Scrubbusters Going Horde - Player-Power Racials MUST be Removed!

[Onikaroshi]

"Less than 1% difference" Arcane Torrent says hello

Only really valid for mythic+ and not something to switch over now... they're taking out the silence soon and this tier is over.

[Ehrenpanzer]

1% across 20 characters pushing for mythic world firsts makes a huge fucking difference...

Gee, I must have missed the Alliance brownnosers crying in WoD when literally EVERY SERIOUS PVPER IN THE FUCKING GAME xferred to Human for their insane fucking racials. Blizzard never has, and never will balance racials... one faction will ALWAYS have that slight % in either pvp or pve...

[cityguy193]

Only really valid for mythic+ and not something to switch over now... they're taking out the silence soon and this tier is over.

But its current iteration has been influencing rankings for expansions now. They can completely remove it, and there will be no difference, the damage is done. The only way for blizzard to fix this problem is to either gut every single horde racial, including the new allied racials for highmountains and nightborne, or buff up alliance racials so that they are clearly superior. This will allow the population of raiders and serious pvpers to stabilize.

Inb4 some idiot brings up 51% of casual players of alliance, so everything is "fine"

[Onikaroshi]

But its current iteration has been influencing rankings for expansions now. They can completely remove it, and there will be no difference, the damage is done. The only way for blizzard to fix this problem is to either gut every single horde racial, including the new allied racials for highmountains and nightborne, or buff up alliance racials so that they are clearly superior. This will allow the population of raiders and serious pvpers to stabilize.

Inb4 some idiot brings up 51% of casual players of alliance, so everything is "fine"

You can't even it out, if you gut the horde racials thereby making alliance racials the go to, competitive raiding moves to alliance and then has an alliance bias. Like you said, damage is done. It's extremely hard, probably impossible, to undo all those years of damage.

(And for the record, AT has had much less influence on the rankings over things like old Blood Fury and Berserking)

[cityguy193]

You can't even it out, if you gut the horde racials thereby making alliance racials the go to, competitive raiding moves to alliance and then has an alliance bias. Like you said, damage is done. It's extremely hard, probably impossible, to undo all those years of damage.

(And for the record, AT has had much less influence on the rankings over things like old Blood Fury and Berserking)

It takes expansions for the population to completely shift to the other side. Someone in this thread even said that Dwarves have the best healing racials already.
Alliance needs completely broken, over the top racials for several tiers. Something on the level of RJ goblin priests on KJ broken, but for multiple patches.

They should just take the blood elf racial, remove it from the horde side and give it to the lightforged. If it sounds over the top, thats because it is, and is what is needed to persuade people into switching. Both horde allied races already have 6 racials, and lightforged only has 5 anyways.

Once there is an even distribution of players across the factions for all levels of play, not just casual play, the alliance racials should be toned down to be within 1% of the horde racials again.

[ThrashMetalFtw]

"Less than 1% difference" Arcane Torrent says hello

Belfs aren't even the best race for a lot of classes. Arcane Torrent is good because of the extra AoE interrupt in M+, it's completely irrelevant in raids.

[FelPlague]

With Scrubbusters recent annoucement that they are going Horde, there are now ZERO Alliance guilds in the top 10 rankings.

The reason Scrubbusters gave was this
"Whenever you talk about hardcore raiding, you associate it with Horde. That has always been the case partly because of stronger racials, but also because there just always was a bigger and established community on the Horde side."

Why has it always the case that people associate Hardcore raiding with Horde? Because Horde have had stronger racials for Raiding for ages now.

Racials that affect player power are detrimental to the game and the raiding scene.

The only reason you should pick a race in this game is.
A) You like the look of it.

That's it. That's the only reason. Blizzard need to remove power racials in BfA.

horde have not allways had stronger racials
but heres the thing, blizzard and many other game devs have pointed this out

lets say we have two spells
frost bolt-damage 100
frostfire bolt-damage 101

Now frostfire is only 1 damage higher
but people will start using it, the hardcore will
and what you will see is on the websites tracking daamge you will see people using frostfirebolt far higher then frost bolt
not because frostfire is a TON more damage
but because those who are the best in the game will go there, making it seem scewed, making people think the bonus is higher then it really is

another example.
Affliction does 100,000 best possible
Demonology does 101,000 best possible
hardcore can pull 90%
casual pull 70%
but as time passes more and more players move to demonology, even though it is only 1% stronger, as the higher players move to demo, and only the weaker players stay on affliction, it makes it so all the websites like warcraft logs show demo MUCH higher, because only the hardcore are putting in parses for demo, and only casual are playing affliction
so now hardcore are doing demo ONLY showing demo at 90,100
and only the casuals are running affliction, only showing afflcition at 70,000
so yes well the difference is only 1% the people who then go to look at warcraft logs go "omfg demo is 20% stronger then afflcition! wow i better go demo"


this could take me 30 minutes to explain but i hope you get what the problem is
same with the horde thing
the horde bonus is only 1% but those hardcore guilds all go horde then, making it seem like the bonus is even more then it really is
and when all super hardcore players go horde, even more go horde, because they want to be around and able to play with the other hardcore players

if there was no faction seperation then the hardcore guilds would be alot more even, but its because if they wanna pug, or recruit from other guilds, they need to be on that faction and server. Why these people end up on this faction and these servers.


