Genn doesn't care about the Alliance.

[Darktbs]

The horde retreating is not the same as an outright betrayal. The alliance has NO IDEA why the horde pulled back. But Genn assumes it was treachery because he's a hateful git. If the horde was REALLY focused on betraying the Alliance, why didn't they immediately follow up with an attack on Stormwind or some other Alliance location?

Like i said, Genn wasn't the only one that assumed the Horde betrayed them, he was the only that fought back.

And they have reasons to do.

>They were fighiting together
>The HOrde Left
>Their King died and they almost died as well.

You are looking at the situation like a dectetive case that was already been resolved, this happened because of this and therefor he killed it.It obvious.

When in reality, for them, all they have are dead people and evidence to assume many things.

As to why they didn't attack?Because the Legion was in Azshara(right next to Orgrimmar) and Hillsbrad and the Barrens just as why the Alliance didn't retaliate because the Legion was attacking Dun Morogh and Westfall.

Either faction had to take care of their own territory before doing anything;Thats basic strategy.

Really? You're going to make this about Sylvanas being female? Come on now. Lets just not go there.

Learn to take the Joke.

You realize that Genn making up a story to rationalize his actions just proves my point about his motivations and character?

Thats why i said that they would just shrug it off.

[Frontenac]

It's almost like we are the main character in a lot of single player games now, a lot of the plot could be solved if we just spoke up about what we have seen, but we stay the strong silent type lol

Except that our characters don't know any more of what happened in the other faction than our leaders. We know it as players, but our characters do not. For the Alliance character, the Horde left the battlefield when the Alliance needed it the most, and they lost their High King because of Horde cowardice. The Horde character knows why Sylvanas sounded the retreat, so for him/her, the Alliance attacked them without provocation in Stormheim.

What is surprising is that we never heard of any attempt of communication between the two factions after the fiasco at the Broken Shore. The Alliance demanded no explanation to the Horde, nor did the Horde ever sent any explanation to the Alliance. It's as if both leaderships were happy with the situation.

[SirCowdog]

Either faction had to take care of their own territory before doing anything;Thats basic strategy.

Oh... you mean like... falling ng back before you get overrun?

Sorry, the alliance knew things were rough for everyone. They had an airship close enough to pull a combat evac on short notic(and thus could easily oversee the battlefield). There was a Horn to let EVERYONE know the retreat was happening.


There wasn't anything to suggest a betrayal. Sylvanas' archers didn't fire on the Alliance forces. They didn't reposition without notification. They didn't circle around and attack the retreating Alliance troops. Sylvanas even fought side by side with Varian after the crash!

But by all means, let's throw all of the rest of the info out the window and listen to angry wolf Genn.

[Nirathiel]

It's not, because I'm not saying Sylvanas isn't shady. I'm showing that Genn is selfish and obsessed with revenge over anything else during the events of Legion. A lot of you guys seem to want to ignore that for some reason when BOTH OF THESE THINGS CAN BE TRUE AT THE SAME TIME.

Please do tell how Sylvanas was helping during the events of legion. I mean you even see Genn near the tomb of Sargeras even though if it's for that one quest but atleast he has presence other than chasing Sylvanas around the globe for revenge according to you, but what did Sylvanas do exactly to help in the fight against the legion?

No, I'm saying that what Sylvanas was doing has no impact on the point being made. It's like saying "Bobby does crack, so that means my cleptomania problem doesn't matter."

Bad example.

Let's say, just to make this point absolutely clear, that Sylvanas successfully enslaved Eyir. How does that hurt the Alliance while the Legion invasion is ongoing? If anything it ensures the Forsaken will have a steady supply of troops to help fight the Legion. AFTER the Legion is deafeated Genn could make his case for going back to war with the Horde, and would probably be completely justified and absolutely correct to call out Sylvanas about it!

Except it would hurt the Alliance AFTER the legion is destroyed I mean hell next expansion is all about HvA how wouldn't that hurt them? Like I said before let's say you and your long time enemy ally with each other for a period to fight a common enemy, and that long time rival ends up betraying you and causing the deaths of your king and more causalities. Then that long time enemy finds a new source of power that would make them a bigger threat in the future than they ever were, would you allow that?

If your house is burning down, you don't choose that particular moment to start a fight with your roommates over their drug-dealing business(or whatever shady crap they've been up to). You put out the fire first.

Except it's not even like that.

I'm not saying Genn should be a "passive sucker and let his guard down". I'm saying that he chose specifically to ignore the threat of the Legion in order to put his own self-interest first. Why do I to keep repeating this? Why do people keep assuming a list of things that I'm not saying?

He didn't ignore the legion he just chose to deal with his version of the lesser evil, and then focus on the legion as you can clearly see that when you see him just outside the tomb of Sargeras.

The fact that Sylvanas was ALSO up to no good doesn't magically absolve Genn. They were BOTH in the wrong. What part about that isn't clear?

