Can we stop with the slippery slope arguments

[Sturmbringe]

Isn't that thanks to the illegal server community having patched the client?

No, the Original WoW Private Server community did not patch the client in any way. In fact, my own client comes from the Retail CD's I bought in 2005 and it's not been modified in any way.

[Deleted]

I am not someone who lined for vanilla servers or ‘the good old days’. I’ve played WoW since it began and seen it change over time into something bigger and better with every expansion. Blizzard have iterated and innovated and that’s great for me. I do not have the time or patience I did a decade ago when spending a week or two farming mats for a single epic piece of gear was normal. I do not want what original world of Warcraft was.
However.
If I could earn achievements for my account.
If I could collect transmogs to use in the ‘real’ game.
If I had battle.net integration to play and chat easily would th my fritime nds.
If I didn’t have to download a threat meter, raid frames, a boss mod just to be able to play.
Then I can see myself playing classic wow at least for a time.
I understand people don’t want things to change and I agree, somewhat. Make the mechanics of the game the same. Make the speed of levelling, arduous dungeons, frustrating drop rates, mount costs, attunements, hybrid tax all of that part of the game. But everything that people WILL mod in just give us. All the battle.net features will do no harm. And collecting achievements and tranamogs does not break the game or ruin the experience.

Quality of life changes do not have to be about affecting the gameplay. Some can just be about making life easier. Remember there are many features that players cried out for for years. By smoothing over some of the rougher edges of classic Blizzard can bring more players in. Surely even the ‘purists’ can agree that small changes that bring players in would be good for the health and active ness of classic?

[chrisnumbers]

"it's your job to prove my argument wrong"

https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/burden-of-proof

That's not what this is. It's been demonstrated how slippery this slope is. Look at how each expansion turned into the next; it's mostly player requests.
So explain to me how you'd decide which changes make it in and which don't? Which players' opinions are the ones that matter?

[jstnw89]

stop asking for changes and people won't have to use the argument

[Charge me Doctor]

You could play for 10 years, as long as you ask for QOL you aren't asking for classic. Period. And that's a very dangerous path. One blizzard allready clearly stated they won't take.

They aren't trying to re-release classic wow, they are remaking the experience of playing classic wow, if they'll manage that while adding whatever people ask - good for them

[Deleted]

It's like, let's make a historical town but... add some arcade machines to the Blacksmith over there, because normal Blacksmiths are boring. And I think the General store needs a Disco Ball and some bean bag chairs. And maybe a giant Tesla coil in the city square! It's still a historic tow, it's just.. "better"!

Or... we could build our historic town with running water and toilets. No matter how historically accurate you want to be I don’t want to be in this recreated town if they disposed of things in the old bucket out the window style. Your examples are frivolous and unnecessary. My understanding sample just makes everyone’s life easier and safer.

To make an on topic example. Battle.net integration and chat. Does it take anything AWAY from the experience if we add it? No. Does it make things easier for those that use it? Yes. We now have a QoL change that can be added without harming the experience, let’s look for more of these rather than using hyperbolic “But people will want flying!” Statements.

[chrisnumbers]

while adding whatever people ask

Anything someone asks for is ok?
Then it could be Legion which we already have.

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Or... we could build our historic town with running water and toilets.

And sports cars and fast food joints.

[Aphrel]

Is it so difficult to understand that not everyone shares your opinions?

Is it so difficult to understand that ppl don't share yours?
You have two sides, one wanting Qol changes the other side doesn't. Its a preference of gameplay pacing.

As for aoe looting, its definitely a Qol feature to increase the pace of the game. What you seem to be missing is that the ppl who want a vanilla like classic doesnt want faster gameplay.

Slippery slope argument or not. Most Qol can be boiled down to personal preference. Aoeloot, dualspec, buffing certain specs, grpfinder (not the automatic one, the custom one), ressing inside the instance/raid, removing certain consumables like ammo. They are all qol changes aimed at increasing the pace of the game, wich generally is not something the vanilla community want.

Other arguments is more of a grey area, should they make items tradeable for the first hour after dropping rather than solve misstakes by gm tickets? That issue thou is most likely decided by blizzard, as it affects them more than us.

[anon5123]

Is it so difficult to understand that ppl don't share yours?

I'm not plugging my ears and screaming "NOT VANILLA" "GO PLAY RETAIL" "SLIPPERY SLOPE" at anyone who disagrees with me.

When I disagree with someone, I come up with actual valid reasons why, instead of just screeching non-arguments.

As for aoe looting, its definitely a Qol feature to increase the pace of the game. What you seem to be missing is that the ppl who want a vanilla like classic doesnt want faster gameplay..

