Inevitable changes for Classic

[Soon-TM]

Imo:

1) Authenticator and bnet related capabilities are OK.

2) New graphics/animations are also OK, provided that they are togglable.

3) Tokens are not OK, they would be an instant deal breaker for me.

[chrisnumbers]

Blizzard says no changes.
Players say they're inevitable.
I wonder who's right.

[hulkgor]

I'm not sure WoW token would work on classic servers but maybe allowing a one way gold transfer between live and classic with a huge tax like 10,000g on live = 1g on classic may be enough to deter the gold sellers while also not completely ruining the classic economy. It'd provide another gold sink for those on live while also allowing those with limited play time the same convenience that WoW tokens provide. Not perfect but an acceptable compromise imo.

What a surefire way to fuck up the economy within minutes of servers opening.

Great idea! /s

No. There should never be a way to transfer gold (or anything whatsoever) between the two separate experiences. That's a fucking given.

[Djanco]

they're gonna add tokens simply because it deters gold sellers. none of the gold from tokens enters or leaves the economy it simply exchanges hands from one player to another. it isnt about "noobs who dont want to farm for it", and there is no way they will let you transfer gold from live. that IS stupid.

[Goondicker]

YOu say tokens will ruin Vanilla but that is just a statement with no proof behind it. Please explain......


Because here is what I see, tokens are just a method of combating the 3rd party gold sellers, it is not like they are directly selling gold that is not already in the market place. The only thing a token does is distribute this gold at a small 5-8 dollar fee in exchange for game time. They will have to lock the token to either vanilla or current expansion on purchase and then it will be sold a vanilla market rate. If anything this will remove more gold from the market as these tokens will be use mainly by people who are looking to purchase epic mount riding, this only go to remove gold from the market therefore keeping prices low for AH materials.... Isn't this what you want........
I know this as I had 2 characters in vanilla at gold cap, it was easy to make gold using gold farmers as suppliers as they were only looking to move product fast and you could resell it at a 20-30% markup, or more if you crafted goods out of it.

Banning people is the way to combat gold sellers. Just because Blizz is selling the gold doesn't make it any better.
It doesn't remove any more gold from the market, no matter what it's spent on.
Earning your epic mount is much less epic when you can just swipe your credit card. Vanilla felt so good because you were rewarded for effort.
The token will put wallet warriors at a huge advantage versus those who spend time in-game to get something.

The entire token system is a money grab, it's not to combat gold sellers. Let's not kid ourselves.

[Sorcath]

Shit we should actually be talking about

My word, a thread that's actually on topic? None of this "Let's talk about things that won't happen, but degrade others because they don't like it" or "X reason why vanilla sucks"?

These are actually all things I've conceded to being there.

[Deleted]

I don't want new models, I want to go back and visit the real Vanilla, so skip new models because they suck.

You can turn them off if you want, can't you?

I will be very surprised if WoW tokens are available on the new servers.

They won't allow to buy Classic gold with WoW Tokens. You could basically transfer gold from Live to Classic

If earning gold will be as hard as it used to be, no one will be able to afford to pay the official market price for them in a very, very long time. Unless they enable character transfers from live to vanilla servers, which would screw up the economical balance immediately.

Heh, I hope they don't allow anything like that tbh. If people love vanilla so much, let them experience it in its fullest - starting as penniless beggars who need to run on foot until lvl 50-60 before they can afford to buy even the level 40 mount. No heirlooms, no chaffeurs, and struggling with 8-slot vendor bags.

[Battlebeard]

Lets just be honest with one another. There will be changes done to Classic. But lets be realistic with one another on what these changes could be. Obliviously there is a large group of the community who says "No" to any changes big or small, game breaking or not. Obviously there is an equally large group of the community who are for changes no matter how much it may veer from the Vanilla experience. The vast majority of the changes I feel the community wants are QoL or Class Balancing.

We aren't here to discuss those changes.

