Classic Servers was a bad move, what Blizz should have done is...

[Byucknah The Red]

Classic Servers were a bad move in my whole hearted humble opinion, everyone's own definition of what a "Classic" and even "Vanilla" server should have/include is different and I see these forums flooded with "They should add X to the server" followed by "No, that's not classic/vanilla, it does not belong!" (which is technically true more often than not...) Since the Classic announcement its been nothing but arguments back and forth on adding non-classic features to classic servers.

Now, before I am labeled as a purest, rebel scum, or a troll please just hear me out. First of all, while I played, enjoyed, and have TONS of memories from Vanilla, TBC, and Wrath I personally am not interested in going back (Some times the desire bites me in the butt, but its once in a blue moon). I LIKE the changes made in retail and LOVE Legion (I know, I am a monster). At the same time I was one of the signatures on that whole thing with Mark Kern and bringing back Vanilla servers because I support people wanting to play the game of their choice. I support all of you wanting Classic Servers, however if its an official server it should be strictly historically accurate in terms of features (As much as I personally think the updated social features would be nice, its not accurate). This brings me to the other part of my title "what Blizz should have done is..."!

Instead of creating official Vanilla Servers, Blizzard should have gone down a "Partnered/Licensed/Franchised Server" (Name being work-shopped) route!

There are TONS of great private servers out there in so many flavors. Heck, I have played on a specific Private Server where there are no classes and instead you build your own class through its rather intricate class building system! It was a blast to experience during the beta but again, I love Legion and returned to Legion. After playing on that server though, I fully saw and understood the appeal of these kinds of servers. The passion, love, and effort put into them by the community is unbelievable! Everything ranging from full on pure vanilla, TBC, or Wrath experiences to extremely customized and new experiences such as the server I mentioned experiencing.

The community has shown its love and passion for these things and Blizzard has expressed time and time again it has a lack of interest in such things. They don't want to devote the time, money, and effort to it, lets be honest here. Instead, they should have supported the community and private servers with a "Partnered Server" program, kinda like franchising a business or buying a license (An example being like buying a license to produce and sell NFL merchandise). Create a way for Private servers to become officially supported, approved, and recognized by Blizzard through meeting base requirements as determined by Blizzard. Give the community who actually DO have passion for this stuff a way to continue showing that passion through an official and regulated method to ensure quality servers can flourish while others wither away.

To be fair, while the legal intricacies elude me, though I am sure the forum lawyers will come crawling out of the wood works and explain to me why this is "impossible" I say this. If huge corporations can franchise their businesses, sell licenses to use their intellectual properties, and so on and so forth then surely as we are on the verge of 2018 the geniuses out there at Blizzard's business and legal departments could figure out a way to do something like this allowing everyone to be happy.

This is my two copper on the subject of Classic servers.

TL DR - The community is torn on what they want. Blizzard has never expressed interest in doing this, creating old content servers, to begin with. the community is already passionate and has done most of the work for stuff like this. Blizzard should instead figure out a way to franchise/allow servers to purchase licenses to run official community(private) servers. They should find a way to allow groups like Nostalrius and passionate and communities to work instead of doing something that they(Blizzard) has never had interest in to begin with. Give it to those who do have interest, passion, time, and community through a legal and officially supported channel. Just my 2cp.

[Zeta333]

Blizzard should do alot of things including not fucking ruining thier game to the point that people would rather travel over 10 years backwards in time than play current content. but they didnt.

[Byucknah The Red]

Mmm, Good and constructive feedback. Glad you can read a title then nerd rage instead of having a discussion Considering how quickly you replied vs how long ago I posted this I know for a fact you read none of this and simply want to express frustration and distaste for a game you are probably not even playing as well as a desire for a game you probably wouldn't play if/when it comes out. Thanks for contributing!

[Deleted]

Blizzard should do alot of things including not fucking ruining thier game to the point that people would rather travel over 10 years backwards in time than play current content. but they didnt.

That's your very subjective opinion that millions of people don't share.

OT: I like and dislike your idea. It sounds nice but blizzard simply giving/sharing their intellectual property with random people is not acceptable, in my opinion.

[Battlebeard]

Classic Servers were a bad move in my whole hearted humble opinion, everyone's own definition of what a "Classic" and even "Vanilla" server should have/include is different and I see these forums flooded with "They should add X to the server" followed by "No, that's not classic/vanilla, it does not belong!" (which is technically true more often than not...) Since the Classic announcement its been nothing but arguments back and forth on adding non-classic features to classic servers.

