[Megathread] Destiny

[Gorsameth]

Whelp, that update doesn't read very promising. Also don't get why it would take so much time and effort to post it when its mostly just a summery of their internal roadmap.
Love that they are still trying to claim the XP scaling was a bug, and now complain that its slower then intended when they doubled xp required...

Comparing a post like this with what CA put out last month for Total War the contrast is rather stark. https://www.totalwar.com/blog/warham...lopment-update
Admitting mistakes made, explaining why their plans are the way they are ect.

[Bugg]

I feel like Bungie or whoever is at the wheel there is just too slow/dump/doesn't give a fuck.
It's 2018. The consumers of this kind of product (at this kind of price) have Expectations that should have been met or at least acknowledged years ago.
Still lessons were not learned, the "patches" that we are both too slow and too late. We should be getting:
- more content that's FUN
- more new shit (GOOD Exotics, Cool skins, secrets, new game modes, you know, something NEW)
- more 'old content' like all the D1 planets, raids, etc!

In staid we are still STILL waiting for patches that promise to fix/make a little more enjoyable something that we paid for long ago.

Personally I really did not think that the lessons of D1 + the money that they must have + all the community support and so on would result in such a product. I really didn't.
I was a great supporter of D1 and D2, I know how the software industry works, how long is the SDLC and how complicated it can be. But fuck I had enough.

I may return to D2 sometimes in the FAR future, when the game will offer me the entertainment I am looking for.
But it won't be soon.
Maybe they will prove me wrong. Maybe not.

All this from a casual player with very limited play time. If I'm this upset, one that can play daily for hours must be... I think he/she left the game long ago. I just reached this threshold recently.

[Edge-]

Have to agree with you. I was considering buying Osiris, but still on the fence. The magic has faded from D1. Its like they forgot what ended up making the first one good and threw it all away.

I can't say I recommend it. Pretty light on content overall - campaign was kinda meh IMO, Mercury is an absolute joke with a single public event, Infinite Forest is a massive missed opportunity, Strikes aren't terribly exciting (one is literally just a campaign mission), can't speak to the Nightfall/Raid but I've heard the Raid is good, at least. The new weapons and armor are alright, but it feels pretty damn underwhelming for a $20 DLC.

- no plan on making adventures/lost sectors/patrols useful
- no queue/LFG tool ingame for group activities

Agreed so hard. I have no clue what the sandbox team is actually doing, because outside of some minor balance tweaks at season changes we're not seeing anything. If there are more than 2 people on that team I'd be positively shocked. And agreed on the lack of proper LFG tools, thought they did say that they'll address "guided games" in Fall so...it's something : |

- chat only in Tower is nice but not enough

In the more immediate, clan chat is supposedly coming in Spring. It's still nowhere near enough (should be planetary chat and more robust chat systems for strike teams) but again...it's something : |

- masterwork armor damage reduction may be nice if you have high uptime of your super, but is very weak for the opposite situation (and makes the 1 hit nuke hunter exotic useless which i'm using and it's the best i can use)

Yeah, doesn't seem to do anything to help void locks and some other specs, or will be of very limited use. It also further encourages folks to use masterwork legendaries for higher ultimate uptime instead of exotics, and we're not getting masterwork exotics until fall.

- no mention about making exotics better

Exotic weapons and armor are receiving a comprehensive design pass to ensure they stand out from the rest of the gear and offer new, exciting, powerful ways to play.

From their list of bullets for "spring".

- no mention about making itemization overall better
- no mention in making classes/specs more interesting and gameplay more differentiated

Yeah, I think this was kinda pie-in-the-sky thinking on our part, even if many of us believe it to be absolutely necessary. It would require essentially reworking large parts of the core game design/direction that touch the entire game. Sure sucks that there was nothing about them even considering expanding specs to make them more interesting this year : /

Also timing. Slow as hell for this kind of stuff that needed to be in game from the start, february update doesn0t brung much to the table and the rest is dissolved into a year of nothingness.

Literally D3 again all over the place, just from another company.

A different kind of bad, but I get the sentiment. D3 was a million easily avoidable mistakes that the dev team was loudly warned about by hardcore ARPG/D2 fans for months/years leading up to launch, but they thought they knew better and shit the bed. D2 is Bungie literally making many of the same mistakes from D1 while also finding all new ways to fuck up. And they still don't seem to really publicly admit their screw ups, outside of personal social media posts, which is one of the worst things.

Comparing a post like this with what CA put out last month for Total War the contrast is rather stark. https://www.totalwar.com/blog/warham...lopment-update
Admitting mistakes made, explaining why their plans are the way they are ect.

Jesus...BUNGIE, THIS IS HOW YOU APOLOGIZE FOR SCREWING UP AND MAKE IT LOOK LIKE YOU ACTUALLY CARE ABOUT THE COMMUNITY. It's not that bloody hard.

This sure as hell isn't the same Bungie that gave us the Halo games that folks loved so much, and it doesn't even seem like the same Bungie that turned around Destiny 1 and made it into the incredible game it apparently ended up being : /

[dope_danny]

This sure as hell isn't the same Bungie that gave us the Halo games that folks loved so much, and it doesn't even seem like the same Bungie that turned around Destiny 1 and made it into the incredible game it apparently ended up being : /

Thats because its not. Most are gone and former interns are in charge. D2's lead is not the former halo lead who worked on D1. its the guy who thought up eververse and said 'you will throw money at the screen when you see these emotes' when people learned TTK would lock players out of existing content.

History repeats.

