Dragonmaw Orc and Wildhammer Dwarf will allied races

[Syegfryed]

There is definitely a concern for breaking lore with most things. And numbers shouldn't be ignored. Though precedence does pretty much allow for us to even become the last living survivor of an ancient race considering the last couple of expansions (though it will have some problems, as will be noted in a bit). It would be simple for them to write in and create a little scenario or starting area for to explain it all. And much like seeing a thousand Ashbringers on the Broken Islands, story would dictate that we'd be the only one even if we have a raid full of them.
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,i know blizzard can do the hell they want, they can crete new lore to justify bullshit, im not saying they can't, im saying this should not be encouraged.

Lore and gameplay are different points of view, so even if you do something in you gameplay don't mean nothing in the general lore, thats pretty much the artifacts and the Garrisons.

Sure ruin the immersion, but at least most of times inlore will make sense, like i said, it is more worth to bring things who don't conflict in the current lore and the gameplay, let be more fluid( thats why we have Void and not high elves, part from the lore problems there is the gameplay problems)

[Geckoo]

These aren't really 'subraces', subraces were just a concept drawn up by fans. Allied races takes the idea of 'subraces' and turns it into a more sophisticated concept. These races are actually unique in concept and design, and differentiated from anything they take inspiration from.

I'm sorry that you don't see the benefit of allied races, but I certainly see them. They look interesting and I'm looking forward to creating these characters. They aren't meant to appeal to everyone, so if they don't to you then I'm sorry to hear it.

The entire point of allied races is so that Blizzard can add multiple new races instead of just one or two. The only way this is feasible is if they are taking advantage of existing models and/or animations, so if you were expecting 6 brand new races built from the ground up, then you are going to be disappointed by default.

Hey, i'm also excited about them. In fact, i'm not hyped about BfA, but i'm hyped about allied races.

My point is precisely that with the current concept they have for allied races, it's really hard that we can see more than one allied race for each existing race. When you consider that they work as a different race, then you also have to remember that you are limited to be only one kind of orc or one kind of dwarf with your character and in order to enjoy the allied races you unlock you'll need to either level up a different character or pay a race change.

That's when the idea of having several orc clans as allied race, or several trolls, dwarves, more elves... starts to become a burden for the game and the players, because the novelty is met with restrictions that don't really need to exist.

Wouldn't it be better if once you've unlocked Zandalari trolls as an allied race, you can just use their customization otpions when you create a new troll or even when you visit the barbershop? This would open up a lot more of space for them to add more troll 'allied races', we could have a lot of orc clans, all 3 dwarves...

[GRAMMARAXIS]

,i know blizzard can do the hell they want, they can crete new lore to justify bullshit, im not saying they can't, im saying this should not be encouraged.

Lore and gameplay are different points of view, so even if you do something in you gameplay don't mean nothing in the general lore, thats pretty much the artifacts and the Garrisons.

Sure ruin the immersion, but at least most of times inlore will make sense, like i said, it is more worth to bring things who don't conflict in the current lore and the gameplay, let be more fluid( thats why we have Void and not high elves, part from the lore problems there is the gameplay problems)

I agree with what you're throwing down. It's better to just go with what fits in the first place, rather than making convoluted changes or putting in races that just cause problems. Existing factions and races should be considered first and foremost before the creation of a different. This is why I have a distaste for Void Elves as a whole, as they just cause problems. They are very clearly a new race that was created after Argus, yet we're being dropped in level 20 content -- and the game's general text will still call us Heroes that did all of these amazing feats in the past (deeds enough to give us the Heart of Azeroth). Which means we either view 20-110 content as filler since it has no relevance to our characters (though they'll likely still call us the Heroes in text), or we start at level 110 to try and remedy this (but still have the matter of why Magni or Azeroth or even our own faction trusts us to be a thorn in the story making sense).

Not to be a "High Elf Activists", but we already had a High Elf faction that could very easy have a straggler that leveled 20-70, got a unique small series of quests regarding the Silver Covenant at 70, and then proceeded onto 70-110. Even if that faction as diminished since wrath, the whole straggler concept is highly believable and has little continuity flaws comparatively speaking. They will be the player character that goes through WoD and Legion without a timeline abnormality. Heck, they could even have become the void elves themselves after having this history, rather than the void elves just being Blood Elves.

Honestly, it would just be best to leave Elves out as a whole rather than creating an entirely new (yet another) Elf race that they even make fun of themselves in their flirts and /silly voice acting. They did it all solely for gameplay reasons and to make this look different, and nothing more. They could have gone down a route that actually had precedence and made sense rather than getting more complicated with all these time skips.

All of this just makes me agree whole-heartily that we shouldn't encourage things like Void Elves or races that only come into existence after 110 (the end part of this sentence being my own opinion). I don't trust them to write convincing and long stories in this regard.

[Hallowseve17]

I'm all for Wildhammer dwarves and Dragonmaw orcs as allied races. However, I feel like due to how many orc clans are affiliated with the Horde, the game may suffer from too many orc options, which would be unfair for the Alliance. Perhaps calling them "uncorrupted orcs" or "Draenor orcs" and adding the Dragonmaw as an option would work? The Dragonmaw have two or three distinct features from other orcs: dark skin (though the Blackrock are also gray), glowing yellow eyes and tattoos. I would play as one in a heartbeat, but I'd prefer they put all uncorrupted orcs into one allied race.