Now, before I am labeled as a purest, rebel scum, or a troll please just hear me out. First of all, while I played, enjoyed, and have TONS of memories from Vanilla, TBC, and Wrath I personally am not interested in going back (Some times the desire bites me in the butt, but its once in a blue moon). I LIKE the changes made in retail and LOVE Legion (I know, I am a monster). At the same time I was one of the signatures on that whole thing with Mark Kern and bringing back Vanilla servers because I support people wanting to play the game of their choice. I support all of you wanting Classic Servers, however if its an official server it should be strictly historically accurate in terms of features (As much as I personally think the updated social features would be nice, its not accurate). This brings me to the other part of my title "what Blizz should have done is..."!

Instead of creating official Vanilla Servers, Blizzard should have gone down a "Partnered/Licensed/Franchised Server" (Name being work-shopped) route!

There are TONS of great private servers out there in so many flavors. Heck, I have played on a specific Private Server where there are no classes and instead you build your own class through its rather intricate class building system! It was a blast to experience during the beta but again, I love Legion and returned to Legion. After playing on that server though, I fully saw and understood the appeal of these kinds of servers. The passion, love, and effort put into them by the community is unbelievable! Everything ranging from full on pure vanilla, TBC, or Wrath experiences to extremely customized and new experiences such as the server I mentioned experiencing.

The community has shown its love and passion for these things and Blizzard has expressed time and time again it has a lack of interest in such things. They don't want to devote the time, money, and effort to it, lets be honest here. Instead, they should have supported the community and private servers with a "Partnered Server" program, kinda like franchising a business or buying a license (An example being like buying a license to produce and sell NFL merchandise). Create a way for Private servers to become officially supported, approved, and recognized by Blizzard through meeting base requirements as determined by Blizzard. Give the community who actually DO have passion for this stuff a way to continue showing that passion through an official and regulated method to ensure quality servers can flourish while others wither away.

To be fair, while the legal intricacies elude me, though I am sure the forum lawyers will come crawling out of the wood works and explain to me why this is "impossible" I say this. If huge corporations can franchise their businesses, sell licenses to use their intellectual properties, and so on and so forth then surely as we are on the verge of 2018 the geniuses out there at Blizzard's business and legal departments could figure out a way to do something like this allowing everyone to be happy.

This is my two copper on the subject of Classic servers.

TL DR - The community is torn on what they want. Blizzard has never expressed interest in doing this, creating old content servers, to begin with. the community is already passionate and has done most of the work for stuff like this. Blizzard should instead figure out a way to franchise/allow servers to purchase licenses to run official community(private) servers. They should find a way to allow groups like Nostalrius and passionate and communities to work instead of doing something that they(Blizzard) has never had interest in to begin with. Give it to those who do have interest, passion, time, and community through a legal and officially supported channel. Just my 2cp.

Well, private servers come and go and we don't have the same security that they stay up as we do with Blizzard servers.

Blizzard are a reliable company. The servers won't shut down suddenly cause of whatever reason. The ONLY reason I didn't play private servers were cause I don't wanna play a lot on a server that might go down at any time.

[Wiedzemir]

Instead of creating official Vanilla Servers, Blizzard should have gone down a "Partnered/Licensed/Franchised Server" (Name being work-shopped) route!

Except no. I personally don't play private servers because today they are there, tomorrow they aren't. It's pointless. Same with these semi-official private servers, I'd not touch them with a mile long pole. Not to mention the entire set of issues with trustworthiness, we all saw how scammy many of the server administrators are.

[Byucknah The Red]

Well, private servers come and go and we don't have the same security that they stay up as we do with Blizzard servers.

Blizzard are a reliable company. The servers won't shut down suddenly cause of whatever reason. The ONLY reason I didn't play private servers were cause I don't wanna play a lot on a server that might go down at any time.

That is actually a very fair and real point. There is no security, either because the team could quit at any time and just abandon the server OR a very lively server gets shut down by Blizzard :T To be honest, who is to say official servers will never shut down. Many MMO's have died over the years, including MMO's with a good fan base such as DAoC. Its a reality that is for sure and a good point, but I feel that depending on Blizzard regulation for applying to be an official community server there could be legal ramifications for abrupt closing of servers.

Still, its a very good and valid point.

Except no. I personally don't play private servers because today they are there, tomorrow they aren't. It's pointless. Same with these semi-official private servers, I'd not touch them with a mile long pole. Not to mention the entire set of issues with trustworthiness, we all saw how scammy many of the server administrators are.

