What if you could target a single piece of loot?

[Eurytos]

What if, through some in-game interface, you could target a specific item? It's basically loot protection for any item, but specific to one item at a time. And with a progress bar that you could see how much progress youre making toward that specific item.

If you loot the item before your progress bar is full, you can change your targeted item at a cost of a portion of the progress made toward the old item.

Any available item in game, you can target. And you can target it at any ilvl. But, if you target an item that is from content that is more difficult than the content you currently can complete, then it will take longer to fill up the progress bar.

It's not a good feeling to never get that really good trinket for your spec, or to never get that last tier piece, or to never get a weapon off the last boss, or, and I think this is just as legitimate, you want that one piece that completes an xmog set.

I don't think its crazy to have a system that allows you to get a specific item. Random loot is only fun for so long. When you constantly fail to get the item you want, or you get loot over and over that you simply dont need, its not fun.

[jearle]

Or they could just get rid of the Arcanocrystal? It is absolutely stupid how many people farm Arghus just for a 1 in 100 or whatever shot at this stupid item at 910 item level.
I guess you could call that content since people are still doing those silly world quests just to get 650 shards to play the lottery.

This concept doesnt make sense unless all items in the game were on a vendor somewhere so you could gain a currency to buy said item.

I will repeat not for the last time, Titanforging in its current form just needs to go, it is a shit system.

[Nemesquish]

I honestly think with an Item like Arcano, they should just make it cost like 10000 shards to buy, call it a day. Maybe add a few more trinkets like Chaos Talisman or VH trinkets that dont really have a great chance to drop other than chest. But just the idea of Arcano alone for some specs is dumb.

IE Yes, I do think SOME items should be target-able, but not all(Never anything from raids)

[Deleted]

Actual I like the idea. Maybe a fixed progress isn't the best way, but a bad luck protection would be nice. You still have to do the content to get the item and don't just get free lot, but you don't have to kill boss week after week after week and still making no progress towards your favorit item. Just increase your dropchance for this item with every kill by x%.

[Wondercrab]

While this specific idea might be a bit too much, the game did used to have a pretty healthy version of this in the form of justice/valour items. Right now the universal PvE currency (artifact power) is incredibly unrewarding and limited in its value, while the currencies used for purchasing gear are only rewarded from niche activities and still don't provide guaranteed results due to the random nature of tokens.

[Enrif]

as a transmog hunter who often resets a single dungeon for a single items until i'm locked out for an hour. I whole heartily support this idea!
though i would add that you can set one target per dungeon/raid so you are not punished for doing another dungeon/raid while waiting for the daily/weekly reset

[Eurytos]

While this specific idea might be a bit too much, the game did used to have a pretty healthy version of this in the form of justice/valour items. Right now the universal PvE currency (artifact power) is incredibly unrewarding and limited in its value, while the currencies used for purchasing gear are only rewarded from niche activities and still don't provide guaranteed results due to the random nature of tokens.

I guess I didnt even realize I was describing a form of currency, like the old badge system.
But yeah, I guess that is what I'm asking for, except that the loot table would be all loot in game, and the costs would fluctuate based on the ilvl you want to buy. Likewise, you get more currency per boss kill on harder content, thereby allowing faster purchases for those doing the hard(er) stuff.

It's a single pve currency like Marks of Honor. You can buy old gear, new gear, just the xmog package if you want, etc.

What was the reasoning Blizz gave for removing this feature? Anyone remember?
It still sorta exists in the form of Timewalking badges, but nothing for current gear nor has it ever included the entire loot table, even if only for xmog purposes, but I dont see any hard and fast reasons why it couldnt include it all, presuming of course that at least a comparable amount of time is invested as to actually raiding for it, just that youve been unlucky.

I've got a piece of t4 that I've been trying to get for, literally, 60+ Maiden kills. Thats over a full year of old Kara runs. Sure, they arent hard now, but it still takes time running around in these expansive instances.

Anyway, I'd still like to hear others thoughts, and criticisms.

[Wondercrab]

What was the reasoning Blizz gave for removing this feature? Anyone remember?
It still sorta exists in the form of Timewalking badges, but nothing for current gear nor has it ever included the entire loot table, even if only for xmog purposes, but I dont see any hard and fast reasons why it couldnt include it all, presuming of course that at least a comparable amount of time is invested as to actually raiding for it, just that youve been unlucky.

Honestly, I think it's because they've realised that randomised loot drives people to play more on average than they would otherwise. WoW has always worked on this baisc Skinner box philosophy, but they've been pushing it a lot harder in Legion. You can see this trend reflected in the games industry as a whole with lootboxes replacing more traditional progression systems as more and more companies realise that you can draw more time/money out of players than they're otherwise willing to spend if you randomise rewards rather than making them consistent.

I don't even think this is a wholly cynical move on Blizzard's part, since they do genuinely seem to be fans of random rewards (and they are undeniably fun for a lot of people), but part of me thinks they're looking at the metrics, seeing "people play longer/engage with content more if the rewards are random", and then doubling down on that idea. The gear tokens we can buy now are a great example of this. In the past they would've been justice/valour items that were one and done, but with the random rolls and the possibility of titanforging players are incentivised to keep buying these items long after they've stopped being default upgrades.

The real risk with the route they're going down now is conflating player behaviour with player enjoyment. It's really, really easy to design a system in an MMO that players keep engaging with out of a feeling of necessity or obligation rather than because they find it fun, and I think Legion has really started to push the boundaries on this. WoW is at its healthiest, I feel, when there is a consistently grindable source of loot (the way justice/valour worked) alongside randomised drops. It's kind of a best of both worlds situation.

