Allied Races and the New Player Experience

[Powerogue]

I can kind of see what you're saying but I would expect people to fall in love with those allied races after having actually learned their story.

I still see what you're saying that people wanting to pick them for purely cosmetic reasons wouldn't be able to but there's really no easy solution to that. It's like if someone wanted to play a death knight but didn't have a level 58 character yet. What does blizzard say? Too bad!

[EbonBehelit]

I love how this community flip-flops between 'WoW hands us everything I miss the days when the game took effort' and 'omg this actually takes work QQ y i gotta work 4 this' whenever needed.

Yeah, it's almost like diversity of opinion or something. Or do you seriously think it's the exact same people saying both of these extremes?

So stop pretending that allied races are some uniquely unfair, terrible thing that might just be too much for those poor, unfortunate new players. A 'further blow to morale', seriously?

So you think I'm off-base (as I said in the OP I might be). I'm glad we had this discussion!

It was because of Blizzard's concern for the 'new player experience' that resulted in changes which are largely regarded as the dumbing down of the game. The easymode starting areas, the way which quests are conveniently laid out, the way that the game doesn't overwhelm you with spells and abilities and a ton of information, and just a ton of other changes. All the stuff people bitch about as making the game too easy, too catered-to-the-casuals, too dumb, blah blah. Things that people supposedly loved about classic/BC, supposedly changed and dumbed down for the sake of new players.

And now there's suddenly a crop of players crying "The allied races are so unreasonable! Think about the NEW PLAYERS, Blizzard!"... how convenient that it suits their narrative this time.

What a joke.

You have a serious chip on your shoulder, friend. Chill.

It's funny that you mention 'Blizzard's concern for new players dumbing down the game', since for the most part the game is harder now than it's ever been.
Besides, Blizzard's concern for new players is making levelling harder next expansion, so.... yay?

"Narrative". Lol.

[B]
seriously, you can tell how much people just want something to shit on, when the demon hunter and dk both having had level requirments was "oh cool" and now its "well fucking WE HAVE TO EARN STUFF FUCKING WTF, I WANT A GAME THAT I LOG ON AND EVERYTHING IS GIVEN TO ME"

Where did I say that I have a problem with how Allied Races unlock personally? I've already done all the requirements since I play the game, so it's not a huge deal for me. The actual point I was trying to make has fucking nothing to do with me. It's just a potential issue I'd thought about, so I figured I'd try to foster a little discussion.

For the record, I like this game. I just wish Blizzard would be a little more thoughtful sometimes: their heavy-handedness tends to leave the game sterile. That's another topic, though.

We really need one megathread for all the whining about having to play the game.

Again, I've already done all the requirements, so it doesn't bother me personally. Where was the whining again?

Jesus Christ, there are literally 3 thread about the same thing in the 6 "recent Forum posts" sections.

Look before making another whine thread, they already ready have enough threads full of idiots doing it.

The only thread on Allied Races I saw on the first 2 pages was specifically about whether the unlock requirements for Allied Races was just considering the expansion's price tag. This thread is only tangentially related to that.

What, did you think I didn't look first? This is my first ever thread, so I tried to at least do a little homework first.

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Also, as an end-note, and just to clarify: I have no real issue with how Allied Races are being introduced. I think recruiting more allies into your faction late-game - and tying that into your story - is a cool concept. But it's not flawless, and that's why I brought up the OP.

[Ornerybear]

i just feel like the op is trying to make this a "new player" problem, when in fact its a "i didn't get all my reps so I'll come up with another reason I should get this without trying" problem...

[Nefarious Tea]

You're entirely assuming that allied races will show up on the character creation screen if they haven't been unlocked.

[EbonBehelit]

i just feel like the op is trying to make this a "new player" problem, when in fact its a "i didn't get all my reps so I'll come up with another reason I should get this without trying" problem...

I literally say twice in the post just above yours that I'm fine on a personal level with the unlock requirements, and have already done them.

You're entirely assuming that allied races will show up on the character creation screen if they haven't been unlocked.

That idea had occurred to me too, though it's obviously up in the air how things will be done upon expac launch. This may a decent solution, though you then have potential confusion when newbies meet characters playing races that weren't even visible on character creation.

I'm probably overthinking this since what race my characters are is a matter of enormous importance to me, due to their animations and how gear sits on their models.

[Flarelaine]

You're entirely assuming that allied races will show up on the character creation screen if they haven't been unlocked.

They may appear greyed out, like classes that do not match your selected race.