Legit could go half an hour explaining all this and how very minor increases can appear much larger. (Btw for yall who wanna doubt me, this is legit)

[Seramore]

I made the mistake of deciding to unhide FelPlague's post, what in the ungodly fuck did I just read.

Arcane Torrent ... it's completely irrelevant in raids.

u wot m8

[Collegeguy]

Go ahead and remove racials. Won't change that horde has the larger, stronger player base.

Just accept it. Horde won the war.

[Sylvaeres]

Only really valid for mythic+ and not something to switch over now... they're taking out the silence soon and this tier is over.

Yes but currently it's incredibly over powered in M+. The changes later will make it more even but still, as it stands, it's insanely good for pushing keys, which is something that balance needs to consider at all times

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Belfs aren't even the best race for a lot of classes. Arcane Torrent is good because of the extra AoE interrupt in M+, it's completely irrelevant in raids.

M+ does matter though, and it's more than just good, it's incredibly strong

[Mahmeya]

Now look at pvp - same effect happened, and Blizzard took aggressive measures to keep pvpers drawn to both factions (like arena / rbg titles split per faction). But for pve? They don't care. Embrace the world of bloodelfcraft, resistance is futile. I really wonder if they will do anything with the racial before next MDI. Probably not, they'll leave it for the next expansion, if they do it at all.

Maybe something along these lines for PvP could help, if X best M+ runs in a week got some bonus rewards and that was split between factions...

[Dizzeeyooo]

Now look at pvp - same effect happened, and Blizzard took aggressive measures to keep pvpers drawn to both factions (like arena / rbg titles split per faction). But for pve? They don't care.

the culmination of Blizzards efforts for pvp this expansion was a 75% drop in the number of people participating in ranked pvp compared to the end of WoD, but sure lets talk about Legion pvp changes as if they were a good thing for the game

[Marrilaife]

the culmination of Blizzards efforts for pvp this expansion was a 75% drop in the number of people participating in ranked pvp compared to the end of WoD, but sure lets talk about Legion pvp changes as if they were a good thing for the game

Which has nothing to do with splitting titles per faction or nerfing human racial, more with rng lootboxes instead of ye olde buy honor / conquest gear, prestige grind which is character bound not account bound and pvp templates that a lot of people complained about.

[Shadowsgrace]

Who bloody cares mate, one of the things Blizzard was proud of, when they developed World of Warcraft, was Racial perks. I think it was at the 2015 or 2016 Blizzcon, when asked about them. No they will never "get rid of them" get used to it.

[redwolfrain]

Lets just scrap every race but human and orc. Give them the same racial "Boring: Nothing special"

[Spotnick]

Maybe it's time all races can join the faction of their choice, like pandarens.

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Only really valid for mythic+ and not something to switch over now... they're taking out the silence soon and this tier is over.

The silence is really not the important part of arcane torrent.. as a healer, I love the mana back for sure.

[Gaaz]

Race performance for current BM hunter, equal gear etc... :

Remind me, why does anyone consider racials to be the deciding factor for switching to horde side?

[Onikaroshi]

Maybe it's time all races can join the faction of their choice, like pandarens.

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The silence is really not the important part of arcane torrent.. as a healer, I love the mana back for sure.

Oh, i'm not discounting that, the resource gain, however, is not something to nerf over. It's cool, but not OP.

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Race performance for current BM hunter, equal gear etc... :

Remind me, why does anyone consider racials to be the deciding factor for switching to horde side?

It has nothing to do with current racials, there was a MUCH larger gap pre-wod.

[Balir]

Annnnnnd they'll be back annnnnnnnd they'll all be Void Elves.....

I have a sneaky suspicion that Damage not interrupting spellcasting might be a little better than a 1% racial difference over a fight. I won't even mention the teleport

[Vulgrym]

This has nothing to do with racials anymore. It may have started that way, but they've been irrelevant from a power-gain perspective (for the most part) for some time.

There was enough of a raiding population discrepancy to cause a snowball effect during Legion. More raiders were Horde to begin with and then systems were introduced that made the faction-lock even more important (eg. your M+ circle). It's just logical for guilds to "chose the side" that gives them access to the significantly broader pool of players, as stated in the ScrubBusters message.

It'll just keep feeding on itself at this point. Blizzard's opportunity to address this has long passed.