Out of control! Antorus normal be 945 and ahead of the curve Antorus or no invite

[Deavane]

Okey, fine, I partly agree. The bosses get harder, but STILL.

Requiring higher gear than what you can get in the raid, to clear the raid, is STILL insanity. Sure, Argus is harder than the first. To have 930 for Argus, and maybe a few other, COULD seem reasonable, if you farm normal and get 930.

BUT to demand more than 930, to clear normal, that I will never accept. You should NEVER have to enter Heroic to clear Normal, that's the wrong order of things.

You can of course question if Argus is too hard? Or if the first boss in Heroic is too easy, cause the last boss in Normal, should ALWAYS be easier than the first boss in Heroic. Just like Heroic Argus should be easier than the first boss in Mythic. Garothi something, forgot the name.

Summarized, 915 should be reasonable for normal, as it's the highest you get (excluding WF/TF/Legendary) in LFR. AND since the raid gets harder, having 930 to clear the last is also reasonable. Meaning, 915-930 should be required to clear normal, NEVER anything above this. People want speed, but they are ignorant and should focus more on what's doable rather than what's super duper fast. Those speed runs are a cancer to the game, they destroy this already broken community even further.

That's not always the case. Heroic Archimonde in HFC was arguably harder than the first 3 bosses of Mythic.

[Druitz]

Anything lower than a 960+ group is going to suck, at least on Coven.

Ilvl have nothing to do with covens. You dont even need insane dps here. Just 2x mass roots and something like ring of peace, brained healer composition for debuffs/aoe dmg and its ez kill. I find covens much much easier than aggra/argus atm.

Btw its so ez to find group espesially for normal. I have even cleared full normal on my 915 alt so lol its possible.

[hellhamster]

Ilvl have nothing to do with covens. You dont even need insane dps here. Just 2x mass roots and something like ring of peace, brained healer composition for debuffs/aoe dmg and its ez kill. I find covens much much easier than aggra/argus atm.

Btw its so ez to find group espesially for normal. I have even cleared full normal on my 915 alt so lol its possible.

The higher dps, the less phases, the easier it gets. There's always bound to be deaths each phase, especially on storm or cc.

[Deleted]

Yeah and before Gearscore or Itemlevel you would go to the IF or Shattrath bridge to get inspected for proper gear, enchants, gems, talents. If you think Gearscore or itemlevel ruined anything, you just didn't play before it. It has always been the same and it will continue to be so. That's the nature of the game and many other online games. If you don't like it, you either get better or join a guild with likeminded people. If you try to draw the social card, don't even get me started on why you're playing an MMO.

[Deleted]

Meh - Its getting to the point where applying to a pug is more like applying for a job.

They all want see your credentials and most of them even look you up on external websites to check your gear, its all starting to get rather silly.
Wow is a computer game after all - not a lifestyle choice.

[Sylvaeres]

I think that all leaders should take some responsibility when they lead, whether its others or me. If you have the time to lead, please do, but a majority of players does not lead and that's fine. Non-leaders should not be judged for not leading. You CAN have some demands even if you do not lead yourself, simple as that. We are all part of the game and we all pay for it, we are maybe not entitled to raidspots per se, but we are entitled to not be treated badly just cause we are not party or raid leaders.

For a good atmosphere and a good community, you SHOULD help strangers. I mean, who is NOT a stranger in the beginning. If I ever get married, my future wife is currently a stranger. Everyone are strangers and to make strangers into friends require some trust. I don't get this hostile attitude towards other people. This is an MMORPG, the POINT of the game is to play with others. If people are gonna have a selfish attitude, for the love of God, WHY do they play an online game, they can just play Skyrim or something then. If you don't want new friends or to play with strangers, this game is not for you.

People care more about gear and clearing raids fast than enjoying a multiplayer game with other people, and words can't describe how much this disgust me.

See this is what the welfare mentality looks like. Why is a stranger entitled to my help, especially in a video game? You could make an argument for real life issues, but in a video game, no. This is one of the most silly, nonsensical posts I've seen on this board. I host pugs every week, my battlenet friends list is maxed out at all times, it's a thriving community. Of course I have the right to pick and choose who I'd like to play with, and everything you said in your post is simply s big, stinking pile of bullshit

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Ilvl have nothing to do with covens. You dont even need insane dps here. Just 2x mass roots and something like ring of peace, brained healer composition for debuffs/aoe dmg and its ez kill. I find covens much much easier than aggra/argus atm.

Btw its so ez to find group espesially for normal. I have even cleared full normal on my 915 alt so lol its possible.

Getting carried through the content by higher skilled players doesn't make it easy lol

[La]

Meh - Its getting to the point where applying to a pug is more like applying for a job.

They all want see your credentials and most of them even look you up on external websites to check your gear, its all starting to get rather silly.
Wow is a computer game after all - not a lifestyle choice.

Yes, applying for a pug is basically the soft version of applying for a guild. Made me have a lot of respect for people who played FF14. At least those people took the time and effort to learn the fights and phases of quite difficult encounters, and didn't require such ridiculous levels of gear. But then, most games don't have 15 different versions of a raid, warforged, titanforged, and RNG BS, with a terrible playerbase either.

[Sylvaeres]

Meh - Its getting to the point where applying to a pug is more like applying for a job.

They all want see your credentials and most of them even look you up on external websites to check your gear, its all starting to get rather silly.
Wow is a computer game after all - not a lifestyle choice.

