Thread: Underwhelmed

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  1. #1

    Underwhelmed

    I loved the cinematics for Battle for Azeroth and like the lore direction.

    However, so far, I find the expansion underwhelming:
    - 6 fake races - basically a little texturing work, does not make the impact of a true new race
    - No new class. Probably what many people are most looking forward to.
    - Azerite. Find and replace with 'Gold'. Resource farming is not fun.
    - Heart of Azeroth does not make sense. Why should it be given to both Alliance and Horde in a war between Alliance and Horde. Aka Talent tree 5.0. Let's hope we'll be able to change the choices, whatever they are called, at will and for free, contrary to Legion
    - Warfronts = Warcraft II RTS, yet another minigame in Wow that has nothing to do with RPG
    - Island = glorified 3 person scenario or whatever it was called back then
    - Social feature: trying to catch again Discord & Curse, but it's too late

    All in all, very little new features for an expansion, let's hope the new raids and dungeons will be good.

    Seems to me the WoW team has a big creative block and has absolutely no idea of how to innovate in the RPG-genre or even where it want to be in 5 years. That's ok. It's hard. They should probably hire new blood and transfer team members to other games/activities in Activision Blizzard, at least for a few years. It's rarely good to work on the same for 15 years, that's why most companies have some kind of rotation system.

  2. #2
    Dreadlord Ursiel's Avatar
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    Another one of these threads. How original and insightful.
    Hey

  3. #3
    Old God Kathranis's Avatar
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    It's funny how many people complain about no innovation but never seem to describe what new ideas they want added to the game.

  4. #4
    High Overlord Geeky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kathranis View Post
    It's funny how many people complain about no innovation but never seem to describe what new ideas they want added to the game.
    Agreed. Complaining takes no creativity, while coming up with replacement ideas...

  5. #5
    The Lightbringer Ragnarocket's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Istaria View Post
    I loved the cinematics for Battle for Azeroth and like the lore direction.

    However, so far, I find the expansion underwhelming:
    - 6 fake races - basically a little texturing work, does not make the impact of a true new race

    I'd agree if they were at all trying to sell them as "full races" but we are still getting new customization options as well as new racial/class combos. And we're getting 6 of them basically at launch.


    - No new class. Probably what many people are most looking forward to.

    We just got a new class...why would we have expected another one in this expansion?

    - Azerite. Find and replace with 'Gold'. Resource farming is not fun.

    You meant to say Artifact Power instead of Gold I imagine. And yeah not looking to farm up more AP. (Azerite Power)

    - Heart of Azeroth does not make sense. Why should it be given to both Alliance and Horde in a war between Alliance and Horde. Aka Talent tree 5.0. Let's hope we'll be able to change the choices, whatever they are called, at will and for free, contrary to Legion

    It seems like we will be - although I admit the system seems iffy. It's given to the heroes of the Horde and Alliance by Magni because he thinks it's the only way to save Azeroth.

    - Warfronts = Warcraft II RTS, yet another minigame in Wow that has nothing to do with RPG

    Less a mini-game and more of an actual new style of content ala Raids/Dungeons/etc. This much work isn't going into a full little mini-game.

    - Island = glorified 3 person scenario or whatever it was called back then

    True, although the "advanced AI" could be really good.

    All in all, very little new features for an expansion, let's hope the new raids and dungeons will be good.

    Seems to me the WoW team has a big creative block and has absolutely no idea of how to innovate in the RPG-genre or even where it want to be in 5 years. That's ok. It's hard. They should probably hire new blood and transfer team members to other games/activities in Activision Blizzard, at least for a few years. It's rarely good to work on the same for 15 years, that's why most companies have some kind of rotation system.
    I'm not super hyped up on a lot of what B4A is bringing to the table but there are at least some bright spots. Warfronts have good potential if done right.
    “The rains have ceased, and we have been graced with another beautiful day. But you are not here to see it.”

  6. #6
    Well at least we now know why The Broken Shore's "amazing new content" of kill 10 demons, or kill 10 rares, or kill 10 elites released once per week was so freaking thin.

    They were working on another expansion instead of actually making content for the current one.

    Sorry, but BfA looks and feels like a reskinned Legion. Unrewarding artifact power grind. I'm sure the 12 hours of leveling will be awesome though.

  7. #7
    Mechagnome Rekz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kathranis View Post
    It's funny how many people complain about no innovation but never seem to describe what new ideas they want added to the game.
    It's not our job to come up with ideas. That's why they're making the big bucks. They get PAID to come up with ideas. Have you ever been to the movies and saw a film that sucks? You're gonna give it a bad rating and in your conversations with people you'll describe why it's bad. Same thing.

