Could this be THE way to carry the night elves forward?

[Arrashi]

Lol.. isn't that the first elf expansion since TBC and the first night elf one? They don't come round often or star, enjoy while you can, already this expansion has very little of them, after 7.2 and the next one has hardly anything of them except for the races that join. Do you hate elves?

Ignoring that they were shoved into every expansion, regardless of if they fit or not. And after purgatory of 3 elf zones in legion we deserve long break. 2-3 expansion long one.

[Deleted]

It's time for the Dwarves and the Tauren to shine.

[Deleted]

Ignoring that they were shoved into every expansion, regardless of if they fit or not. And after purgatory of 3 elf zones in legion we deserve long break. 2-3 expansion long one.

Better than Orcs. I mean, they play so over masculine and hard and savage that I simply can't help but think that probably most Orcs are closeted homosexuals.

[Plehnard]

Better than Orcs. I mean, they play so over masculine and hard and savage that I simply can't help but think that probably most Orcs are closeted homosexuals.

Maybe they all work in the steel mill.

[Arrashi]

Better than Orcs. I mean, they play so over masculine and hard and savage that I simply can't help but think that probably most Orcs are closeted homosexuals.

That still makes them much more interesting than generic elves.

[Techno-Druid]

Better than Orcs. I mean, they play so over masculine and hard and savage that I simply can't help but think that probably most Orcs are closeted homosexuals.

I mean that's just the culture of orcs. Like their entire culture was based off of strength and resilience. I mean at one point in time some clans use to drown sickly babies.

Modern orc culture is actually pretty egalitarian by comparison (well as egalitarian as orcs can be).

[Mace]

But all that does not need a big city. What big city did the NEs have in those 10k years? Darnassus wasn't there until after Warcraft 3. What other big cities did they have before that? Oh right, none.
If you look at the buildings in Warcraft3 you can see that they are mostly grown out of or moulded into trees.

Yes, you're right (maybe not moulded on the trees) what you are saying is correct there, but what you're not getting is that this is not ALL there should be of them. That's one part of them, the druids do the tree homes. THe sentinels and priestesses put up with it only because aint no arcane magic allowed to use to build the pretty stuff. So they make use with that. But this shouldn't be all there is and the only thing there is to them.

We want them to develop too, and grow, especially when they are shown to be in that state for very specific reasons that end at the end of WC3, the legion returns, there is no need now to continue to ban the arcane or live in isolation anymore. Hence Darnassus is built in under a year (quite a feat btw) , by cataclysm, the arcane ban is lifted. Sure tree homes still exist and are used, because it is a part of the night elves, not ALL of the night elves. The Cenarion druids, huntresses will use them if they went around doing mobile homes on campaigns. But night elf society won't use them for a permanent city or dwelling place, something they now need seeing the Long Vigil is ended. They also now have highborne groups, and arcane users even more skilled in the art than they were 10k years ago, they are their own society and they would be a group of night elves building exquisite buildings with magic like they did 10k years ago.

Also just because you had to live in post apocalypse buildings because you couldn't use power as it would draw the world destroying aliens back, doesn't mean that now you can, and the aliens are defeated, that you would ALL instead opt to continue that way. It's insane logic.

As many have said, sure some night elves will continue living in the forest, in the wilds, out in the open and in tree homes, ,but some would gladly return to civilization, they've missed. You have to understand the night elf mindset, to a druid nature is a way of life and a pleasure, but to others, the Long Vigil was a sacrifice , being on constant watch, constant vigilance, dedicated to a single purpose, having to abstain from using the power you are suffused with, it's a sacrifice for the better good.

With the leigon defeated, they would LONG and desire for a return. The beauty about all of this is the night leves are a big enough group to have all types, the druid type that prefers the open wilds and barrow dens, the huntress types that prefer the tree homes, the priest types that prefer the ornate temples and city dwellings ,the mage types that prefer the ornate cities and civilizations, and the civilians who like any other would have a large bunch preferring the city but some preferring the country and a humble farm or an extravagant mansion. They also have the fel wielders who seem to like scorched fel infused places.

To say that is all there is to the night elves or should be really reduces the race and frankly makes it quite boring. So humans, orcs, blood elves, forsaken, dwarves can all evolve, as can draenei, but night elves should only be stuck as druids because that's what some players who didn't factor in they were a great arcane civilization first nor factoring the reason they find themselves in the forest woodland mindset we first meet them - think that's all they should ever be.

