Scrubbusters Going Horde - Player-Power Racials MUST be Removed!

[Dangg]

Racials mean like 1-2% at max and it only really matters on the top world guilds at that, no need to blow it out of proportion.

If you would rather play X race instead of the meta Y race for you class congrats your dps is now 1.881M instead of 1.9M, big woop imo.

Bollock. Many semi-HC or even casual players roll certain races because of their racials. You dont have to be a world class raider if you like to maximize your character in a RPG.

[Danuel]

Yeah, because top level guilds can't pull of a simple interrupt rotation.

Mid tier guild can handle interrupts without problems.

I always wonder - why blizz neglect facts about horde raididngs. We should have more impact on lore and allys players should be portrait as blood-hungry monsters - top pvpers and so on.

[Dangg]

Yeah, because top level guilds can't pull of a simple interrupt rotation.

Top level guilds do anything to make raid encounters easier and give them more leeway.

[Bloodmagix]

Bollock. Many semi-HC or even casual players roll certain races because of their racials. You dont have to be a world class raider if you like to maximize your character in a RPG.

I didn't say people don't do it at lower levels of raiding but what I'm saying is it's not really needed. If people need 1% dps to push through normal or heroic then it's not a race issue is it?

[Aphrel]

With Scrubbusters recent annoucement that they are going Horde, there are now ZERO Alliance guilds in the top 10 rankings.

The reason Scrubbusters gave was this
"Whenever you talk about hardcore raiding, you associate it with Horde. That has always been the case partly because of stronger racials, but also because there just always was a bigger and established community on the Horde side."

Why has it always the case that people associate Hardcore raiding with Horde? Because Horde have had stronger racials for Raiding for ages now.

Racials that affect player power are detrimental to the game and the raiding scene.

The only reason you should pick a race in this game is.
A) You like the look of it.

That's it. That's the only reason. Blizzard need to remove power racials in BfA.

Even if racials were fixed to be perfectly equal tomorrow, this trend will continue. The horde as a faction now provide a significant advantage when recruiting compared to alliance. Hardcore guilds will choose the path of least resistance which even with racials taken out of the equation is horde.

[Deleted]

or you know, alternatively, not require people to pay $50 per character to server+faction change. Blizzard's paid services have been flawed for years and the game would arguably be made better in its different areas if they weren't stingy about prices or had better ways to handle them (the token is was a start, but not enough).

Or just allow people to make mixed factions raids. Factions already team up lore wise to take down PVE threats.

What is unacceptable is that if you want to join a decent PVE guild that is recruiting your class you must (most likely) pay to transfer servers and maybe pay again to switch factions. Both services that had their prices increased a little while ago.

[HuxNeva]

If the racials didn't exist, the network affect would still in the long run favor the top raiding community gravitating towards a single faction.
Racial imbalances have a much more detrimental effect in competitive M+ btw.

[Teri]

I wouldn't mind if racials were only non-combat bonusses.

Gathering/Crafting/Experience/Rep gains.

Cosmetic stuff like 2-forms for Worgen & Their mount form.

Mobile Mailbox/Anvil/Bank summons.

Maybe add faster crafting to a +profession skill.

[Coldvibes]

Player power is very hardly the reason people are swapping now, durty summed it up pretty perfectly. M+ and raiding community is much more prominent horde side and that's just the truth. The damage for people switching factions was done a long time ago, and the only time where the Alliance had any prominence was when PvP was still pretty popular and you HAD to be human to be competitive.

As a player who recruited for Mythic raiding in an alliance guild, it is far more pronounced than you think it is. Once you become a recruitment officer for an alliance mythic guild you will fully understand just how much "unwilling to transfer because alliance" regardless of how good your progress is.

[Daedius]

Top raiding guilds scrutinize over every little detail, even if it's a 1% gain... for everyone else it is so miniscule it is barely worth noting.

Alliance have PvP oriented racials that are far more impacting, such as Human's EMFH hence why they were the most popular race for PvP.

[david0925]

Player power is very hardly the reason people are swapping now, durty summed it up pretty perfectly. M+ and raiding community is much more prominent horde side and that's just the truth. The damage for people switching factions was done a long time ago, and the only time where the Alliance had any prominence was when PvP was still pretty popular and you HAD to be human to be competitive.

As a player who recruited for Mythic raiding in an alliance guild, it is far more pronounced than you think it is. Once you become a recruitment officer for an alliance mythic guild you will fully understand just how much "unwilling to transfer because alliance" regardless of how good your progress is.

exactly this. I don't think it will trickle down enough to the N/H raiders for them to actually care, but from a Mythic raiding scene (~world 500, nothing too spectacular) it is very noticeable.

