a raid with this much importance before.

[Deleted]

You should try and PUG it with no communication. it will feel like MYTHTIC progress Specially varimathras and aggramar until tanks learn how to do "mechanics"

Both took us one wipe. I don't know why tanks should have trouble at these two bosses.

[Heathy]

I pugged normal last night we first timed everything upto kin'garoth then things started taking a couple/multiple wipes to get right.

I went back in after that and pugged the first two bosses in heroic. I liked the instance and the bosses they were challenging in normal and will most likely be challenging in heroic with the extra mechanic.

the coven of shivarra took a few tries because ppl were starting to get tired and we replaced a bunch of ppl by that point, the men walking across the room and the spinning sword was catching ppl and basically one shotting.

last boss wasn't so bad in normal, at first ppl weren't putting the bombs in good places but once you get that bit right the rest of it is basically tank and spank on normal.

I think we only wiped on aggramar once because everyone was hugging the big adds or someone punted a bunch of small adds into the boss in quick succession but the first try ppl just got melted in the p2 intermission thing. then the second try the damage was more spread out and everyone grouped and spread for the flame rend better and didn't nearly kill each other with searing tempest.

I can imagine these end bosses being somewhat more difficult in heroic and probably insane in mythic.

[Ash123]

I got my AOTC last night and I can definitely say that, Argus is a joke even on heroic. The hard part is to get to him.

We killed Argus in 5 pulls ( I usually do pug, and i got Gul'dan in about 70 wipes, and KJ after 100 wipes). The first pulls end badly as people did not know how to do cone of death. The second pull end badly as people did not know how to do soul bomb.

Then we got Argus to 6% in 3rd pull, because we are too careless and we wasted the tree in a short time. 4th pull is 2% and we got the kill at 5th.

It is very possible that, if your group can get to Argus, and your group actually did the mechanic on normal correctly, then you might one-shot Argus.

Aggarmar, Coven, Varimathras, Kin'garoth and High Command are, in my opinion, all harder than Argus (I still need High Command to get 11/11H).

[Deleted]

a) you don't address anything I said

b) work is not a game so that's a very poor comparison

P.S. If I was in Ion's position, I would not take the same line on titanforging. My point is that the claim around this huge titanforging inflation (talking about whole raids of people here) is false. When you do the math, the percentages are small.

No it isnt. Games are suposto work same way as RL. Specialy MMORPG game. Geting this high itemlvl from facerolled normal mod isnt normal. It is pathetic.

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Bit worrying considering we'll have this raid for another 12 months..... Don't really want to be clearing heroic with pugs in the first month and then have nothing to do for 11 months except farm it....

Thats exactaly what will happen so. This is what you get when you overcasual your game and just give everyone everything on day one. There is nothing to work towards after 1 week of new patch.

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I really wouldn't judge a raid's overall difficulty from just looking at normal alone (unless if you only do normal mode, and no heroic or mythic). I remember these very forums saying how Normal ToS was extremely easy and how much easier KJ was compared to Gul'dan on normal and heroic. People thought Mythic KJ was going to be Xavius 2.0, and we all know how that went.

We dont care about mythic.

[NehmTH]

Went in a pug for normal in a group of around 935 average. Wiped twice on first boss, then I left.

[Onikaroshi]

Went in a pug for normal in a group of around 935 average. Wiped twice on first boss, then I left.

Congrats, I think you found the worst pug ever.