    So far I agree with the OP. Lackluster to say the least.

  8. #8
    Banned Lilithvia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Obbsy View Post
    Another one of these threads. How original and insightful.
    Agreed.

    Very much my opinion on this matter.

  9. #9
    of course it's underwhelming, the hype is for Classic.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Kathranis View Post
    It's funny how many people complain about no innovation but never seem to describe what new ideas they want added to the game.
    Untrue.
    Many ideas were given over the year, such as finish north of Eastern Kingdom redesign (even suggesting to crowdsource it since they do not seem to want to do it themselves), make demonology a tanking spec, or get inspired by feature x of game y, but Blizzard never does.
    It feels like a "not invented here" company.
    Case in point: asking for housing and getting garrisons instead.
    Another: Star Wars superb class quest design
    Another: give players an editor and let them design part of the world, perhaps selecting only the best.
    Deep crafting vs superboring crafting with exactly the same quests as pve.
    Another: bring back the talents that were not necessarily useful in raiding or pvp, but were great to do things in the world (e.g. solo with very creative use of mechanics, which has been impossible for many xpacs).
    Another: Huge talent tree ako PoE
    Wildstar's free form targeting
    Another: multiclass like D&D or totally free-form as in pick whatever skill you want from class a & b & c

    There are many many features to try. Some would get adopted, some would get removed from the game for lack of success.
    But IMO, this would be time much better invested than in minigame x (pet battles, labyrinth, ...)

    Plus, in the case they have been praised a lot for a feature, such as reforging, they do not hesitate to kill it to most user base chagrin.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Istaria View Post
    I loved the cinematics for Battle for Azeroth and like the lore direction.

    However, so far, I find the expansion underwhelming:
    - 6 fake races - basically a little texturing work, does not make the impact of a true new race
    Yeah 6 new races don't make the impact of 1-2. kay.

    Quote Originally Posted by Istaria View Post
    - No new class. Probably what many people are most looking forward to.
    We just got a DH, we have 12 classes. They could stop adding them at this point.

    Quote Originally Posted by Istaria View Post
    - Azerite. Find and replace with 'Gold'. Resource farming is not fun.
    Thanks for the info.

    Quote Originally Posted by Istaria View Post
    - Heart of Azeroth does not make sense. Why should it be given to both Alliance and Horde in a war between Alliance and Horde. Aka Talent tree 5.0. Let's hope we'll be able to change the choices, whatever they are called, at will and for free, contrary to Legion
    I'm pretty sure that Azeroth doesn't care much about faction wars.

    Quote Originally Posted by Istaria View Post
    - Warfronts = Warcraft II RTS, yet another minigame in Wow that has nothing to do with RPG
    - Island = glorified 3 person scenario or whatever it was called back then
    Thanks for the heads up, I'm sure that you tried them both a lot to come up with this.


    Quote Originally Posted by Istaria View Post
    - Social feature: trying to catch again Discord & Curse, but it's too late

    All in all, very little new features for an expansion, let's hope the new raids and dungeons will be good.

    Seems to me the WoW team has a big creative block and has absolutely no idea of how to innovate in the RPG-genre or even where it want to be in 5 years. That's ok. It's hard. They should probably hire new blood and transfer team members to other games/activities in Activision Blizzard, at least for a few years. It's rarely good to work on the same for 15 years, that's why most companies have some kind of rotation system.
    And let's avoid talking about your "ideas", most of which bring 0 new gameplay and mechanics that wouldn't fit WoW at all (do I have to point at you why POE's giant skill tree fist that game and not WoW, really?)

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Kathranis View Post
    It's funny how many people complain about no innovation but never seem to describe what new ideas they want added to the game.
    I agree with the OP and I used to post details of what specifically I want, but all that happens is that one guy like you shuts up and another one in the next thread again comes with this "it's funny how these people who complain never say what they want" idiocy. So after twenty or so times I stopped detailing what I want in every post and only do so when I am in the mood.

    To the OP: yes, BFA contains very little. You are wrong on warfronts, they aren't a minigame, they are another take on LFR (and there's only one warfront planned currently), but that's even less interesting than a new minigame.

