1. #2201

  2. #2202
    Quote Originally Posted by Daemos daemonium View Post
    How is 20 years of living on. Planet as. Scaver where she clearly has to defend her self learning skills on the fly? She also gets saved by kylo after it’s shown she’s powerless before snoke.
    How does living on a planet for 20 years translate to light saber fighting and random force powers? She literally learns skills as the movie goes on (aka on the fly). She gets saved in the new movie by Ten, but we were talking A New Hope vs The Force Awakens.

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    Quote Originally Posted by draykorinee View Post
    Luke is a Mary Sue, Anakin is Amary Sue, Rey is a bigger Mary Sue. Why the fuck do people care. Its space magic FFS.
    no, yes, definitely

  3. #2203
    Merely a Setback PACOX's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by frogger237 View Post
    Luke must a been out more then the 5 days or so the films take place so a new lightside shoulda been "created" sooner. Plus Snoke must have existed during the time of the originals which means Luke must have had god tier powers back then since he was 1 against 3. This new "lore" is pretty stupid, hopefully its just lies.

    Well Luke was exceptional. He basically became a Master in a weekend and took on 2 of the most powerful Sith to ever live.


    Timeline of the balance of power:

    RotJ - Luke...Vader and Sidious
    Post RotJ - Luke...Snoke (just assuming)
    New Jedi Order - Luke and his students...Snoke
    Temple destruction - Luke...Kylo (in the middle)...Snoke
    Luke excommunicates himself - Rey (dormant)...Kylo (still in the middle...Snoke
    TFA (beginning) - Rey (awakening)...Kylo (dark less light)...Snoke
    TFA (Han dies) - Rey (woke)...Kylo and Snoke
    Last Jedi (before Luke dies) - Rey and Luke...Kylo
    End of Last Jedi - Rey and Others (kid at the end)...Kylo

    I personally think a little too much emphasis is being placed on the balance thing. It exists but its not 1:1 like that. Polarity throws the force out of whack too.
    Last edited by PACOX; 2017-12-19 at 11:10 PM.

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  4. #2204
    these new movies just don't even feel like star wars. they feel like something i'd watch on syfy channel instead.

    if only i were like elon musk rich. i'd buy it from disney and hire george as a consultant who would be highly respected.

  5. #2205
    Merely a Setback PACOX's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tromage View Post
    And do what? he was a coward and wanted nothing to do anymore with the Jedi.
    And we alrdy saw if he comes back he can just lightning kylo and kill him, at this point the force ghosts are over powered better leave them out the plot from now on.
    Uh can he? We saw Yoda do some a fancy trick on a planet saturated with the Force. Doubt they can do stuff like that anywhere else.

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  6. #2206
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fayolynn View Post
    How does living on a planet for 20 years translate to light saber fighting and random force powers? She literally learns skills as the movie goes on (aka on the fly). She gets saved in the new movie by Ten, but we were talking A New Hope vs The Force Awakens.

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    no, yes, definitely
    light saber fighting is pretty much the same as fighting with any thing else like her staff. force powers are easier to learn if your more powerful with the force and her and kylo are buff apparently.

    i would agree that rey is a mary sue but the saber fight makes plenty of sense if you don't ignore all the context of the fight.

  7. #2207
    Quote Originally Posted by Kirbypro View Post
    The Star Wars universe says so. Have you even seen the originals and the prequels? Did you even see the TFA? Being force sensitive is completely different from having force powers. Obiwan is a Jedi Master. Maz is a force sensitive old pirate. Pretty much all Maz did was give Rey the lightsaber.
    Wrong. Did leia ever receive jedi training? Yet she just force pulled herself to a ship. Did broom kid have jedi training? Yet he just force pulled a broom to himself. One assumes no one taught the boy. Yet he still did it. Pretty sure Quigon had a conversation with anakin about any strange things happening around him with he was upset or angry or was that harrypotter? Anyway its not in the movie but Maz does have force powers scenes were shot and its in the force awakens novel, but it got cut from the movie. A few storm troopers confront Her Han Chewie BB8 and Finn underground during the attack and Maz does her yoda thing and crushes them.

    This movie adds alot about how the force works and you people just are too pigheaded to accept it. You know when Finn tells Han "well use the force" and Han says "Thats not how the force works"

    This movie is telling you. "Here this is also how the force works" and your sitting there in you chair claiming it doesnt work that way when what the hell do you know. The Force is an unbelievable entity that works in mysterious ways. To claim you a person who doesnt even live in the universe and only has knowledge of the force from what has come before. How can you sit there and claim that only this small section of the universes canon force powers are legit and everything else is too far fetched to be true because someone hundreds of years ago said they required training to do it? Even when most training we have seen via movies has not been combat training, i mean when have we seen jedi practice with a lightsaber against an opponent? Most the training we see is Masters yoda and Obi wan telling luke to feel the energy of the force around them. Luke takes a while to get it while Rey picks it up alot faster. Why is this so wrong? They are two different people. Do you not learn to do things at different speeds than others? Is the speed of learning universal on this planet?
    Last edited by Zeek Daniels; 2017-12-20 at 12:58 AM.