The Wildhammer dwarves are identical to Ironforge dwarves (the ones we play as), save for tattoos. However, I thought I read somewhere...Wowpedia I think, that Wildhammer dwarves are tanner and slightly larger than Ironforge dwarves. Blizzard can also create some unique hair and beard styles that capture the feeling of a Wildhammer, you know since they're wild, untamed and rather primitive.

[Thage]

Can you show official lorewise that ALL Dragonmaw sided with Garrosh and pretty much wiped out? Because I've shown my proofs that disproved your head canon.

It's not a head canon, it's working with what the game showed me. I don't PvP, so I missed Syegfryed's evidence below. It's almost like Blizzard is awful at making sure players have complete information--prior to going out of my way to find a prestige event video today, I had no idea the Dragonmaw had a presence in the Horde (because they didn't,) thus my use of the words, "I don't think there are any left in the Horde proper now." Because nowhere else ingame is the new Dragonmaw chieftain mentioned or given a noteworthy presence, not even a "Oh btw this guy's leading the Dragonmaw who joined in Vol'jin's rebellion." Hence my (now-readjusted) conclusion that the Dragonmaw had sided with Garrosh, leading to the clan being wiped out with Zaela's defeat in Blackrock Mountain.

not all dragonmaw allied wih Garrosh the prestige quest show the new chieftain is in the horde.

I stand corrected.

The tattoos, tribal hairstyles and beards are shared by all orcs, included the green ones. they should Just open the brown option to normal customization from orcs

I'd be fine with that, too.

[Hyde]

It's not a head canon, it's working with what the game showed me. I don't PvP, so I missed Syegfryed's evidence below. It's almost like Blizzard is awful at making sure players have complete information--prior to going out of my way to find a prestige event video today, I had no idea the Dragonmaw had a presence in the Horde (because they didn't,) thus my use of the words, "I don't think there are any left in the Horde proper now." Because nowhere else ingame is the new Dragonmaw chieftain mentioned or given a noteworthy presence, not even a "Oh btw this guy's leading the Dragonmaw who joined in Vol'jin's rebellion." Hence my (now-readjusted) conclusion that the Dragonmaw had sided with Garrosh, leading to the clan being wiped out with Zaela's defeat in Blackrock Mountain.

I stand corrected.

I'd be fine with that, too.

except that in WOD Zaela led Black Iron and Ironmarch Hordes, not Dragonmaw. Actually you missed my proofs which was posted pages ago, so you had been stuck with your head canon and assumed things.

[Thage]

The Wildhammer dwarves are identical to Ironforge dwarves (the ones we play as), save for tattoos. However, I thought I read somewhere...Wowpedia I think, that Wildhammer dwarves are tanner and slightly larger than Ironforge dwarves. Blizzard can also create some unique hair and beard styles that capture the feeling of a Wildhammer, you know since they're wild, untamed and rather primitive.

That's from the RPG which got thrown into the non-canon bin years ago, after White Wolf's contract with Blizz ended (when the declaration was made, Creative Development was blunt about it: while the Azeroth White Wolf designed was an enjoyable fantasy world that captured many elements of what made Warcraft enjoyable, it didn't match up with the Azeroth Blizzard was designing, and Metzen himself vocally disliked it). Where Wildhammers could differentiate themselves from Bronzebeards is with wilder hair/beards and racials. A Stormhammer active racial (maybe make it a nerfed-down version of Storm Bolt), a racial that lets them ride any flying mount without the training (but confined to the mount speed they're currently trained for and confined to ground travel if they haven't unlocked flight yet), that sorta thing.

[therealbowser]

The post was a joke (i mean... i even started with the Ghost Night Elves to make it obvious)

Note: Though the reason to say no to the Darkfallen is a little weak (i mean, the lack of Lich King was the thing that made the Valkyr part of the Horde, also most Dark Fallen where BE that joined with Illidan -before the whole Kiljaedan debacle with Kael-, so its not that weird of an idea to have them willing to join their people after they became free once again)

Sorry, it's hard to tell on these boards. People are going on about all sorts of odd things lately.

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Hey, i'm also excited about them. In fact, i'm not hyped about BfA, but i'm hyped about allied races.

My point is precisely that with the current concept they have for allied races, it's really hard that we can see more than one allied race for each existing race. When you consider that they work as a different race, then you also have to remember that you are limited to be only one kind of orc or one kind of dwarf with your character and in order to enjoy the allied races you unlock you'll need to either level up a different character or pay a race change.

That's when the idea of having several orc clans as allied race, or several trolls, dwarves, more elves... starts to become a burden for the game and the players, because the novelty is met with restrictions that don't really need to exist.

Wouldn't it be better if once you've unlocked Zandalari trolls as an allied race, you can just use their customization otpions when you create a new troll or even when you visit the barbershop? This would open up a lot more of space for them to add more troll 'allied races', we could have a lot of orc clans, all 3 dwarves...