How boring, which is why i've really moved away from them. It seems blizzard has no intention of developing them, by taking the nightborne over to the horde, they literally pulll the developing dimension away from them, unless they raise the profile of the highborne to be to the night elves what the nightborne were going to be. A more diverse night elven society would be more attractive, but I'm quite happy with the nightborne because they are the part of the night elves i liked the most. If they raise the profile of the highborne and develop a night elf arcane civilization alongside but separate from the druids so both are running, then I would be interested in again, likely to run both nightborne and night elf as equivalents on either faction when i play or guild switches or friends tempt, but i don't think I will leave the nightborne unless blizzard really ruins their lores and their characters. And so far, I'm really worried about Thalyssra. I loved legion Thalyssra, but BfA Thalyssra, seems to be a totally different person it's not looking hopeful. I will still give it a chance and see though. We could end up in a situation where I don't like both, and night elves only in druid mode and Thalyssra turning into a bloodthirsty monster will do the trick.

[MatadorMedia]

TL : DR

So with the world tree Teldrassil burning, do the Night Elves lose their immortality now? How does that work?

[Friendlyimmolation]

TL : DR

So with the world tree Teldrassil burning, do the Night Elves lose their immortality now? How does that work?

They already lost their immortality back in warcraft 3.

Teldrasail was an attempt to get it back but norz didn’t bless it.

[Mace]

All night elves after the war of the ancients bonded with nature, the males just took one step further.
"The night elves have a deep affinity with the natural world and the animal kingdom a relationship wonderfully conveyed in all the races units and buildings. Druids can turn trees into living, fighting creatures or morph themselves into bear like animals or crows. Archers can mount on the backs of the flying hippogryphs to attack from above, while other units command panthers and tigers as riding beasts" - Warcraft 3 art book.

http://phillip-lehnard.de/3dPictures...oodthirsty.jpg
This is how female night elves were depicted in the art book, not the tame little elves we got with WoW. I would welcome to have NEs more like they were depicted in Warcraft3 and not the washed out tolkinesce version of wood elves we got in WoW.

All night elves bonded with nature, true, but all night elves were also bonded with the arcane. Their essence is arcane and they all also loved the arcane. THe nature bond was there from their first encounter with CEnarius Chronicles tells us where their peaceful benevolent nature caught the love of the demi-god and he took an interest in guiding them. This went well until they became addicted to the arcane, which means there was a long period where love of nature, love of arcane and love of Elune were harmoniously in existence, and this is what their empire was built based on. This went pear shaped when Azshara became obsessed (arcane addiction), fascinated by the well and believing they had only scratched the surface. But as time went on she got consumed by it to the point where she invites the demons.

At this point they are mostly arcane obsessed, Malfurion is a pariah in his home city of Suramar because he objects to the lifestyle behaviour of what his people have become. Without the arcane to use (and with help from being bonded to Nordrassil) the night elves are able to live without the use thanks to the tree and new found purpose and their nature love side is the only side you can see.

My point is the nature love was ALWAYS there, you see it in the nightborne in Suramar, though the twisting the arcane obsession has caused is also apparent. Even the high elves you are shown have a lot of love for nature, the new kingdom they built was much closer to the original night elf empire before crazy arcane obsession took place, and while eventually the high elves did develop arcane addiction, it was NEVER arcane obsession like the highborne and nightborne had. SAdly people don't know their night elf lore, far more familiar with blood elf lore. Point is, nature has always been a core part of the elves. The night elves have the extreme in nature via the druids, and the arcane via the highborne and the divine via the priests, but with an arcane core, benevolent nature and love for nature, and bound by the goddess, - the arcane, nature and divine are the 3 core parts of them and where 3 strong identities emerge amognst them.

This is why you have 3 night elven groups amongst the night elves (highborne, druids, priests). You see similar with the high elves but in a very different way. THe nightborne are a sub-group, arcane is the only thing there, but in time, i'm sure they will develop others, I can see druidsm and priesthood rising strongly in them.

As for the pictures you posted, that was early concept art of what the night elves COULD have been like, blizzard ditched that and went with the high civilization, pristine arcane empire that experiences great tragedy and forces a group of survivors to adopt a totally natural lifestyle to prevent an evil. It opens their story at the end of this long vigil period - presumably world of warcraft and subsequent games would tell how they will develop.

POint is that is not the night elf in those pictures, and I'm glad it isn't, what they came up with was so much better. If that had been the night elf, I never would have fallen in love with them so - the current is far superior because it has a mixture of everything rather than pidgeon holing them into one area.

- - - Updated - - -

The big problem when every one/culture has kind of every facet of every thing then there's nothing what really separates them the rest.
In my eyes the biggest problem with the alliance races is that they ended up as some shade of human.
Where's the fun when the only difference between cultures is how they look in the end?
If the night elves would return to Suramar they would just become another shade of night borne with a small touch of nature.
If you want civilised elves in big cities go play horde, they already got two to chose from with the next expansion.

ONce again, I find myself agreeing with some of what you say, but not all. You're right that they have been written in wow as a shade of human because they seem to have been relegated to sidekicks and yes people doing everything the humans do and only showing up in the story as support cast whereas in WC3 they were major players.