Ya, and if you want to go fumblefuck around in normal content for 4 hours, that's your choice. But some of us want to be efficient and bring people who don't weigh down the group

[Atreyes]

Yep the requirement's is fucken dumb.

Been trying for two weeks now just to step foot in the raid and all I see is 945+ AOTC shit.

Just make your own, decide who you want to bring and problem solved?

[Druitz]

See this is what the welfare mentality looks like. Why is a stranger entitled to my help, especially in a video game? You could make an argument for real life issues, but in a video game, no. This is one of the most silly, nonsensical posts I've seen on this board. I host pugs every week, my battlenet friends list is maxed out at all times, it's a thriving community. Of course I have the right to pick and choose who I'd like to play with, and everything you said in your post is simply s big, stinking pile of bullshit

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Getting carried through the content by higher skilled players doesn't make it easy lol

There is difference between getting carried by higher skilled players and getting carried on random alt by higher ilvl players.

If you create new char how do you want to gear it? Run all old raids like nighthold/tomb or find group fro Antorus? Answer is simple that if you already cleared tomb like 20 times (for me clearing same raid 10+ times is boring because pressing pve rotation on same programmed dummies cant be great forever) you dont want to do it again and again on new alts.

I just said i done antorus normal on 915 ilvl alt. Maybe they invited my because of curve and ilvl was not so important? Idk.

I did what i wanted to - geared my alt faster.

[alucardtnuoc]

Just make your own, decide who you want to bring and problem solved?

wow, way to be so mean... how dare we force THEM to make their own groups... don't you know that they are the only ones allowed to force others to do what they want?

Next you'll expect them to make more gold instead of making people sell their goods on AH for less.

[Sylvaeres]

There is difference between getting carried by higher skilled players and getting carried on random alt by higher ilvl players.

If you create new char how do you want to gear it? Run all old raids like nighthold/tomb or find group fro Antorus? Answer is simple that if you already cleared tomb like 20 times (for me clearing same raid 10+ times is boring because pressing pve rotation on same programmed dummies cant be great forever) you dont want to do it again and again on new alts.

I just said i done antorus normal on 915 ilvl alt. Maybe they invited my because of curve and ilvl was not so important? Idk.

I did what i wanted to - geared my alt faster.

By all means, yes. But don't state that it's "easy" and pretend like if you cloned yourself 9-29 times and made a raid full of your clones, that you could easily clear the content at that gear level. 915 was 2 tiers ago. I have used the same methods to gear my toons, but by no means do I believe that it would be easy for me to run around in an undergeared alt and clear content

[Deleted]

Its a complicated issue - Most people who dont have experience with the current content dont want to lead groups for it - leading to people being left out.
However, I have curve and lead groups for it each week - So I can see how it is much easier to use curve as a requirement.

Its not the players, nor the community's fault - as elitism is in human nature.
It is blizzards fault for putting so much power into the players hands.

[Deleted]

It is blizzards fault for putting so much power into the players hands.

"In the quiet words of the Virgin Mary: come again?" (tm Brick Top in Snatch)

[david0925]

Its a complicated issue - Most people who dont have experience with the current content dont want to lead groups for it - leading to people being left out.
However, I have curve and lead groups for it each week - So I can see how it is much easier to use curve as a requirement.

Its not the players, nor the community's fault - as elitism is in human nature.
It is blizzards fault for putting so much power into the players hands.

so you think random queue is a better solution? because that's the only way to eliminate resume from the groups.

[Deleted]

so you think random queue is a better solution? because that's the only way to eliminate resume from the groups.

No, remove group finder could be a solution. So you stick with your server and you know the guys over time bye name, more or less. Invite friends through cross realms or use discord. No fake achievment bullshit, more communication leading to healthier groups.

[Druitz]

No, remove group finder could be a solution. So you stick with your server and you know the guys over time bye name, more or less. Invite friends through cross realms or use discord. No fake achievment bullshit, more communication leading to healthier groups.

Its called guild and here is problem. Some ppl just cant raid in guilds because they need you to be on nearly every raid. If i am working 6-14 and 14-22 i simply cant because guild dont accept it.

Some ppl got own familiy etc, they cant progress a lot in 4-6 weeks. There are even guild that need more time to clear raid and they need you to be for them nearly always or even better if you never miss raid.

When i was going to school 5 years ago it was no problem. I was on every raid but now i cant:/

[ydraw]

No, remove group finder could be a solution. So you stick with your server and you know the guys over time bye name, more or less. Invite friends through cross realms or use discord. No fake achievment bullshit, more communication leading to healthier groups.

Nobody is forcing you to use group finder. If you want to make things harder for yourself go ahead, but I'll keep group finder pls thx bye.

[Vargarii]

By all means, yes. But don't state that it's "easy" and pretend like if you cloned yourself 9-29 times and made a raid full of your clones, that you could easily clear the content at that gear level. 915 was 2 tiers ago. I have used the same methods to gear my toons, but by no means do I believe that it would be easy for me to run around in an undergeared alt and clear content

I don't play the game anymore, but since when is it wrong to state that doing a normal raid is "easy"? Has the difficulty curve on content jumped sky high, or has the player base fallen so low?

[Osmeric]

I don't play the game anymore, but since when is it wrong to state that doing a normal raid is "easy"? Has the difficulty curve on content jumped sky high, or has the player base fallen so low?

The player base has never been very good. It's just that the previous design excluded large fractions of it that weren't good enough.