Again, how many large servers are DMCAed and shut down. Servers that have proven they are legit and on the up and up... er... as up and up as a Private Server could get but still servers with Massive, thriving, and lively communities! Look at the Nostalrius team who has gotten to the point of being asked to come to Blizzard multiple times to discuss the classic server. To be honest, more likely than not, you will be playing on THEIR tech that Blizzard has adapted to their own use. Still not going to touch it with a mile long pole? Like it or not, Blizzard has pretty much said they can't recreate original WoW on their own and will probably be using a Blizzard modified Nostalrius engine build.

And as for the trustworthyness that comes down to the fact that, like franchising and licensing, its not given out willy nilly. There are real legal ramifications for abusing a license, there are often buy ins, and a lot of legal tape that makes it rare for shady shit to happen in the first place. It its handled properly, official community servers would not have those issues you suggested.

[Armourboy]

I believe Blizzard covered this at some point and I believe it basically boiled down to the fact they didn't want to attatch their name to something they didn't have direct control over and may not be up to their quality standards.

Reslly in that situation the only way to enforce it is to pull the plug and then you create many of the same issues with private server stability and also get much hate deflected on you as a company for once again wasting someone's time.

[deniter]

There are TONS of great private servers out there..

Stopped reading here. Most private servers are atrocious, some are barely playable, and only a few that are OK. None of them are truly blizzlike even tho few of them were close (until they were closed).

[Sturmbringe]

TL DR - The community is torn on what they want.

No, the community is not at all torn on what they want.

If you read our petition (Nostalrius) https://www.change.org/p/mike-morhai...raft-community

...you will see that we only asked for a Legacy server, like Nostalrius, run by Blizzard. We did not ask for any changes whatsoever, just Vanilla.

Like I said earlier, the people advocating for all sorts of ridiculous changes on Vanilla that you read in here are just trolls and the demands for changes, mere trolling in most cases.

So in short terms, you just got trolled.

[Aeula]

To be fair they should have partnered with the more popular non-trash private servers with a "Join us or die" notice. Well 'die' being get shut down but hey-ho!

I generally enjoyed playing on a Wrath server that was locked to Vanilla (Now TBC) content with a client that gave me the new WoD character models. To me that was the perfect vanilla experience. Pure Classic WoW isn't as interesting.

[Byucknah The Red]

Stopped reading here. Most private servers are atrocious, some are barely playable, and only a few that are OK. None of them are truly blizzlike even tho few of them were close (until they were closed).

Its a shame you stopped reading there, can't really make a good argument when you don't know the whole topic/story. I have only ever seen the first LotR movies but I am pretty sure I can make a good compelling argument on how Gandalf is dead and "Gandalf the White" is not the same person

Sass aside, I won't deny there are garbage private servers out there with no quality to them what so ever! But there are also many great servers out there with great communities that constantly get shut down and destroyed. The point is to find a way to protect the good communities and servers while allowing them a way to flourish and grow while doubling down on bad servers who do not have the seal of approval. That is the main point of this topic and I really hope that you consider continuing where you left off in my short novel of a post

No, the community is not at all torn on what they want.

If you read our petition (Nostalrius) https://www.change.org/p/mike-morhai...raft-community

...you will see that we only asked for a Legacy server, like Nostalrius, run by Blizzard. We did not ask for any changes whatsoever, just Vanilla.

Like I said earlier, the people advocating for all sorts of ridiculous changes on Vanilla that you read in here are just trolls and the demands for changes, mere trolling in most cases.

So in short terms, you just got trolled.

Like it or not, the MMO-C board as well as official Blizzard board IS part of the community. Its easy to say that everyone asking for other features are simply trolls but the truth is that there ARE people who legitimately want QoL features in a Vanilla experience.

To be fair they should have partnered with the more popular non-trash private servers with a "Join us or die" notice. Well 'die' being get shut down but hey-ho!

I generally enjoyed playing on a Wrath server that was locked to Vanilla (Now TBC) content with a client that gave me the new WoD character models. To me that was the perfect vanilla experience. Pure Classic WoW isn't as interesting.

And this is the point I am getting at! veryone in this community has their own view on what features should be in a "Classic" server. As I mentioned in my original post, "IF" I was someone who wanted to play a classic server officially put out by Blizzard I would LOVE for it to have the updated social features such as battle.net whispering and messaging, larger guild sizes, guild finder, offline mode, ect while keeping the rest vanilla. Is that Vanilla/Classic? No.