  8. #2208
    Quote Originally Posted by Daemos daemonium View Post
    light saber fighting is pretty much the same as fighting with any thing else like her staff. force powers are easier to learn if your more powerful with the force and her and kylo are buff apparently.

    i would agree that rey is a mary sue but the saber fight makes plenty of sense if you don't ignore all the context of the fight.
    Except the extremely different point where the blade instead of being 50% of the weight of the sword/blade weighs nothing and can cut through 99% of the shit you run into.

    Also let someone WHO HAS ONLY VAGUELY HEARD OF THE FORCE literally mind control someone...
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  9. #2209
    Quote Originally Posted by Daemos daemonium View Post
    light saber fighting is pretty much the same as fighting with any thing else like her staff. force powers are easier to learn if your more powerful with the force and her and kylo are buff apparently.

    i would agree that rey is a mary sue but the saber fight makes plenty of sense if you don't ignore all the context of the fight.
    Fighting with different weapons is extremely different. Good with one doesn't mean good with all.

  10. #2210
    These new movies are just a shittier version of the original three, and it's disappointing. The "Rebels" have tech WAY below what they should, the New Order has tech way ABOVE what they should. There's no new Jedi Order, the New Republic is destroyed. The entire storyline makes the original storyline it's ripping off IRRELEVANT because it's EXACTLY WHAT THEY FOUGHT AND WON AGAINST.

    So, unless Rey begins a new Order and there's another secret, spoopy Sith emperor out there, after 9 there will be nothing to work with, because without Ren and Rey, the force should be at balance (emphasized by both of their HUGE strengths in the force, and Rey basically being a conduit for the light in response to Ren), because the galaxy was at a relative "peace" up until Snoke/Ren emerged.

    The prequels might get a lot of shit but I miss there really feeling like there's a war between the Jedi and the Sith, not the Rebels and the Empire.
    Last edited by La; 2017-12-20 at 01:51 AM.
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  11. #2211
    Quote Originally Posted by bledgor View Post
    Except the extremely different point where the blade instead of being 50% of the weight of the sword/blade weighs nothing and can cut through 99% of the shit you run into.

    Also let someone WHO HAS ONLY VAGUELY HEARD OF THE FORCE literally mind control someone...
    Hey guy. Do me a favor. Go grab a water bottle with two hands. Now swing it. Now go grab a pole or somthing thats like 3 feet long. Now swing it. Is the water bottle harder to swing yes or no? Now go watch Rey vs Kylo again and tell me who the more adept blade master is.

    People are so stupid. OMG because the weight isnt the sword isnt the same as a regular sword its sooo much harder to wield. ABSOLUTE BULLSHIT. Your swinging a hilt and as you said it cuts 99% of things so essentially the blade isnt where. What then is the difference between wielding a lightsaber with the blade off vs on. NOTHING.

    you guys are so dumb.

    Quote Originally Posted by La View Post
    These new movies are just a shittier version of the original three, and it's disappointing. The "Rebels" have tech WAY below what they should, the New Order has tech way ABOVE what they should. There's no new Jedi Order, the New Republic is destroyed. The entire storyline makes the original storyline it's ripping off IRRELEVANT because it's EXACTLY WHAT THEY FOUGHT AND WON AGAINST.

    So, unless Rey begins a new Order and there's another secret, spoopy Sith emperor out there, after 9 there will be nothing to work with, because without Ren and Rey, the force should be at balance (emphasized by both of their HUGE strengths in the force, and Rey basically being a conduit for the light in response to Ren), because the galaxy was at a relative "peace" up until Snoke/Ren emerged.

    The prequels might get a lot of shit but I miss there really feeling like there's a war between the Jedi and the Sith, not the Rebels and the Empire.
    Couple things maybe read the opening crawl of TFA?

    Anyway How is destroying the 2nd deathstar = total destruction of the empire? They never destroyed the empire they just usurped it. The empires fleets that were not at the deathstar and some that were at teh deathstar still survived and fought against the rebels for a time b4 they eventually left. The "New republic" was formed but was destroyed by the First Order. So why does the storyline of ep 6 become irrelevent when the empires fleets were never destroyed completely and people that sympathized with the empire still existed? Theres like 30 years of history between the movies.

    Let me put it this way. If England tomorrow declares war on the US. And after years of fighting finally takes the US back. Does that mean that our first revolution and the subsequent years of US sovereignty were irrelevant? Why would you think this way?