I would like to discuss potential changes that we as a community can agree will be implemented based off reasonable compromise of implementing a 13 year old game in a much more modern gaming society. What I mean by this is. It's been said a million times before the game is old. Anyone who thinks there wont be some changes to the game. And thinks they would release the same 04/05/06 version of WoW I feel is not looking at this whole situation rationally. So below are three changes I truly believe we will see in classic and my reasoning behind each one.

1) Authenticators - Given the increase is cyber security over the past 13 years. I believe blizzard would be foolish to not integrate the classic servers into there battle net client. Thus meaning authenticators will be a thing. Given the amount of characters / items we have accumulated over these years I feel it could be an almost unanimous decisions everyone would want this feature. I personally am for this change and would love to hear some opinions of those who might be against it. Also is there actually anyone out there who does not use an authenticator? I know I have used one since 2008 when they implemented it. And it's already saved my account numerous times.

2) Updated Graphics / Models - This one I feel I might get some heat on. However please hear me out before passing judgement. Given the recent remastering of StarCraft. It's not entirely out of the realm of possibility that Blizzard is going through a phase of reinvestment of their product line. Meaning they just remastered one IP (Starcraft). And they just announced the desire to release a classic server. What makes people think that they would not remaster Classic and instead implement a highly outdated graphics model? I feel the game would benefit tremendously being able to explore the old zones once more. However augmented but not changed from the original version. I feel this is a pro and not a con. However I can understand the purist mentality of "No changes". That they want to experience Vanilla how it once was. However lets be rational here. It would be unrealistic for a billion dollar company to invest millions into an old IP. In an attempt to bring back the old Vanilla wow without some form of augmentation. As I personally stand I would love to experience vanilla again but through a new light. I feel experiencing vanilla wow with updated graphics would be beneficial and cannot see the negative beyond the obvious nostalgia. However I'm sure others differ from my opinion. So how would an updated graphics / models change the game play in a negative aspect?

3) WoW Tokens - Do I personally want them? Absolutely not. Do I feel WoW tokens are a good thing for WoW? As a whole yes. I believe WoW tokens benefit the community more then they take away from. I have been against and have not wanted WoW tokens since the first time they were announced. However you know what I hate more? gold farmers. And in Vanilla they were prominent. Do I think the vanilla community could benefit from having WoW tokens. Yes!. However I personally feel it takes away from the vanilla experience where it was much more difficult to attain gold. What would I like to see as an alternative to WoW tokens? No WoW tokens and blizzard would create better systems in place to better identify gold farmers and ban them for being the leaches they are. However I know this is a very unrealistic alternative. And given the success of WoW tokens in retail I feel Blizzard would be pushing in this direction. Given the pros and cons IMHO I hope blizzard stands strong and they do not implement WoW tokens and we somehow think of a more creative way to combat gold farmers.

TL;DR Lets be realistic. There will be inevitable changes to Vanilla WoW. But lets be rational in what those changes will be. Blizzard has stated they want to make sure to make no QoL or class balance changes. So lets think of potential changes that would make sense as whole and benefit the vanilla community and potentially augment a 13 year old game in a very subtle way.

1) Authenticators. Well, as much as I hate the idea of any changes, this doesn't affect gameplay or the vanilla experience at all. I see ZERO reason not to have authenticators when login in.

2) No, it would remove the charm and classic look of classic

3) GOD NO! Holy hell, the whole point of these servers is to get the vanilla experience. The effort of farming stuff for Attunement quests etc would be gone if this was allowed. If this happen then just shut down the servers.


We gotta remember though, that Blizzard likes gaming, they are proud of their games and they tend to listen somewhat to the players. They love being a big and liked company and they want to produce a good authentic game. I don't think they want tokens.

BUT

Blizzard love one thing more than anything else, and that is money. If WoW tokens in vanilla servers would be a profit, I am certain they screw over the players to make an extra buck

[draynay]

Tokens are a terrible idea, but I don't have a problem with updated graphics when I look at the computer hardware I have now vs. then.