Blizzard has to make a choice and we will get one option from them and that is it. There are people who want that and I think they should get that pure and vanilla experience. There are people who want a Vanilla experience with QoL features, and I think people should be able to get that as well! There are people who want drastically different renditions of older version of WoW and even new original content for those versions, why should they be denied also! As long as its quality, why is it an issue?

That's why I say there should be strict franchising and licensing standards put in place so those who are TRULY passionate about these servers can find a way to continue thriving and growing! Their communities can continue to flourish without fear of being torn apart and people can enjoy THEIR version of WoW that they love.

Should all servers be partnered? Hell no, cut the wheat from the chaff through regulation and create an official and legal system of accountability on the Private Servers end.

What should be looked at here is Community, something Blizzard has failed at for several years now, be it communication or support. While I think its great that those who want a TRUE vanilla experience now have a chance at it officially I feel like this whole situation could be handled much better or expanded upon and feel this is not the most beneficial course they could have taken.

Anyway, with that it is 5am for me so here is hoping there can be SOME good discussion from this and that this topic does not turn into a pure flame war in my absence. I will admit, I don't know everything (Actually, I know very little) but its still a worth while discussion at the very least on the idea of Digital Service franchising/licensing and how Blizzard could pioneer this and give to its community. As pointed out, there are flaws and its not perfect but at the same time their "Classic" server announcement is just as f

[Zeta333]

That's your very subjective opinion that millions of people don't share.

OT: I like and dislike your idea. It sounds nice but blizzard simply giving/sharing their intellectual property with random people is not acceptable, in my opinion.

And the millions more that have quit as a result of blizzards decision say otherwise. To the point that we dont know how many millions support them due to them stopping the reporting of subs after it dipped so low.

[Aggrophobic]

Blizzard should do alot of things including not fucking ruining thier game to the point that people would rather travel over 10 years backwards in time than play current content. but they didnt.

They could have done anything and people would still want to go back. Nostalgia works that way.

[alabaster jones]

Instead, they should have supported the community and private servers with a "Partnered Server" program, kinda like franchising a business or buying a license (An example being like buying a license to produce and sell NFL merchandise). Create a way for Private servers to become officially supported, approved, and recognized by Blizzard through meeting base requirements as determined by Blizzard.

There was/is always a tiny community of people who enjoyed the custom/modded private server experience, but they are a minority within a minority within a minority. The biggest private servers replicate authentic vanilla/tbc/wotlk experiences, as close as possible to what Blizzard actually had, that is the appeal, and that is what keeps people playing there.

[deniter]

Its a shame you stopped reading there, can't really make a good argument when you don't know the whole topic/story. I have only ever seen the first LotR movies but I am pretty sure I can make a good compelling argument on how Gandalf is dead and "Gandalf the White" is not the same person

Sass aside, I won't deny there are garbage private servers out there with no quality to them what so ever! But there are also many great servers out there with great communities that constantly get shut down and destroyed. The point is to find a way to protect the good communities and servers while allowing them a way to flourish and grow while doubling down on bad servers who do not have the seal of approval. That is the main point of this topic and I really hope that you consider continuing where you left off in my short novel of a post

Fair enough.

I've been thinking the same thing for some time now but in my opinion the quality and reliability should improve quite a lot, since none of these servers can meet Blizzard standards atm. In other words, Blizzard needs to hire these folks to provide the service worthy of their reputation, which is more or less the same than if they did it by themselves.

[Phuongvi]

I still prefer Blizzard managing their own products instead of giving or selling away their intelellectual properties to a bunch of Russian p2w server(s) infested with bots

[Wellzy]

Stopped reading here. Most private servers are atrocious, some are barely playable, and only a few that are OK. None of them are truly blizzlike even tho few of them were close (until they were closed).

Yeah.. I have played on private servers and they are a trainwreck.

Nost got shutdown the week I hit 60. I was F*king iraite. Global chats are filled with immature garbage because there is no moderation.

I wont play them anymore. I want a blizz classic server that is treated like an official game. so excited!

[Powerogue]

I don't think anything would've worked. In minecraft you can play literally any snapshot of any patch in history at any time at the press of a button, as well as mod any textures/gameplay elements you want and people still complain about changes they don't like.

[Roar-Powah]

Mmm, Good and constructive feedback. Glad you can read a title then nerd rage instead of having a discussion Considering how quickly you replied vs how long ago I posted this I know for a fact you read none of this and simply want to express frustration and distaste for a game you are probably not even playing as well as a desire for a game you probably wouldn't play if/when it comes out. Thanks for contributing!

He has a very valid point tho.