Trump will REMOVE climate change from the list of national security threats

[Graeham]

No. trump needs to go down in history as the most idiotic and useless president of the U.S.
History needs to record that republicans elected him and all the damage that followed in his wake.

It wasn't just Republicans, though. Nor do all Republicans think alike or desire him as their leader, for that matter.

Trump's rise to power is also largely due to the major rival party pushing a candidate that a great many people distrusted and disliked. In addition to that, another candidate - Bernie - proved to be very popular yet ended up being screwed over and a lot of his followers voted for Trump out of spite.

As with many things related to politics it is rather nuanced and far from a black or white situation. If people don't want to see another situation like Trump or Brexit then they need to stop ignoring the bigger picture.

[Deathcries]

Explain the glacial scarring in Death Valley. Cause humans caused it am I right?

lol Orbitus changed his quote. Oh well.

[Graeham]

I've seen some scientists starting to worry that we're in the sixth mass extinction event, and humans are the cause this time. Species are apparently going extinct at an exponentially higher rate than they were before we came along.

The idea we can't have an impact on the weather when we had the whole "hole in the ozone layer" problem 20 years ago that, as I recall, led to a ban on CFCs and spray aerosols (at least in Australia) is somewhat short-sighted. It's not being egotistical to believe humanity can have an impact on the climate. Egotistical is believing we are above nature and won't suffer for throwing things out of balance.

The biggest issue we face as a species is arrogance and selfishness. It's pretty obvious that we have a negative effect upon the environment even putting aside the climate change issue - the ocean and other major bodies of water are full of all sorts of junk that harm wildlife and do not break down in a timely manner. Can people mitigate their effect upon the environment? Sure - but many people are not willing to endure the inconveniences that come with doing things differently...and even those who do make an effort to recycle or use less plastic can only do so much when the ultimate issue is greedy corporations who put profit above all else.

I'm wary of climate change not because I don't believe that it exists but because the most influential individuals speaking about it - namely certain celebrities and politicians - aren't really leading by example. They're asking for money, being paid to give speeches on the subject, setting up charities...and they're jetting across the world, spending and indulging excessively. I'm reminded of the way in which many of the same people urged others to open up their doors to refugees during the migrant crisis yet fell silent when they were asked why they weren't opening up their second homes or massive mansions for the same purpose.

So where does that leave regular people? I don't know. I try to be mindful of my effect upon the world around me, but like I said earlier - I can only do so much. Society needs to be broken down and rebuilt completely to truly tackle major issues efficiently but that isn't going to happen as it would impact profits and most people are too comfortable to endure such major changes to their lives. I'm the same way, really - I just want to live my life the best I can and focus on my friends, family and cat first and foremost.

[Endus]

Explain the glacial scarring in Death Valley. Cause humans caused it am I right?

lol Orbitus changed his quote. Oh well.

There's a natural cycle. We go from glacial periods into interglacial periods roughly every 80,000 years or so. We're at the top of an interglacial right now, at one of the warmest points in that cycle.

The thing is, that cycle is marked by a geologically rapid rise in temperature at the onset of an interglacial, where the temperature spikes up from the lowest point to a peak, and then it slowly cools off into the next glacial period (what people usually call an "ice age", but technically, as long as there are ice caps, it's an ice age).

The important words in that last sentence are "geologically rapid". Here's the last 5 interglacial cycles overlayed, as you can see, there's a fairly consistent warming pattern, in terms of warming rate at least;



The temperature warms about 9 degrees Celsius, total. But it does so over about 6,000-7,000 years. Splitting the difference, that's about one degree every 725 years (some cycles have gone on longer, but continued at the same basic rate, if you check the graph, and we're more focused on establishing that natural rate here).

Now, what's the anthropogenic warming trend look like? We're at about 0.8 degrees of warming over the last century. That's a rate ten times as fast as the "geologically rapid" natural cycle. Worse, that rate is accelerating; 2/3 of that warming has occurred since 1975, so the actual current rate is even more out of whack with the natural cycles.

And now I'll also remind you that this warming has kicked off at the warmest peak of this interglacial period. We should be peaking and starting to cool off, not seeing unnaturally fast warming, if natural cycles were to blame.

Nobody's claiming natural cycles don't occur. They occur so incredibly slowly that we'd never notice that they were happening. They are not comparable to what we're seeing today.

Your argument is akin to claiming that human-built dams can't cause flooding, because floods have happened for natural reasons at some point ever. It's just obviously wrong.