[Eurytos]

Honestly, I think it's because they've realised that randomised loot drives people to play more on average than they would otherwise. WoW has always worked on this baisc Skinner box philosophy, but they've been pushing it a lot harder in Legion. You can see this trend reflected in the games industry as a whole with lootboxes replacing more traditional progression systems as more and more companies realise that you can draw more time/money out of players than they're otherwise willing to spend if you randomise rewards rather than making them consistent.

I don't even think this is a wholly cynical move on Blizzard's part, since they do genuinely seem to be fans of random rewards (and they are undeniably fun for a lot of people), but part of me thinks they're looking at the metrics, seeing "people play longer/engage with content more if the rewards are random", and then doubling down on that idea. The gear tokens we can buy now are a great example of this. In the past they would've been justice/valour items that were one and done, but with the random rolls and the possibility of titanforging players are incentivised to keep buying these items long after they've stopped being default upgrades.

The real risk with the route they're going down now is conflating player behaviour with player enjoyment. It's really, really easy to design a system in an MMO that players keep engaging with out of a feeling of necessity or obligation rather than because they find it fun, and I think Legion has really started to push the boundaries on this. WoW is at its healthiest, I feel, when there is a consistently grindable source of loot (the way justice/valour worked) alongside randomised drops. It's kind of a best of both worlds situation.

I agree, specifically with the grindable loot source. I've got no issue whatsoever with raiding being the most efficient way of getting the best gear. But, because things are random, and maybe there is a nice curve that shows all the items dropping at the appropriate rate...but that doesn't many diddly squat for the individual player. As an individual, you could go weeks, months, your entire time playing a game not getting a specific item that you want, and I'm not even talking about rare mounts, I'm talking about regular loot. Or, as I pointed out previously, you could get the same exact piece of loot over and over.

But, I can also see this from Blizz's point, though I think there is an answer to it too. The last raid of an expac is generally where this comes to a head. Say the last raid lasts a year or more, and I've grinded out ALL the gear I want, and there is still a few months before the new expac...I may unsub for a bit. However, if I still need that gear, I might still play. The obvious solution is to not have such a long last raid, but I understand the consequences of that too, there are only so many hours in a day, and devs can only produce so much content, etc. etc.

But, as you said, is me playing those extra few months trying to get a random drop that much fun for me? I believe that the long term health of the game is better when I can grind and get random drops through raiding.

[Xeranath]

They decided to focus on random loot because it feels more ‘exciting’ to the player, if you believe that.

I miss the Valor system from WoD. Bring that back instead of titanfudge please.

[Eurytos]

Here's the thing, this will make getting BiS extremely easy, and pretty much the biggest replay factor of your main is optimisation, I only do HC, and my DK main needs legs and lego trinket and he's gonna be BiS unless I want to farm titanforges/ go mythic (neither of these things are what my goal in WoW is) - once you "finish" gearing your char for that tier, it suddenly becomes very boring and you have no reason to play it

Depends what you mean by easy. Mythic bosses are hard for most, heroic hard for some, normal hard for a few. But I guess they could be considered easy if thats your progression level. Also, why is being able to buy a few items over the life of a raid any different than the luckiest person in your raid that gets all her gear before anyone else? Does she up and quit, does she stick around to help everyone else? IS there no interest in trying harder difficulties once most of the raid is optimized for a lower difficulty? If you clear mythic once, is there any reason to get more gear? These are a lot of hypotheticals that I dont think everyone has the same answer for.

Nonetheless, it would be the time constraint thats really "hard" in terms of getting a desired item. Lets just say it takes 5 weeks of killing every heroic boss in order to purchase a heroic item. Thats not an insignificant amount of time to invest for a single item. Maybe you only need 15 weeks to get the three drops you're missing. Maybe someone else is unluckier than you, and they need 25 weeks to optimize. Maybe, and there is not an insignificant amount of people who go the whole year without getting every BiS item, so it takes them 50 weeks...is your guild still raiding at that point?

These are all questions that each individual has to answer for themselves, and the questions exist regardless of having such a loot protection system in game or not. I'm sure my guild will take a break between the end of our progression through heroic ToS and the start of the next expac. We may get a mythic boss or two, but not significant progression in there. And I would bet all my gold that when we take our break waiting on BfA, some few people in the guild will not have gotten every item they wanted.

Had this system existed, maybe we still raid the same length of time before we burn out, but also maybe we got a few extra mythic bosses down because everyone in the guild was fully optimised.

I think there is merit for a system that allows for acquiring specifically targeted items from a raid. And that the good reasons outweigh the bad. I simply disagree with Blizz that random loot alone is best. A combination would be best, imo.

- - - Updated - - -

They decided to focus on random loot because it feels more ‘exciting’ to the player, if you believe that.

I miss the Valor system from WoD. Bring that back instead of titanfudge please.

I agree. I'd rather a system that I can target a higher ilvl item than for the item to be randomly higher ilvl. It is a worse feeling to get a higher ilvl item that you cannot use, than to get a repeat item of the same ilvl that you cannot use. Even worse, is HOPING of a lower ilvl item because it is better than your higher ilvl item you've equipped.

Give me random loot, its great, its fun when I get something I can use. But also, give me an option to get better gear that is not random, but that still requires me to put in the same(if not a little more) effort to achieve it. and if I truly want a higher ilvl item than the content I can complete...make it take twice as long. Whatever. I'd rather be fully decked out in my BiS heroic gear, than have a few mythic ilvl items but not be BiS.

The double option for loot just seems so obvious. Random has the chance to be the most efficient way, but it also is damning when youre unlucky.