It's pretty clear who was up to no good and who wasn't in that cinematic if you look at it again.

- - - Updated - - -

There wasn't anything to suggest a betrayal. Sylvanas' archers didn't fire on the Alliance forces. They didn't reposition without notification. They didn't circle around and attack the retreating Alliance troops. Sylvanas even fought side by side with Varian after the crash!

You forgot that npcs don't have the knowledge that we players do, from Genn And the Alliance's pov all they heard was a horn and then saw Sylvanas's own arches calmly walking away from the fight. That made it seem like it was a planned retreat that they were leaving the Alliance to fight the legion on their own and it got worse when Varian died.

[Kraddark]

I think Genn has a believable motivation. His kingdom was attacked by the Horde and his son was killed. Then, during the battle at the broken shore the Horde was overrun but he doesn't see that. All he can see is the Horde doing what the Horde does (Wrathgate, Ashenvale, Southshore, Gilneas, etc). "Betrayal" at the Broken Shore is just the last straw for him.

A lot of people will argue something along the lines of: "Well that was Garrosh's Horde!" Not too long ago people argued: "Well the old Horde attacked Azeroth! Not Thrall's Horde!" I don't know how many "do-overs" the Horde should get but its understandable that the characters actually living through it are fed up. The Horde leadership is in a constant state of chaos.

[Jester Joe]

Except it would hurt the Alliance AFTER the legion is destroyed I mean hell next expansion is all about HvA how wouldn't that hurt them? Like I said before let's say you and your long time enemy ally with each other for a period to fight a common enemy, and that long time rival ends up betraying you and causing the deaths of your king and more causalities. Then that long time enemy finds a new source of power that would make them a bigger threat in the future than they ever were, would you allow that?


Except it's not even like that.


He didn't ignore the legion he just chose to deal with his version of the lesser evil, and then focus on the legion as you can clearly see that when you see him just outside the tomb of Sargeras.


It's pretty clear who was up to no good and who wasn't in that cinematic if you look at it again.

And to add to this, yet again, Sylvanas was trying to enslave one of Odyn's like, top generals basically.

So not only was she impeding the campaign against the Legion, she very well could have pushed Odyn to become an ally of the Alliance after he was freed to go after Sylvanas himself.

It's like, oh boy, you got some more corpses, I hope that can save a Titan watcher.

[Deleted]

Hilarious to see people claim we shouldnt be looking at Genn’s history because changes, but it’s perfectly fine to look at Horde’s history.

So much double standards in this topic from both horde and alliance fanbois.

[SirCowdog]

Hilarious to see people claim we shouldnt be looking at Genn’s history because changes, but it’s perfectly fine to look at Horde’s history.

So much double standards in this topic from both horde and alliance fanbois.

Pretty much this. A complete and total unwillingness to recognize even the slightest flaw in "their side's" actions.

I'm done here.

[united]

In case you haven't noticed, Genn's character has been MASSIVELY adjusted by this point dude. Lol.

he's still a stubborn old man that makes brash decisions. please tell me how his character has been MASSIVELY adjusted?

- - - Updated - - -

Hilarious to see people claim we shouldnt be looking at Genn’s history because changes, but it’s perfectly fine to look at Horde’s history.

So much double standards in this topic from both horde and alliance fanbois.

lmfaooo exactly

[Molvonos]

Sylvanas is a shit character these days, so i'm ok with her death by Genn's hands. Or ours. Either way.

[Jester Joe]

Pretty much this. A complete and total unwillingness to recognize even the slightest flaw in "their side's" actions.

I'm done here.

You're the one refusing to accept that Genn has legit reasons to distrust Sylvanas, and a legit reason to think she was up to something bad in Stormheim.

And no one is debating whether or not the Alliance shot at the Horde first then, but you keep bringing it up like we are to show "LOOK, he's soooo bad" when they've never said WHO did it.
Hell, it could have been a dreadlord disguised as an Alliance soldier for all we know.

[Zyky]

There is no proof...I just watched the Horde video...if spying is the start to aggression then I hope you never hold the presidency or you'll be getting us in as much trouble or worse than Trump himself.

You keep saying you're watching the Horde video, go watch the Alliance video, for the second time. The quests specifically tell you to stop their operations. That's called aggression.

- - - Updated - - -

Destroying shredders justifies burning Teldrassil? Then burning Teldrassil justifies just about anything.

Acts of war justify any kind of retaliation they get.

[Nirathiel]

Pretty much this. A complete and total unwillingness to recognize even the slightest flaw in "their side's" actions.

I'm done here.

You're the one who had a shit arguement from the start. Byebye.

[Kithelle]

You keep saying you're watching the Horde video, go watch the Alliance video, for the second time. The quests specifically tell you to stop their operations. That's called aggression.