[Beastnar]

Also, as an end-note, and just to clarify: I have no real issue with how Allied Races are being introduced. I think recruiting more allies into your faction late-game - and tying that into your story - is a cool concept. But it's not flawless, and that's why I brought up the OP.

I feel sorry for you OP. The fact that so many people ignites an accusative shitstorm of putting words into your mouth is disgusting, simply for pointing out an issue and attempting to have a discussion about it.

[Khrux]

Why does anyone care what happens to new players? Its nice to see people claim they already have the reqs and are only white knighting for a theoretical "new player" but honestly who cares?

If Blizzard value player acquisition enough, they'll make necessary changes to support that business strategy. In my opinion, in recent times its clear Blizzard have chosen to focus on player retention and churn rather than player acquisition. This is only further supported by the decision to apply reqs that are beneficial to people actually playing the game now or returning to the game now, not in anyway beneficial to brand new customers that have never played WoW before (which are likely the tiniest piece of both WoW and Blizzard revenue)

Afterall, when you have a 15yr old game, you focus on holding onto the customers you have instead of trying to find the small % of the market that have somehow not tried WoW or have lived in a cave for 15yrs.


TLDR; stop creating duplicate threads with the "won't someone think of the children" theme, its not your concern how Blizzard balance retention versus acquisition. The only reason to post this question(as many keep accusing posters of) is to hide behind the "new player problem" as a means to argue against having to put in effort for themselves.

[Kieldon]

Oh, cool, another thread about this.

[Geckoo]

In my opinion the requirements for the 4 first allied races only make sense as something released months before the actual game, as something targeted to current players. But once BFA is out, i think that the level requirement to start the quest to unlock those races should be 20, with no reputations involved at all.

Why does anyone care what happens to new players? Its nice to see people claim they already have the reqs and are only white knighting for a theoretical "new player" but honestly who cares?

I honestly do.

If i have to convince a friend to play WoW or to return back to WoW after a long time. It's not easy to sell them the idea that before they can make that new race they like so much they must first level up a different toon to lvl 110, grind the hell out of certain reputation and then level up again a new character from 20 to 120 just to join me in the fun stuff.

I've already lived that situation with FFXIV. I convinced a few friends to play the game, they liked it, they enjoyed it... but the massive wall that is the story quests at level 50 blocking them from leveling on new zones or even being able to choose the class they wanted to play just made them leave. It was not hard, just boring quests designed as patch content quests back in the day that lined up become a tedious long task that make you question if it's worth your time... and for a new player is usually not worth it.

[setsuna f seiei]

Thinking about the whole Allied Race system, and how they unlock, has raised a serious issue in my mind: "What about the new players?

Can you imagine being a fresh newbie, sitting on the character creation screen? Seeing the race options laid out before you as you create your first ever character? What if your heart is set on being a Void Elf, Dark Iron Dwarf, or Zandalari Troll?

Not being able to create one's first character the way they see fit means many new players may in fact be forced to have their first ever character be a 'throwaway' of sorts, in order to unlock the race/s they actually want to play. This could be a major demotivating factor for new players and cause issues with new player retention, in my opinion.

Am I off-base here? Perhaps a discussion can be had.

Pretty sure this would only apply to "returning" players and not "new" players.

A "New player" could want to play a panda but also want to play druid / dk but can't? Say said new player wants to play a demon hunter or death knight and then reads "sorry" you must have a char above 100 to unlcok this class.

Plus, if it's their "first" every wow experience I'm 99% sure they won't be that worried over playing a different version of a class already in game. but I could be wrong.

[Deleted]

Am I off-base here? Perhaps a discussion can be had.

yes, you are otherwise you would have mentioned dks and dhs.

- - - Updated - - -

A "New player" could want to play a panda but also want to play druid / dk but can't? Say said new player wants to play a demon hunter or death knight and then reads "sorry" you must have a char above 100 to unlcok this class.

#1 the restriction for dks was lifted
#2 its ONLY 70 to make a dh please stop spreading the 100 uninformant

[Soulwind]

For one, allied races are on a separate screen than the others, and it's possible the button to see them isn't available until you have a 110 character, so new players won't even know they're there until they can unlock them.

But let's follow the thought process behind them.

1). There are 6 new races instead of one or two, largely because they sacrificed their starting zones.

2). Even without a starting zone, some introduction is necessary.

3). Since the resources were spent into making six of them, that introduction has to use existing content (zones, quests, reputations) for the most part.

4). The existing content is only available to 100-110 characters, so whatever minor questchain is added on top of it must be as well.