[Zaydin]

Dear rest of the world:

Please remember that a majority of voters voted for Hillary Clinton last year, not the Orange Anus currently defiling the Oval Office.

So Trumpanzees are not representative of the majority of Americans despite how obnoxious they are.

Signed,

Sane Americans

[Orbitus]

Explain the glacial scarring in Death Valley. Cause humans caused it am I right?

lol Orbitus changed his quote. Oh well.

I didn't change anything. And the glacial scarring has nothing to do with humans in Death Valley. I wouldn't be surprised if that happened millions of years ago before humans. And if you are saying that is your evidence that humans aren't causing Climate Change, then you really shouldn't speak up about things you know nothing about.

[Deathcries]

I didn't change anything. And the glacial scarring has nothing to do with humans in Death Valley. I wouldn't be surprised if that happened millions of years ago before humans. And if you are saying that is your evidence that humans aren't causing Climate Change, then you really shouldn't speak up about things you know nothing about.

Millions of years ago? I don't believe you know what you're talking about. Here I'll still humor this. What caused the glacial scarring?

[Draco-Onis]

I did not miss that part. The most tragic event which you describe is more than likely going to be a natural disaster such as a massive earthquake in California, which they are pretty much ignoring it all the time and continue to build and expand along fault lines. This type of disaster is nothing we can prevent, but is one we can prepare for. It is said, it is not a question of if a super major earthquake can happen there, but when. The people of Pompeii built a city beneath a volcano and paid the price and continue to live again there. Just another major disaster waiting to happen.

You can believe if you want to Hurricanes are caused by global warming. This is not something however, all scientist agree on. They are looked at still and classified as natural disasters.

Blue states like California are more prepared when it comes to zoning, building codes, safety measures and emergency plans than red states who think global warming is "fake news". And no one said hurricanes are caused by global warming just that they increase conditions for stronger and more frequent hurricanes.

[Cthulhu 2020]

Ok now link me a valid, peer-reviewed study that says we are not responsible for climate change. I’ll wait.

Isn't it cruel to tell them to link something that doesn't exist?

[Orbitus]

Millions of years ago? I don't believe you know what you're talking about. Here I'll still humor this. What caused the glacial scarring?

The glacier melting, but that has nothing to do with what is happening now. That happened naturally. Humans are speeding this cycle up. DRASTICALLY. But, as your posting history suggests, you don't care about facts.

[Deathcries]

The glacier melting, but that has nothing to do with what is happening now. That happened naturally. Humans are speeding this cycle up. DRASTICALLY. But, as your posting history suggests, you don't care about facts.

No. I don't care for paying higher electricity bills, shit getting more expensive, and nothing changing on the rising temperatures because countries like China, India, and Russia will use the opportunity to expand their empire using cheap dirty fuel, and leaving a bigger carbon footprint, while Americans get shit on, so you can feel good about yourself fucking your fellow Americans.

I know what you're going to say "But China agreed to change their carbon foot print in 10 years!" Let me ask you, who the fuck is going to enforce that?

I'll tell you what. Orbitus in 10 years I'm going to give you a million dollars. Believe me because I said I would, and you should take my word for it because you're "word retracted" *insert* Orbitus *insert*.

[Orbitus]

No. I don't care for paying higher electricity bills, shit getting more expensive, and nothing changing on the rising temperatures because countries like China, India, and Russia will use the opportunity to expand their empire using cheap dirty fuel, and leaving a bigger carbon footprint, while Americans get shit on, so you can feel good about yourself fucking your fellow Americans.

I know what you're going to say "But China agreed to change their carbon foot print in 10 years!" Let me ask you, who the fuck is going to enforce that?

I'll tell you what. Orbitus in 10 years I'm going to give you a million dollars. Believe me because I said I would, and you should take my word for it because you're "word retracted" *insert* Orbitus *insert*.

Yeah, that has NOTHING to do with what I said. And Solar and wind are being invested in heavily. Trump trying to save the coal jobs that are going to go away anyway, is fucking retarded.

[Deleted]

Trumps demented mind can't comprehend climate change so it's a liberal hoax

Im pretty sure its a Chinese hoax.

[tyrlaan]

Trump is, wait for it, an idiot.

There are literally members of the military who have advised and/or spoken out about the national security risks of climate change. Coastal bases, for example, have a serious problem looming on their doorsteps. But hey, let's just say it's not a problem. After all, I'm pretty sure the "close your eyes" method is a sound strategy.