[Dahij]

Everyone is bitching about tokens as if it was not possible to buy gold back in vanilla. Did you guys even play the actual retail vanilla? Anyone who wanted to buy gold could do it. The good thing about blizzard supplying that service is that it gets rid of all the retarded gold selling spam.

[ReVnX]

If earning gold will be as hard as it used to be, no one will be able to afford to pay the official market price for them in a very, very long time. Unless they enable character transfers from live to vanilla servers, which would screw up the economical balance immediately.

Heh, I hope they don't allow anything like that tbh. If people love vanilla so much, let them experience it in its fullest - starting as penniless beggars who need to run on foot until lvl 50-60 before they can afford to buy even the level 40 mount. No heirlooms, no chaffeurs, and struggling with 8-slot vendor bags.

I mean if they equated 500g Classic gold for the current value of the Token I would already be set for life if I wanted to. I hope this never happens

[Chaelexi]

Banning people is the way to combat gold sellers. Just because Blizz is selling the gold doesn't make it any better.
It doesn't remove any more gold from the market, no matter what it's spent on.
Earning your epic mount is much less epic when you can just swipe your credit card. Vanilla felt so good because you were rewarded for effort.
The token will put wallet warriors at a huge advantage versus those who spend time in-game to get something.

The entire token system is a money grab, it's not to combat gold sellers. Let's not kid ourselves.

When gold is spent on an epic mount that gold is removed from the market because it goes to a vendor gold sink.......Please explain how this gold is not removed.....

Banning people does nothing to stop gold selling, in vanilla everything went through the AH for gold selling so it was very hard to catch, there was not conversations with the gold seller. You would put your Character name, faction, Item you were selling in the AH(pick something you can get from a vendor) and server and they would tell you how much to put it up for(gold you purchased + AH cut) and they would go buy ti and an hour later you had your gold. There was no contact directly with the selling character. I knew many people that bought gold and the only one that got caught was the one who talked about it in G Chat.

You are not going to stop the act of selling gold, so there are the options of letting other people profit off of it and dealing with the fallout when people get ripped off....... or ...... cutting out the middle man and handling it in a way that is controlled, profitable to the company and slows the blackmarket side. This is the same as legalizing weed, make a licensed distribution network(the token) and then you can target the illegal blackmarket still but people will naturally move to the legal stores because you do not have to worry about getting busted.

Let's not kid ourselves the token has done an excellent job of combating gold sellers, yes it is a money grab with a great side effect.

[Kyanion]

Banning people is the way to combat gold sellers. Just because Blizz is selling the gold doesn't make it any better.
It doesn't remove any more gold from the market, no matter what it's spent on.
Earning your epic mount is much less epic when you can just swipe your credit card. Vanilla felt so good because you were rewarded for effort.
The token will put wallet warriors at a huge advantage versus those who spend time in-game to get something.

The entire token system is a money grab, it's not to combat gold sellers. Let's not kid ourselves.

Yes because Blizz had a wonderful track record of being prompt and decisive in banning gold sellers. There is nothing stopping a 'wallet warrior' from buying illegal gold either, you know. They just have a risk of being caught, which many people were willing to take as we all know.

[lockblock]

1. I'm not sure if they actually used authenticators during vanilla but it's clear the client had support for it as the private server Elysium somehow manages to make the client request one if you have it enabled for your account. This didn't require any hacks or mods to the official client either. I actually think authenticators should be mandatory even though some people will bitch.

2. I don't have a problem with updated graphics long as you can disable them for yourself.

3. I agree with the token being the lesser of 2 evils, however, I don't think it will be viable unless blizzard sells tokens themselves (Ie artificially create gold). I'm not ok with them creating/selling it.

[shifu]

That's not realistic now is it. I don't care which side of the fence you are on, anybody who thinks there will be exactly 0 changes between 2005 wow and classic servers is an idiot plain and simple.

The question is what is going to change and how noninvasive will they be?

Exactly! One can dream!