Naturally, it would be easier on the wallet, but I really do like that they have unique racials. It makes them feel more unique than simply having a different skin.

Frankly I feel like this expansion would have been better suited to offering free race changes as an alternative to the free character boost that frankly a lot of people don't even use these days.

[Shuya1]

More Dwarves!! Dark Iron and Wildhammers and Frostborn, oh my!

And yes to those amazing Dragonmaw Orcs.

[Ranganathan]

More options? 3 Dwarven races...how is that more options...especially when you can practically replicate all 3 races with base dwarves? Yeah...because you know...there are so many Dwarf players out there.

Jesus fucking christ people on these forums then can't use even the most basic level of thought processes to realize that more of them same really isn't more.

I'm a dwarf player. I would play only dwarfs if given the chance. But dwarfs can't be my favorite class. Gimme dozens of dwarf options. Just do it smart instead of this stupid gated bullshit. Simply add the options to character creation.

Love to see Wildhsmmer as druids. Gryphon ground and flight travel form. Leopards and polar bears. Tattoo customization that persists into forms. Mmm. Yummy.

[Hyde]

I'm a dwarf player. I would play only dwarfs if given the chance. But dwarfs can't be my favorite class. Gimme dozens of dwarf options. Just do it smart instead of this stupid gated bullshit. Simply add the options to character creation.

Love to see Wildhsmmer as druids. Gryphon ground and flight travel form. Leopards and polar bears. Tattoo customization that persists into forms. Mmm. Yummy.

Bears and Cats with BEARDS and FEATHERS!

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More Dwarves!! Dark Iron and Wildhammers and Frostborn, oh my!

And yes to those amazing Dragonmaw Orcs.

Yes MOAR! WE FITE!

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Yes! yes we do... may i have this dance?

NO DANCE JUST FIGHT!

[josykay]

I would be more surprised if they didn't because the current council of the Three Hammers consist of Bronzebeard, Dark Iron and Wildhammer.

And as the Gryphon Riders of Khaz Modan, they have been a staple as units to the Alliance, it would be unwise not to once again recruit the Wildhammer. As for the Orc, the Dragonmaw is needed for air superiority as well, and also because their magic that can even subdue dragons.

How much time has passed since Cata now? Because the Council of Three Hammers is only a placeholder government until little Dragan Thaurissan is grown up to rule... So I am not really sure, how much time has passed already. And it was already an affront against the Dark Irons, since Moira is the rightful heir of Magni, and Dragan is her heir.
And what would happen then? Wildhammers and Bronzebeards will clinge on their power? Civil war again?

[Hyde]

How much time has passed since Cata now? Because the Council of Three Hammers is only a placeholder government until little Dragan Thaurissan is grown up to rule... So I am not really sure, how much time has passed already. And it was already an affront against the Dark Irons, since Moira is the rightful heir of Magni, and Dragan is her heir.
And what would happen then? Wildhammers and Bronzebeards will clinge on their power? Civil war again?

That's the future problem. Let future dwarves squabble about the throne.

[MrDragon]

How much time has passed since Cata now? Because the Council of Three Hammers is only a placeholder government until little Dragan Thaurissan is grown up to rule... So I am not really sure, how much time has passed already. And it was already an affront against the Dark Irons, since Moira is the rightful heir of Magni, and Dragan is her heir.
And what would happen then? Wildhammers and Bronzebeards will clinge on their power? Civil war again?

It's been four years since Cata, Moira got preggers in Classic. Dragan is... 7ish years old now depending on how long Dwarven pregnancy takes.
I assume it'll be some time before we get to see him do anything noteworthy unless Dwarves age freakishly fast, which I assume they do not. I assume Dwarves if anything age slower than humans do because in fantasy settings most races like Dwarves and Elves age slower than humans do. (despite the lack of evolutionary sense that makes, or just practical sense.)

[Deleted]

I would be surprised if they added a second dwarf allied race before giving the other races their "pair".

Not more surprised than giving the players Dark Iron Dwarves before the much more requested Wildhammer Clan.

[want my Slimjim]

Again, there is zero proof that there's any amount of Dragonmaw worth mentioning. Just because he's there, doesn't mean there's more.

It absolutely means there's more.

[Alvito]

3 Dwarf races for alliance, nope.

[Bigby]

Again, there is zero proof that there's any amount of Dragonmaw worth mentioning. Just because he's there, doesn't mean there's more.

As far as we knew, we'd wiped the Illidari out completely during TBC.

Numbers don't really matter so long as Blizzard want to bring them back.

[Hyde]

As far as we knew, we'd wiped the Illidari out completely during TBC.

Numbers don't really matter so long as Blizzard want to bring them back.

Please don't post rational and logical statements. It will hurt its thinking machine.

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3 Dwarf races for alliance, nope.

3 dwarf races. YES. Fight me!

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It absolutely means there's more.

That logical conclusion might get its pie-hole to foam.

[Deleted]

I would be surprised if they added a second dwarf allied race before giving the other races their "pair".

I wouldnt, since Night Elves (Too much elves currently), Worgen and Gnomes dont really have any interesting and obvious choices for a sub-race.