  13. #13
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Istaria View Post
    Untrue.
    Many ideas were given over the year, such as finish north of Eastern Kingdom redesign (even suggesting to crowdsource it since they do not seem to want to do it themselves), make demonology a tanking spec, or get inspired by feature x of game y, but Blizzard never does.
    It feels like a "not invented here" company.
    Case in point: asking for housing and getting garrisons instead.
    Another: Star Wars superb class quest design
    Another: give players an editor and let them design part of the world, perhaps selecting only the best.
    Deep crafting vs superboring crafting with exactly the same quests as pve.
    Another: bring back the talents that were not necessarily useful in raiding or pvp, but were great to do things in the world (e.g. solo with very creative use of mechanics, which has been impossible for many xpacs).
    Another: Huge talent tree ako PoE
    Wildstar's free form targeting
    Another: multiclass like D&D or totally free-form as in pick whatever skill you want from class a & b & c

    There are many many features to try. Some would get adopted, some would get removed from the game for lack of success.
    But IMO, this would be time much better invested than in minigame x (pet battles, labyrinth, ...)

    Plus, in the case they have been praised a lot for a feature, such as reforging, they do not hesitate to kill it to most user base chagrin.
    Nice examples, some a bit crazy to me but examples we have! And plenty! +Many of suggestions that are posted here or official WoW forums dont require many resources.

    Some other examples:
    +actual weather effects (heavy raining flooding certain places, snow covering landscape, ...)
    +new ranged class (really just pick any, tinker/engineer, necromancer, shadow hunter, even witch doctor....all could be great)
    +new combat system (many examples from other modern MMOs, tab targetting is outdated and boring)
    +solo queue!
    +new personal scoring system in BGs based on completing objectives
    +player housing!
    +more character customization like muscles, hairstyles, colours
    +random encounters/events happening around the world
    ...

    And this is more or less just copy-pasting from other MMOs, things I consider almost mandatory no-brainer. We are not even talking about something really new and innovative, thats blizzard´s job isnt it

  14. #14
    So, are you now asking for my sympathy or condolence or what?

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Pull My Finger View Post
    So, are you now asking for my sympathy or condolence or what?
    If only we knew...
    They always told me I would miss my family... but I never miss from close range.

  16. #16
    I liked the fantasy of Artifact weapons and I loved the end game progression that artifact power and weapons gave. There has to be a meaningful grind at max level. But it doesn’t have to feel like like a grind or as much of a grind as artefact power proved. However Azerite power and the necklace doesn’t feel as special or progressive as artifact weapons did. Aside from the insane numbers, artifact power got you constantly getting new talents which was exciting. They just needed to manage the progression better so laggers weren’t too far behind and could catch up faster and progressives who pushed weren’t stupidly ahead more like 1-2 talents max.

    I would have capped the AP per week, however the soft cap of diminishing returns or rather exponential requirements till a higher artifact knowledge level was quite good. However didn’t help with the Grundy feeling. But devs need to know that you can’t make everything ideal and you shouldn’t try, somethings need effort and work put into it and you need to be reward. But may the days of only gear as progression never NEVER return.

    I love the allied races. I know they are based off existing races with some variations, wanted to play some of them for ages more so than many many more completely new types of races already in game. I’m really glad they did them although I hope they can tweak LF Draenei I really wanted on the horde than Nightborne. If they give LF Draenei Wings I think I will be one of those people who play both factions. Not just one.

  17. #17
    The problem with these kind of lists is that you can do that to any feature you want.

    Raids? We already have dungeons this is just increasing the player number.
    Classes? In the end they are all just pressing buttons with different names.
    The lich king? It doesnt even make sense to invade northrend, because undeads cant swim.

    It takes zero effort to put a few negative words next to the features of an xpac or make up some nonsensical “realism“/ lore reasons why a feature doesnt make sense.

    Bfa has the standard amount of innovation. Wether or not its features will be dumb gimmicky minigames like the shipyard or great features that will enrich wows daily gameplay routine will be seen in beta.
    "And all those exclamation marks, you notice? Five?
    A sure sign of someone who wears his underpants on his head."

  18. #18
    I'm most sceptical about the Islands. From what we've heard they feel like a continuation of Pandaria's Scenarios, especially Unga Ingoo. I didn't mind the Scenarios, they were alright, but not something I found much value as a repeated activity and I don't think randomly generated conditions can boost that much. The enemy AI might just add another level of announce rather than intrigue.

    As always with negative first impressions, I hope they prove me wrong.
    Now you see it. Now you don't.

  19. #19
    Can we please close these threads? I swear, there's a new one of these "BFA is a filler expac" threads every day.

  20. #20
    The Unstoppable Force Super Kami Dende's Avatar
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    I'm looking forward to it and as usual people that aren't won't change my mind about it.

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