    Also the movie quite clearly tells you Rey is going to start a new Jedi order. When does it say this and who says this. Well first Yoda says it. He tills luke "They are what we grow beyond" Rey has to learn from lukes failure and create a new jedi order that does not fail. Luke says it to kylo "The rebellion is reborn today, The war is just beginning, and I will not be the last jedi." Hes telling kylo that Rey is the Jedi to lead the next generation of jedi. Then you have Leia. I cant actually remember what they say but essential Leia puts her hands on reys arms which are holding the two halfs of a broken lightsaber and she tells her to rebuild.

    As for there being nothing to work with now that Snoke is dead that is not true. The force seeks balance in all things. Not just Light and Dark. And Kylo is clearly the big bad of this series and always has been. Snoke was a tool for kylo to ascend to the throne hes always wanted.
    Last edited by Zeek Daniels; 2017-12-20 at 02:18 AM.

  12. #2212
    Quote Originally Posted by Zeek Daniels View Post


    This guy gets it. These are the same thoughts I have been expressing about this film. This film has sooo much to it and people are just not seeing it because they want to hate the film.



    Its really weird how people are upset that Luke died when we all know theres a 99% chance he comes back in the next film as a force ghost.
    ikr, but i get it. They wanted to see luke, the strongest jedi ever whos stronger than vader, or yoda or any other besides that one woman who was the force and just crazy cool fight snoke or him SHOW his power... but they didnt. Also he may just come back now through the force as alive not just a ghost because hes so damn strong. hes the star wars superman
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  13. #2213
    In the span of 14 days Finn betrayed and murdered people he had known his whole life, Poe found his BFF soulmate in Finn, Rey became a master Jedi, and in 13 hours Rose fell in love with the legendary Finn. The ability of the cast to have such powerful feelings for strangers and to master so many abilities is bad writing.

    The first movie should have been with Ben and his Twin sister training with Luke at the temple and watching as Ben fell into darkness, Han and Leia's relationship falling apart, and intelligence of a new order rising up at the other end of the galaxy to be what the empire once was. It would have used the original cast appropriately and would have slowly transitioned through their deaths as the new characters gained prominence. Instead we got shit movies where you can feel Disney in each and every scene.

  14. #2214
    Quote Originally Posted by Raptor With a Saber View Post
    ikr, but i get it. They wanted to see luke, the strongest jedi ever whos stronger than vader, or yoda or any other besides that one woman who was the force and just crazy cool fight snoke or him SHOW his power... but they didnt. Also he may just come back now through the force as alive not just a ghost because hes so damn strong. hes the star wars superman
    I wanted to see competent writing with few plot holes and a cohesive narrative, not a jumbled pile of shit filled with plot holes, that for some reason feels the need to shit over all the building points of 7.

    Quote Originally Posted by Coombs View Post
    In the span of 14 days Finn betrayed and murdered people he had known his whole life, Poe found his BFF soulmate in Finn, Rey became a master Jedi, and in 13 hours Rose fell in love with the legendary Finn. The ability of the cast to have such powerful feelings for strangers and to master so many abilities is bad writing.
    I loved how Rose talked about the legendary Finn, like where did that come from? How fast are these stories spreading when its been less then a year (also why does a Janitor that is what 23 years old know the layout of every Imperial ship)?

    Also why is the droid (BB-8) the best fighter in the Rebellion?
    Last edited by bledgor; 2017-12-20 at 02:24 AM.
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  15. #2215
    Quote Originally Posted by Coombs View Post
    In the span of 14 days Finn betrayed and murdered people he had known his whole life, Poe found his BFF soulmate in Finn, Rey became a master Jedi, and in 13 hours Rose fell in love with the legendary Finn. The ability of the cast to have such powerful feelings for strangers and to master so many abilities is bad writing.

    The first movie should have been with Ben and his Twin sister training with Luke at the temple and watching as Ben fell into darkness, Han and Leia's relationship falling apart, and intelligence of a new order rising up at the other end of the galaxy to be what the empire once was. It would have used the original cast appropriately and would have slowly transitioned through their deaths as the new characters gained prominence. Instead we got shit movies where you can feel Disney in each and every scene.
    How is it bad writing. Finns a f-ing coward. Of course he would betray those people. Not only did they kidnap him as a child and make him work his whole life and then make him kill people but dude wants to live man. What movie were you watching where that is bad writing? Also Finn saved Poes life. What do you want Poe to do? Hate the guy? Rey a master Jedi? How? She thinks the force is just about lifting rocks and controlling people. Did you even watch the 2nd movie? She has no idea what the force is. Hell the gag, which was funny as hell by the way, where luke tickles her and she actually thinks thats the force is proof enough she isnt a jedi master.