5). As a result of there being six of them, and probably as a design choice based on the fact that they're the only races in the game with special requirements, they're not too unique or fancy, so that players who don't find them appealing enough don't feel like they're missing out.

6). Since they're much more optional, and less unique than normal races, an additional reward is added for leveling a character of their race to a certain level: Heritage armor.

[onesBronson]

Back in MoP, Blizzard made a change so that "any" race was playable from the get go, no need for said expansion to play them. Blood Elves, Draenai, Goblins, Worgen, and Pandaren were all playable no matter which version of WoW you owned. Trial accounts included.

Now, it looks to be that Allied Races are part of a new concept. One which focuses on progression that rewards new playable races.

[setsuna f seiei]

yes, you are otherwise you would have mentioned dks and dhs.

- - - Updated - - -


#1 the restriction for dks was lifted
#2 its ONLY 70 to make a dh please stop spreading the 100 uninformant

my mistake, I wasnt sure what it was but I knew there was some restriction. my point was the past explains had restrictions in some fashion, this time it's not level locked it's rep locked but you can still play the basic race (as a new player) and I stand behind being 99% sure a new player isnt going to flip out because they can't play a different version of a race already in game.

[Deleted]

Back in MoP, Blizzard made a change so that "any" race was playable from the get go, no need for said expansion to play them. Blood Elves, Draenai, Goblins, Worgen, and Pandaren were all playable no matter which version of WoW you owned. Trial accounts included.

Now, it looks to be that Allied Races are part of a new concept. One which focuses on progression that rewards new playable races.

All the older races have their own starting zone and you start at level 1. Not so with allied races.

[Beastnar]

yes, you are otherwise you would have mentioned dks and dhs.

Then you should have read a bit further down, where he discussed it in a comment

[FelPlague]

Back in MoP, Blizzard made a change so that "any" race was playable from the get go, no need for said expansion to play them. Blood Elves, Draenai, Goblins, Worgen, and Pandaren were all playable no matter which version of WoW you owned. Trial accounts included.

Now, it looks to be that Allied Races are part of a new concept. One which focuses on progression that rewards new playable races.

to be fair, once mop launched they also removed old expansions as a concept.
up until mop you needed to buy each expansion, only a few bucks, or buy the warchest
but once mop came you just needed to buy "the game" and then the "current expansion" if you bought only the game, and never bought the new expansion, lets say you bought just the base game during mop, you have all up to cata, cant get pandas, but everything else good. Then wod comes out, mop is now not the current expansion, and is added to the base game, so you havent bought mop, but you now own it, and can make monks and pandas, then legion comes out, you own base game, wod becomes part of base game, you can then go to draenor. Banm. So "no need for said expansion" yeah no.
that is false that you did not need to buy MoP to play a pandaren, you did need MoP to make a panda.

[Nefarious Tea]

That idea had occurred to me too, though it's obviously up in the air how things will be done upon expac launch. This may a decent solution, though you then have potential confusion when newbies meet characters playing races that weren't even visible on character creation.

I'm probably overthinking this since what race my characters are is a matter of enormous importance to me, due to their animations and how gear sits on their models.

It's hard to say, isn't it? We have no idea right now since all the press previews we've gotten show character creations screens where only Allied races showed up - the normal 13 weren't even listed.

[CreatureLives]

New players won't even care about the Allied Races for a long time. There is still a lot of other things in game for them to experience.

Allied Races are only a big deal to us because we've been playing the same shit over and over since Mists of Pandaria and even that was cheap because it was only 1 race instead of 2. You'd really have to go all the way back to Cataclysm in 2010/2011 to see the last time we got multiple playable races in an expansion. This doesn't mean new players can't enjoy the Allied stuff but they'll be focused on learning the actual game, playing the new expansion, making their main the best it can be, going through old content and maybe even trying out the races that already exist. There is already going to be a lot of new shit for them to do when they start playing when for us there won't be as much. Allied Races isn't even a big selling point of the new expansion to the new players. They literally start at level 20 so it's not like there will be a ton of new content. It really is just a bonus for people who have played a lot of content and want something new to do.

Blizz will probably remove the rep part of earning them at the end of BFA/beginning of the expansion after and just make it so you have to do the quests and if that's all you gotta do then you can get through it in less than a day. When new players go and do those zones they can just pretend they are the starting areas. You do the old content so you can experience those allied race's stories and then when you finally do get your Allied Race you skip ahead 20 levels so it evens out. I don't really see the problem.