However, about Suramar, nightborne are night elves, nightborne are a part of what the night elves embody, the arcane part. Night elves moving into Suramar won't make night elves a shade of nightborne, because what the nightborne have is already and has always been a part of the night elves. THe highborne amongst the night elves are exactly that, and all but the druids amongst the night elves I would imagine would quite enjoy returning to their home, especially without the worries of arcane addiction and the legion to stop them.

Nightborne are not unique because of the arcane usage, night elves have that in the mages and highborne, nor are they unique because of Suramar, it was the city all the night elves come from and they build that sort of thing. They are unique because of their own particular story of the time under the shield and Elisande heading over to the legion. They are a sub-set of night elf highborne available on the horde. Just like high/void elf are a sub-set of blood elf that are available on the horde.

The BLood elf are the main group, they have the wider range, the assets, the full composition. Splinter groups like the High elves and the void elves are a part or aspect of the blood elves that are on the alliance.

The same for the nightborne. The night elves are the bigger and wider group, having druid communities, arcane communities (shen'dralar, Farondis, moonguard), priesthood commiunities, and Illidari too, the nightborne are sub-group, splinter group available on the other faction, just like in the high/void elf situaiton.

Both nightborne and void elves are smaller specific specialised communities that are subsets of their larger group who are largely aligned to the opposite faction. For the Thalassian elves they tend to hate the guys on the other faction. I have made the point that this doesn't need to be the case for the Night group, but it would seem blizzard is going to go all binary on this one too.

People accurately make the point that the nightborne can stand fully with the horde, but Suramar the city doesn't necessarily need to. But they can relax, because it will be.

[Techno-Druid]

I don't want pre-Sundering night elves to come back, they already exist in an advanced form as Thalassian elves and in a relatively unmodified form as Nightborne.

I like the eco-centric Celtic/Japanese culture WC3 nelves had, it was unique and separated them from the other races.

[Yorimar]

Right now as that poster said, the biggest obstacle in the way of Night elves taking their rightful place in the Alliance is the humans. Give the humans a crushing defeat, have the light fail them or just have them fall behind, no strong or agile enough, or wise enough to deal with a threat , and then have the night elves come in and grab them by the shoulders and pull them up.

i thought Tyrande was the biggest obstacle? i seriously hate her, even more after legion.. i dont mind any night elves getting a special story but scrap the bitch :P

[Techno-Druid]

Sometimes I wonder if the current lore team ever played W3.

Yeah, which is quite sad considering that night elves might be one of the most developed races (as in having detailed info about their culture and such) in Warcraft. It's what made me so happy roleplaying a night elf...only to find that 97% of nelf roleplayers play them as purple humans or sindarin elves...

[Plehnard]

......

Stop wanting the old Kaldorei empire back. It's gone and it is good that way. Even the trolls aren't that delusional.

The big mistake Blizzard made was giving us only one elven faction in vanilla, resulting in a terrible wash down of the former night elves to please to more moderate elven fans. All this crying probably wouldn't be that much if there was an alternative from the beginning with the blood elves and more savage night elves from the start. Now they are stuck with a part of people that basically want an all in one group which is bloody stupid considering there will be 4(!) different playable groups soon. (5 different groups if you count in the unplayable high elves)

The only ones of those 4/5 who really stick out of the pack at the moment are the void elves. Sin'dorai and Shal'dorei are almost the same already so it's not time to make the nigh elves more "diverse" with big beautiful cities in their faction because that would bring them closer to the former, making the overall view of those 4 cultures even more bland.
The right way to make relations more interesting from a story standpoint is to increase their differences and that would be to up the bond with nature and religion for the night elves because that's a thing the rest is missing.

The night elves will lose their only bigger city to an overwhelming force. In times like those cultures always tended to resort to asymmetrical warfare and to a degree fanaticism, not into building new targets for their enemies or even bonding with them in their hunky-dory beautiful cities.

[Deleted]

Right now as that poster said, the biggest obstacle in the way of Night elves taking their rightful place in the Alliance is the humans. Give the humans a crushing defeat, have the light fail them or just have them fall behind, no strong or agile enough, or wise enough to deal with a threat , and then have the night elves come in and grab them by the shoulders and pull them up.

Or just kill the annoying Tyrande (and maybe Malfurion) and make someone more competent the Night elf Leader.

Shandris Feathermoon would be a great leader of Darnassus (she was in this position in the Stormrage novel) I'ts about time we get some new characters in.

[Beloren]

Stop wanting the old Kaldorei empire back. It's gone and it is good that way. Even the trolls aren't that delusional.