    The only thing bad is your interpretation of the events that took place.

  16. #2216
    Quote Originally Posted by Altrec View Post
    The impression I have watching the progression of his interviews is that he got reprimanded and told to tow the line.
    You're getting that impression because people are selectively editing those interviews. There are literally YouTube videos where Mark Hamill says "I initially didn't understand the direction Johnson was taking the character but..." and then cutting off the interview, under the title MARK HAMILL HATES THE LAST JEDI. The entire idea that they "reprimanded" or "coerced" him into putting a positive spin on the movie and the director is nonsense. He signed the contract to do the movie and got paid. That's it. No one is forcing him to do publicity, and you don't call someone "my guru" whose work you don't respect.

    The one thing he wanted was to pass the torch like Yoda, but that really didn't happen here. He basically did nothing. He was in the movie with the new generation and that is the extent of the passing of the torch as he pretty much didn't teach Rey anything.
    We clearly didn't see the same movie.

  17. #2217
    Quote Originally Posted by bledgor View Post
    I loved how Rose talked about the legendary Finn, like what? How fast are these stories spreading when its been less then a year (also why does a Janitor that is what 23 years old know the layout of every Imperial ship)?

    Also why is the droid (BB-8) the best fighter in the Rebellion?
    I'd have to watch them both back to back and do some math or wait for some geek to do it, but I'm fairly certain both movies only encompass a week or two in time. I get that it isn't too fair to come to that conclusion, but they wrote themselves into a corner when the started the second movie a few days after the last one ended. Rose went from doing maintenance to spy missions, and flying speeders in a ground attack. Of course Finn and her had a heart to heart 30 meters away from the enemy force on flat ground and then teleported to the base while carrying her. So I suppose we just have to let go and let Disney.

    I also found it strange that they said "God speed" many times.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zeek Daniels View Post
    How is it bad writing. Finns a f-ing coward. Of course he would betray those people. Not only did they kidnap him as a child and make him work his whole life and then make him kill people but dude wants to live man. What movie were you watching where that is bad writing? Also Finn saved Poes life. What do you want Poe to do? Hate the guy? Rey a master Jedi? How? She thinks the force is just about lifting rocks and controlling people. Did you even watch the 2nd movie? She has no idea what the force is. Hell the gag, which was funny as hell by the way, where luke tickles her and she actually thinks thats the force is proof enough she isnt a jedi master.

    The only thing bad is your interpretation of the events that took place.
    Being forced to fight doesn't mean you don't form relationships with your comrades. I know this is star wars and all and fuck space Nazi's, but to write a story that demonstrates only one side being capable of camaraderie is bad writing. Rey is very obviously written to be extremely powerful and bland so younger fans can insert themselves in her and be Star Wars consumers, and they keep creating new lore to push this narrative.

    The gag was out of character and out of place, like the rest of the humor in the movie.

  18. #2218
    Merely a Setback PACOX's Avatar
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    Saw a funny discussion on reddit where someone was going on about old "rules" being broken, mostly pertaining to how stuff works in space. How the Resistance bombers were dropping weighted bombs, how cannon fire was arching, etc. Then someone reminded them about how starfighters behave like airplanes, the explosions, MF sound in space.

    Sometimes you need to step back and remind yourself that SW never cared about real world physics, why would they suddenly start now?

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  19. #2219
    I found it fucked up that Poe probably killed more "rebel scum" than the empire did during that bombing run.

  20. #2220
    Merely a Setback PACOX's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coombs View Post
    I'd have to watch them both back to back and do some math or wait for some geek to do it, but I'm fairly certain both movies only encompass a week or two in time. I get that it isn't too fair to come to that conclusion, but they wrote themselves into a corner when the started the second movie a few days after the last one ended. Rose went from doing maintenance to spy missions, and flying speeders in a ground attack. Of course Finn and her had a heart to heart 30 meters away from the enemy force on flat ground and then teleported to the base while carrying her. So I suppose we just have to let go and let Disney.

    I also found it strange that they said "God speed" many times.

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    Being forced to fight doesn't mean you don't form relationships with your comrades. I know this is star wars and all and fuck space Nazi's, but to write a story that demonstrates only one side being capable of camaraderie is bad writing. Rey is very obviously written to be extremely powerful and bland so younger fans can insert themselves in her and be Star Wars consumers, and they keep creating new lore to push this narrative.

    The gag was out of character and out of place, like the rest of the humor in the movie.
    How was that gag out of place? Luke had turned into a cynical hermit and was showing her naive she is/was. On the humor, rewatch the series and tell me it isnt full of gags. Its like when people got mad about Vader's joke in RO but Vader (even as Anakin) was doing it in all the movies.

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