- - - Updated - - -



Acts of war justify any kind of retaliation they get.

Alliance blow up some shredders...so I guess the Alliance is supposed to just sit by and let the Horde mine all of the Azerite?

She was fucking planning to attack Stormwind before Alliance hit Undercity...we blew up a few shredders and she burns down a entire Alliance zone?

And what do you think she is gonna do with the Azerite? It sure as hell isn't going to be used to make glitter cannons and rainbow machines...it is painstakingly obvious Sylvanas never respected the pact with the Alliance...and then she has the gall to claim it was the Horde was machine that did all the work against the Legion.

Yeah...you mean while she was M.I.A. for Legion except for the little part of her trying to enslave a race for her immortality...probably busy after her loss planning the destruction of the Alliance where we were fighting for our lives against the Legion.

Say all you want, you can't just wish away the fact Sylvanas was planning the attack on Stormwind while Azeroth fought for its lives...Alliance blew up some shredders and she blows up a entire zone? She is fucking worse than Garrosh, only thing is she has the puppets eating from the palm of her hand.

[Deleted]

Still cares more about the alliance than sylvanas does about the horde.
Despite not being faction leader.
Just sayin'.

[Deleted]

I would say "good!".

She needs to be stopped.

He is in the front on the broken shore versus the legion despite Sylvanas being an ally. So... That tells me he cares.

[Verdugo]

People fighting over some of the worst writing the fantasy genre has ever seen. That's real bright. There's no real conflict and whatever is being served next expansion is just pandering to the fanboys of this puerile, inconsistent heap of trash that is lore.

Oh good, someone else gets it.

[Darktbs]

Oh... you mean like... falling ng back before you get overrun?

Sorry, the alliance knew things were rough for everyone. They had an airship close enough to pull a combat evac on short notic(and thus could easily oversee the battlefield). There was a Horn to let EVERYONE know the retreat was happening.


There wasn't anything to suggest a betrayal. Sylvanas' archers didn't fire on the Alliance forces. They didn't reposition without notification. They didn't circle around and attack the retreating Alliance troops. Sylvanas even fought side by side with Varian after the crash!

But by all means, let's throw all of the rest of the info out the window and listen to angry wolf Genn.

*Sigh*

1-The alliance cinematic clearly show that from the Alliance POV they were wining, the only side that was in difficulty was the Horde one.Reason why Varian told Mekkatorque to call the Gunship to finish the fight and shout "VICTORY IS OURS".By the time the Gunship arrived the Horde was already retreating.

2-People keep bringing the Horn as a sign of retreat.LOOK AT THE REACTION FROM THE ALLIANCE SIDE AND LOOK AT WHAT THE HORN DID.
The fucking horn was not a retreat signal it was a SUMMONING SIGNAL that summoned the Val'kyr.

If both factions had a retreat signal, they shure as hell didn't use it otherwise the Alliance would know and not act surprise to the Horde leaving the battle.

3-Betrayal doesn't need to attack/backstab someone directly.Quel'thalas claimed the alliance betrayed them on the second war by leaving them to their fate.True or not, the Alliance didn't need to attack the High elfs to betray them but rather just leave that specific battle.

[Hawkknight97]

Oh man Another Sylvanas Fanboy Post. Sometimes I don't even under the whole point of the horde anymore when they point blame to the Alliance where clearly Horde started wars and cause more harm than good.

Maybe in the Expansion BFA blizzard might finally kill off Sylvanas. Because atleast for Genn he would finally avenged the murder of his son and his lost kingdom.

[Felfaadaern Darkterror]

You keep saying you're watching the Horde video, go watch the Alliance video, for the second time. The quests specifically tell you to stop their operations. That's called aggression.

- - - Updated - - -



Acts of war justify any kind of retaliation they get.

B.S. That is the mentality of a dead world. Even at the height of the cold war, U.S. & Soviet Union maintained policies of measured response. That is how we avoided WWIII.

- - - Updated - - -

I think Genn has a believable motivation. His kingdom was attacked by the Horde and his son was killed. Then, during the battle at the broken shore the Horde was overrun but he doesn't see that. All he can see is the Horde doing what the Horde does (Wrathgate, Ashenvale, Southshore, Gilneas, etc). "Betrayal" at the Broken Shore is just the last straw for him.

A lot of people will argue something along the lines of: "Well that was Garrosh's Horde!" Not too long ago people argued: "Well the old Horde attacked Azeroth! Not Thrall's Horde!" I don't know how many "do-overs" the Horde should get but its understandable that the characters actually living through it are fed up. The Horde leadership is in a constant state of chaos.

^^^This guy gets it.

- - - Updated - - -

You keep saying you're watching the Horde video, go watch the Alliance video, for the second time. The quests specifically tell you to stop their operations. That's called aggression.

Keeping WMDs out of the hands of wacko goblin engineers is called saving the world.