The big mistake Blizzard made was giving us only one elven faction in vanilla, resulting in a terrible wash down of the former night elves to please to more moderate elven fans. All this crying probably wouldn't be that much if there was an alternative from the beginning with the blood elves and more savage night elves from the start. Now they are stuck with a part of people that basically want an all in one group which is bloody stupid considering there will be 4(!) different playable groups soon. (5 different groups if you count in the unplayable high elves)

The only ones of those 4/5 who really stick out of the pack at the moment are the void elves. Sin'dorai and Shal'dorei are almost the same already so it's not time to make the nigh elves more "diverse" with big beautiful cities in their faction because that would bring them closer to the former, making the overall view of those 4 cultures even more bland.
The right way to make relations more interesting from a story standpoint is to increase their differences and that would be to up the bond with nature and religion for the night elves because that's a thing the rest is missing.

The night elves will lose their only bigger city to an overwhelming force. In times like those cultures always tended to resort to asymmetrical warfare and to a degree fanaticism, not into building new targets for their enemies or even bonding with them in their hunky-dory beautiful cities.

I'm really not sure his desire for the kaldorei arcane empire to be a part of the night elves is any less valid than your desire for it not to be. The biggest difference between both of you is that the Kaldorei are big enough to have both elements, seeing they operate in segregated groups based on their disciplines - whereas with yours they only get to be one way which isn't that great and understandably boring.

When a race gets no development, know that blizzard has really abandoned them. Can you imagine blizz leaving the Orcs to just be warrior culture, or the blood elves to be only arcane or the dwarves only mining? It would be insatiably boring , or all there was to the forsaken was plagues. No thank you. And while the nightborne are only arcane, they are not a full culture, they are a subset of the kaldorei culture, as void elves are of the Thalassian culture, which has many veins.

Also you can distinguish a group in other ways than the type of magic. Most distinctions are political, ideological, moral. The beauty of wow is he said is that no major race has just one thing, night elves are supposed to have covered the entire world, they're not going to be one-trick ponies, it's unrealistic, they would be one of the most powerfully diverse groups. if THEY ARE TO BE BIG, THEY CAN'T JUST BE ONLY DRUIDISM AND NATURE TO THEM, IT SHOUDL BE A PART OF THEM IN EVERYTHIGN,A S THE ARCANE SHOUDL BE AND THE DIVINE.

[Plehnard]

.., night elves are supposed to have covered the entire world....

And that's right there where the mistake lies. Today's night elves aren't the Kaldorei empire, they are only one specific group of them, like the night borne and like the high borne are. They all had their development in the last 10 thousand year that brought them further apart from each other. You guys want the diversity of the empire back without realizing that a lot of that culture does not belong to the current night elves any more. They changed their ways after the wars of the ancients and there was no good reason to go back.

[Aeula]

The Night Elves lost their individuality the second they sold themselves to a Human ‘high king’.

Tyrande and Malfurion need dropping. Maybe not killed (Their cringe-filled and unintentionally hilarious dialogue is the only thing that got me through Legion’s abysmal levelling) but thrown out in their hides and left to fend for themselves by the rest of the Kaldorei at the behest of a new, charismatic leader who is willing to tell the humans to fuck off every now and then and do a little chest thumping to show their people as individuals rather than servants.

Maybe Tyrande and Malfurion can show up later on as beggars in some Human township to offer some more comic relief without it coming at the expense of their entire race.

Oh and fuck all that ‘power of friendship’ shite in the OP’s quote. Elves will never get along and nor should they. I’d rather not see WoW degrade any further towards a Saturday morning cartoon.

[Plehnard]

The Night Elves lost their individuality the second they sold themselves to a Human ‘high king’.

Tyrande and Malfurion need dropping. Maybe not killed (Their cringe-filled and unintentionally hilarious dialogue is the only thing that got me through Legion’s abysmal levelling) but thrown out in their hides and left to fend for themselves by the rest of the Kaldorei at the behest of a new, charismatic leader who is willing to tell the humans to fuck off every now and then and do a little chest thumping to show their people as individuals rather than servants.

Maybe Tyrande and Malfurion can show up later on as beggars in some Human township to offer some more comic relief without it coming at the expense of their entire race.

Oh and fuck all that ‘power of friendship’ shite in the OP’s quote. Elves will never get along and nor should they. I’d rather not see WoW degrade any further towards a Saturday morning cartoon.

Agree on this one. Tyrande has degraded too much in character to be saved in a decent way. It would be the best to get her out of the main game and put Shandris in position.

[Deleted]

Agree on this one. Tyrande has degraded too much in character to be saved in a decent way. It would be the best to get her out of the main game and put Shandris in position.

I'd love to see her killed and Shandris in her place. Ironically, one of the better characters Knaak handled, only to be brutally mishandled by Blizzard and their VO and Lore departments.

Honestly this idiot girl is more hysterical than Sylvanas.