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Everyone is bitching about tokens as if it was not possible to buy gold back in vanilla. Did you guys even play the actual retail vanilla? Anyone who wanted to buy gold could do it. The good thing about blizzard supplying that service is that it gets rid of all the retarded gold selling spam.

This is very true. I must admit I bought several thousand gold back then. However I would never dream of buying gold now from a gold farmer. Have 13 years worth of shit I'm not ballsy enough to take a chance getting my account banned.

It is very true. Blizz supplies the service no gold farmers to deal with on the server or drastically reduced. Dont include this service and we hope to god Blizzard can identify gold farmers and ban them.

- - - Updated - - -

I'm not sure why everyone is so deadset on changing things. What's wrong with leaving it alone and as close to consistent with the original as humanly possible?

I dont want to change the game. I'm just being realistic. There will be changes. Lets home they are noninvasive as possible.

Fuck I would take Vanilla warts, gold farmers, and all if i could. But lets face it thats off the table.

[Army Dreamer]

1. Don't care.
2. OK.
3. 1 sub to rule them all.

[shifu]

I just love all these topics from people who think they have Unique and Special Insight™ on what's 'inevitably' coming with WoW classic.

Don't think I have a special or unique insight to anything. I'm simply addressing the classic server situation like the pragmatic individual that I am.

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authenticators did not exist in vanilla, it was added in late wrath

Yes I'm fully aware of that. And address that in my original post. Where I said "I know I have used one since 2008 when they implemented it."

[Soon-TM]

Yes because Blizz had a wonderful track record of being prompt and decisive in banning gold sellers. There is nothing stopping a 'wallet warrior' from buying illegal gold either, you know. They just have a risk of being caught, which many people were willing to take as we all know.

But it would destroy the economy nevertheless, for example by being able to suck the AH dry on strategic mats. It's not that this hypothetic Classic token gold will be used exclusively on mounts.

[Kyanion]

"...that's what the community wants"? As if there is a community that speaks with one voice and knows what it wants - if there was, why is everyone at everyone's throat about everything?

Woah woah woah, don't you come in here with your common sense! /s

- - - Updated - - -

But it would destroy the economy nevertheless, for example by being able to suck the AH dry on strategic mats. It's not that this hypothetic Classic token gold will be used exclusively on mounts.

I don't think you understand how the token works. It would not generate gold that is not already there. If a person buys a token and has it listed on the AH they don't get the gold instantly. Someone has to buy the token. If no one can afford said token then there is no economy to be destroyed. All it is doing is moving gold from one person to another.

In the situation with gold farmers, they are bots running 24/7 to make as much gold as possible in a short window and sell it to players. In a way it is actually generating more gold than is intended because they are playing outside of normal human limits. One is a controlled flow of gold from the tokens and the other is wildly chaotic, leads to people sometimes getting banned and the economy being messed with far more than a token. In fact it isn't even like retail in the sense that usually gold being bought from a token is being spent to buy things off the AH. In Vanilla it would likely be turned around into mount training/respec costs and other things that take the gold out of circulation.

I did my time in Vanilla and TBC (where gold botters got REALLY bad) and the game is cleaner now with many of them removed. If I thought Blizz was good enough to remove many or all bots and actually police things I'd be all for it. But you know the Blizz policy of letting them fester for months until they can do a mass sweep/removal. By then the economy has been fucked with and ruined for some AH players.

[thatguy181]

Authenticators are a sure thing. Vanilla WoW will run on the BNet client, Authenticators are tied to BNet, not WoW.

Updated graphics/models... I won't say that'll never happen, but I'd be fairly surprised in all honesty.

The WoW Token? Absolutely no way in hell is it going to be allowed on the vanilla servers unless Bliz does something even more crazy an defines Vanilla servers as their own unique region (and therefore not generating nearly 200k on a US Vanilla per token) You had to grind your little heart out for that first 1k gold to get that shiny epic mount. I'd be really surprised if that didn't make a return on classic servers (I personally will be grinding Briarthorn just like the old days)