Oh no, we can easily loot mobs instead of having to fuck around spamming right click trying to get that one sparkling corpse buried underneath all the other ones

This completely changes the entire game!



"faster gameplay" ? Really? Come on now. By that logic, we should let servers lag and crash, because fixing them "increases the pace of the game" as well.

[Charge me Doctor]

Anything someone asks for is ok?
Then it could be Legion which we already have.

If it still be a classic experience - yes, it's ok. It's up for blizzard to decide what classic experience is, and they are asking for help from community to decide

[anon5123]

Nobody gives a fuck how long you played on pirate version to be honest.

Just pointing it out to an idiot who is accusing me of not liking vanilla, claiming that I'm going to "drop it in 15 minutes".

Thanks for the rage and insults though

[chrisnumbers]

I'm not plugging my ears and screaming "NOT VANILLA" "GO PLAY RETAIL" "SLIPPERY SLOPE" at anyone who disagrees with me.

When I disagree with someone, I come up with actual valid reasons why, instead of just screeching non-arguments.

You're not listening. The argument is this:
If one change is ok, then they're all ok, then the game becomes something that it's not meant to be. That's the argument.

[anon5123]

And a quick difference between addons and QoL changes: Addons change how we interact with the game, QoL changes how we play it.

Decursive. Lets players spam click a frame instead of looking over the raid frame to see who is debuffed.

AH addons. Lets players decide whether to vendor, auction, or disenchant an item.

LazyScript / other macro addons. Lets you make all sorts of advanced macros to automate things.

Addons very well DO change how we play the game.

[evogsr]

Decursive.

just sayin

Not required, not used by all.

[chrisnumbers]

If it still be a classic experience - yes, it's ok. It's up for blizzard

The first part of this quote can't be decided by the players who have many different opinions.
The second part I agree with and I'll ultimately live with, and I'll play Classic no matter what.

[Jazzhands]

Or... we could build our historic town with running water and toilets. No matter how historically accurate you want to be I don’t want to be in this recreated town if they disposed of things in the old bucket out the window style. Your examples are frivolous and unnecessary. My understanding sample just makes everyone’s life easier and safer.

To make an on topic example. Battle.net integration and chat. Does it take anything AWAY from the experience if we add it? No. Does it make things easier for those that use it? Yes. We now have a QoL change that can be added without harming the experience, let’s look for more of these rather than using hyperbolic “But people will want flying!” Statements.

You pretty much proved my point. You aren't the type of person interested in living in a historical town, much like you aren't the type of person who will play Vanilla wow for any meaningful amount of time. Why should Blizzard consider doing more work on their server for you, and ruin the server for the rest of us? Battle.net chat integration is an aweful example, as it has little to do with actual gameplay, which is where most qol changes are focused. Being able to talk to a friend on another server isn't anywhere near the same as me being able to save 10 minutes every time I aoe farm SM.

Also, you clearly don't understand what people mean by slippery slope. I would recommend you read the old tale about a mouse, and a person who gives him a cookie.

[Gungnir]

I think a lot of people fail to realize that the changes blizzard has made to retail over the years is why we're in this predicament in the first place, where retail feels like a joke and everyone is crying out for Vanilla servers.

Do you people really trust blizzard to make a judgement call on implementing current tech things to a Vanilla server?
Hasn't history literally shown us the opposite?

[anon5123]

I think a lot of people fail to realize that the changes blizzard has made to retail over the years is why we're in this predicament in the first place, where retail feels like a joke and everyone is crying out for Vanilla servers.

Thanks for not reading the OP post:

The problem with retail was not changes themselves, rather, that Blizz changed too much and didn't know where to draw the line. Most, if not all vanilla players liked TBC, even though it had a shitload of changes from vanilla. So why is it such a massive sin to make any little change to vanilla?

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being able to save 10 minutes every time I aoe farm SM.

But think about that. When you think about what made vanilla great, do you think of "having to click corpses one by one, hovering your mouse over a very specific spot to be able to right click and loot" ?

This was not something intentionally designed into the game, it was a technical limitation at the time.

Changing that is not going to somehow break the rest of the game and make it "NOT VANILLA!!!!!" like you're claiming.

I would recommend you read the old tale about a mouse, and a person who gives him a cookie.

https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/slippery-slope

[Gungnir]

Thanks for not reading the OP post:

And yet you're still arguing for 7 pages that there should be changes, when as previously stated, history has shown that it is not a good idea.

Also, regarding the OP, people enjoy Vanilla for entirely different things compared to TBC.

[anon5123]

you're still arguing that there should be changes

Thanks for not reading the OP post, again.

Welcome to the ignore list.