I'm wary of climate change not because I don't believe that it exists but because the most influential individuals speaking about it - namely certain celebrities and politicians - aren't really leading by example. They're asking for money, being paid to give speeches on the subject, setting up charities...and they're jetting across the world, spending and indulging excessively. I'm reminded of the way in which many of the same people urged others to open up their doors to refugees during the migrant crisis yet fell silent when they were asked why they weren't opening up their second homes or massive mansions for the same purpose.

So where does that leave regular people? I don't know. I try to be mindful of my effect upon the world around me, but like I said earlier - I can only do so much. Society needs to be broken down and rebuilt completely to truly tackle major issues efficiently but that isn't going to happen as it would impact profits and most people are too comfortable to endure such major changes to their lives. I'm the same way, really - I just want to live my life the best I can and focus on my friends, family and cat first and foremost.

This is a highly unfortunately reason to take issue with climate change. The actions of the individual, such as reducing your carbon footprint, recycling, and all those "you can be part of the solution" steps that are drilled into our heads have such a minuscule impact on the environment when measured against the impact of companies. Comparing individual responsibility for a carbon footprint to handling a refugee crisis is basically a false equivalence.

If people want to get serious about fighting climate change, corporations need to change. Stop dancing around the death of the coal industry (and for god's sake, actually help coal miners find a new role in the workplace or something), break the stranglehold on oil and gas in the auto industry, get serious about stopping factory pollution, etc.

Good, climate change wasn't real in the way the lefties imagine it to be. It's not an issue

We have nothing to do with warming the climate

Hey mr. state's rights, aren't conspiracy theories against forum rules? I mean seriously, you have to work really damn hard to think climate change is fake.

[Felya]

Im pretty sure its a Chinese hoax.

You do understand that calling it a hoax, just means you don’t understand? But, calling it a Chines hoax, makes you Trump sycophant.

- - - Updated - - -

Hey mr. state's rights, aren't conspiracy theories against forum rules? I mean seriously, you have to work really damn hard to think climate change is fake.

He literally has a thread on reddit about how stupid he makes Americans look.

[Mayhem]

I saw one ( from the US National Meteorology Service ) explaining they are caused primary by the phenomenon El Nino of the Pacific Ocean warm sections. And the conditions this year were perfect for them to form.

Hurricanes forming in the atlantic ocean are caused by warm sections of the pacific ocean? Well that's something i haven't heard yet.

[Deleted]

You do understand that calling it a hoax, just means you don’t understand? But, calling it a Chines hoax, makes you Trump sycophant.

Climate change is indeed real, but Trump thinks its a hoax made by the Chinese and not liberals.

[Sky High]

Well if you’re worldview is abortion and GAAAYZZ are why we have natural disasters then this stance makes total sense.

[Deianeira]

Ok now link me a valid, peer-reviewed study that says we are not responsible for climate change. I’ll wait.

Sadly he would'nt know what a peer-reviewed study was if it bit him in the ass.

- - - Updated - - -

Trump is, wait for it, an idiot.

There are literally members of the military who have advised and/or spoken out about the national security risks of climate change. Coastal bases, for example, have a serious problem looming on their doorsteps. But hey, let's just say it's not a problem. After all, I'm pretty sure the "close your eyes" method is a sound strategy.



This is a highly unfortunately reason to take issue with climate change. The actions of the individual, such as reducing your carbon footprint, recycling, and all those "you can be part of the solution" steps that are drilled into our heads have such a minuscule impact on the environment when measured against the impact of companies. Comparing individual responsibility for a carbon footprint to handling a refugee crisis is basically a false equivalence.

If people want to get serious about fighting climate change, corporations need to change. Stop dancing around the death of the coal industry (and for god's sake, actually help coal miners find a new role in the workplace or something), break the stranglehold on oil and gas in the auto industry, get serious about stopping factory pollution, etc.




Hey mr. state's rights, aren't conspiracy theories against forum rules? I mean seriously, you have to work really damn hard to think climate change is fake.

I bet he must be furious about the portion of the Net Neutrality repeal that prohibits States to make their own NN legislation!

[Deletedaccount1]

Even if you are very worried about climate change, I think this is purely a symbolic gesture. I would care more about actual policy. I see progressives everywhere saying Trump's legacy will be reversed and he will be out of office in the next election cycle at the latest. Yet when he does something that a future president could instantly reverse, it is treated as though it were permanent.