It is actually BECAUSE racials is balanced now that there is no incentive for people that went horde to go back, especially with the raiding community being much more established on that side now. I can kind of emphasize if Horde players held a grudge about Vanilla since Paladins were just so much stronger than Shaman back then, but after horde got Paladins in TBC the raiding population has been trickle in that direction ever since and has only gotten worse as racials get more balanced.

[VincentWolf]

Been saying this since I played on retail and that was last time back in early 2011. Amused to see that such an obvious thing is still not fixed for whatever weird, unknown to me reason.

[david0925]

Been saying this since I played on retail and that was last time back in early 2011. Amused to see that such an obvious thing is still not fixed for whatever weird, unknown to me reason.

to be fair. The only fix i can see is allow cross-faction raiding, and I don't know if that would piss off the community more than for the mythic raiders (minority of the minority) to just suck it up and transfer (which actually gives blizzard revenue). The fact that casual players don't actually care means Blizzard has even less of a reason to act.

[Marrilaife]

Mythic+ did a lot of harm to pve faction balance. Before you mostly looked in the perspective of your server - is it horde dominated or alliance dominated? Now mythic+ removed "server borders" while keeping faction split, so you can be on a dead server and it won't matter for grouping for m+ but if you're the "wrong" faction, well, you're screwed. Majority of high m+ community is horde.

And since lots of mythic raiders like to do m+ and vice versa, they converge on one faction for convenience.

Now look at pvp - same effect happened, and Blizzard took aggressive measures to keep pvpers drawn to both factions (like arena / rbg titles split per faction). But for pve? They don't care. Embrace the world of bloodelfcraft, resistance is futile. I really wonder if they will do anything with the racial before next MDI. Probably not, they'll leave it for the next expansion, if they do it at all.

As a player who recruited for Mythic raiding in an alliance guild, it is far more pronounced than you think it is. Once you become a recruitment officer for an alliance mythic guild you will fully understand just how much "unwilling to transfer because alliance" regardless of how good your progress is.

Yep, this. There is a domino effect that players who will never play in world top 10 guilds still flock to the servers where these top 10 guilds operate and to the faction these guilds play. A top guild moving away / into a server can create long term ripples far beyond their direct "recruitment base".

[Nyoken]

Yea i've been raiding in a top 20 guild and yea ... when ur up there it matters.... but if ur not... just relax and don't worry about it. Leave the racials alone.

[Cattleya]

If you think simply removing racials is going to make horde raiding guilds go alliance again, I've got bad news for you. Horde simply has more raiding guilds, making it more enticing to a new raider who doesn't have a guild yet, and it has more raiders in general, making it more enticing to guilds for recruitment.

The original cause for this was racials, yes, but it pretty much caused a domino effect of more and more raiders going horde, to the point where now it's not about the racials anymore (they largely fixed that already), but rather the pool of raiders.

Theoretically you could fix this by making alliance racials OP, forcing serious cutting edge guilds to transfer to Alliance, but obviously Blizzard's not going to do that.

[baskev]

You realise "top players" (hell, half of the guilds doing any sort of mythic these days) boost for gold and sell gold via tokens for battle net currency making it free right? It's also entirely possible they are normal humans and... *gasp* have a job!

I genuinely can't tell if you're joking or not with how stupid that comment actually is... Feel free to tell me it was sarcasm or something and I'll give you +1 Internet for getting me to reply!

And i can not decided if you are just being rude....

I am serious. Yes top players can pay for it with their jobs, raiding etc. But i am not talking about 1 hero. If you do this, most likely allot of your alts will come with you if not all of them. That means 8 to 10 hero's. 45 bucks per hero . Its doable with ingame money but it will cost you. And where to go? And this is for the top x guilds of the realm you are on. Not for the a bit less raiders, who if to much of them leave also need to pay to stay in the large pool of raiders.

[ThrashMetalFtw]

Been saying this since I played on retail and that was last time back in early 2011. Amused to see that such an obvious thing is still not fixed for whatever weird, unknown to me reason.

It (the racial imbalance) was fixed 3 years ago. The difference between the best and the worst racial (both factions) is less than 1%. The difference between the best Horde and best Ally racial is more like 0,1%, and that's different for every class

The racials are as close to balanced as they can possibly be, without actually removing them alltogether.


If you are talking about "fixing" the faction imbalance in terms of number of active hardcore raiders, the only solution would be to make Ally racials OP again, which is also a retarded idea.

[Bullettime]

Problem is it's a case of the damage already being done from years ago. The Horde simply has a much more entrenched hardcore PvE community due to the racials being broken in years past. It's just snowballed now where people who do want to play seriously will have a much easier time and much more options on Horde, so they flock there, and it's a cycle that pretty much endlessly feeds itself.

[Sylvaeres]

Oh good lord, there is less then a 1% difference between racials now, the only thing lately that made horde more attractive was rocket jump on KJ and that's more a utility racial then anything.

Leave the damn racials be, they've been nerfed enough already.

"Less than 1% difference" Arcane Torrent says hello