[Beazy]

Meh. I feel duped spending 60 dollars on Destiny 2 now.


60 dollars wasted on a generic Hype train again.

[Edge-]

Meh. I feel duped spending 60 dollars on Destiny 2 now.


60 dollars wasted on a generic Hype train again.

As disappointed as I am with what's going on right now I feel I got plenty of value out of my $50 preorder and $35 season pass, even if the first DLC was underwhelming and the second is apparently a ways off. Sunk plenty of time into it initially on my two characters and got plenty of value before getting frustrated with Bungie's bungling and the games issues.

Just a shame they're leaving so much potential on the table : (

[Beazy]

Just a shame they're leaving so much potential on the table : (

Honestly, that's the one sentence that sums up the destiny2 experience. The Destiny engine is so good. What a waste. . . just like GW2.

[Yunru]

They realy didnt tell you guys much. I fell kinda sorry for you.

[Dhrizzle]

<snip>

They realy didnt tell you guys much. I fell kinda sorry for you.

Okay I'm now 99.9% convinced Yunru is a YouTube bot, just can't quite figure out if they're generally promoting YouTube gaming channels or one particular YouTuber with occasional others thrown in to make them seem less of an obvious shill.

OT: Destiny 2 seems to be a lot like WoW: WoD at the moment. I enjoy the core gameplay and there's quite a bit of stuff I'd like to do, but seemingly zero incentive to actually get out and do any of it. Patrols and the other open-world things are fun - and in terms of having fun I definitely feel I got my money's worth from the game overall - but I get the feeling they could do more with what's in the game to keep players coming back, even if it's only in short bursts to do dailies or weeklies or whatever,

[Gorsameth]

Okay I'm now 99.9% convinced Yunru is a YouTube bot, just can't quite figure out if they're generally promoting YouTube gaming channels or one particular YouTuber with occasional others thrown in to make them seem less of an obvious shill.

OT: Destiny 2 seems to be a lot like WoW: WoD at the moment. I enjoy the core gameplay and there's quite a bit of stuff I'd like to do, but seemingly zero incentive to actually get out and do any of it. Patrols and the other open-world things are fun - and in terms of having fun I definitely feel I got my money's worth from the game overall - but I get the feeling they could do more with what's in the game to keep players coming back, even if it's only in short bursts to do dailies or weeklies or whatever,

WoW atleast still has raid progress in between patches. Destiny's raid doesn't last even remotely as long.

[Baconeggcheese]

I actually haven't even done the raid lair despite it being the only thing people seemed to like in the new xpac because I was starting to get busy around that time and just haven't had the motivation to go back and do it cause... why? I didn't hear about any of the equipment from there being exciting and you get ilvl way too fast just doing weeklies n stuff that who cares.

I wouldn't compare it to wod though, wod had great raids that were still as relevant as ever, the difference was all the non-raid rewards were funneled through the mission table which left you without anything to do after you sent out your missions and finished your raids. You still got rewards every day that were relevant by sending out missions, there was just nothing else to do. I actually enjoyed wod, I got a lot of gaming in with other games during that time while still getting my raiding fix every week.

Destiny on the other hand is almost the opposite, there isn't a reason to do the raids besides for the sake of it and accelerating getting to cap. You're actually pushed to do everything else as well with the milestones, which is the polar opposite of wods mission table problem, but it just doesn't take that long to bang out all the milestones and then there's no reason to log in for the rest of the week wereas with the mission table you still want to log in every day albeit just to send out those missions.

[Yunru]

Okay I'm now 99.9% convinced Yunru is a YouTube bot, just can't quite figure out if they're generally promoting YouTube gaming channels or one particular YouTuber with occasional others thrown in to make them seem less of an obvious shill.

OT: Destiny 2 seems to be a lot like WoW: WoD at the moment. I enjoy the core gameplay and there's quite a bit of stuff I'd like to do, but seemingly zero incentive to actually get out and do any of it. Patrols and the other open-world things are fun - and in terms of having fun I definitely feel I got my money's worth from the game overall - but I get the feeling they could do more with what's in the game to keep players coming back, even if it's only in short bursts to do dailies or weeklies or whatever,

I am a robot...see my gears.
There are only 3-4 youtubers that i know that they look at shady practices. At least those that made a good point.
Unless you want me to link blogs:
http://dragonchasers.com/2017/09/20/...y-2-be-a-scam/
The “right” way for me to play Destiny 2 appears to be to log in for an hour on Tuesday after the reset, do the Flashpoint and then set the game aside for a week.

But problem with those is that they are outdated or imposible to find. And big game sites usualy dont report on those.
The most recent thing i could find is this:
https://www.bungie.net/en/Forums/Pos...&page=0&path=1
There is probaly more, but anything new gets moderated before we can even see it. Youtube is simpy the best source of info we got right now.

[Edge-]

Unless you want me to link blogs:
http://dragonchasers.com/2017/09/20/...y-2-be-a-scam/

But what feels the most scam-ish to me is this semi-hard block they’ve put on progression.

Three days of playing netted me a power increase of 1.

...that pushed me from 267 to 272 — 5 points in an hour as opposed to 1 point in 3 days.

OK complete honesty: there’s a ton of stuff I haven’t done

So circling back to the “scam” argument, I just don’t feel like Bungie has given us enough to warrant a $60 price tag.

Some choice excerpts

This is the kind of in depth, stunning analysis that we can expect? This piece is one of the most ignorant whines I've read in a long, long while. Why on earth are you reading this nonsense? It's devoid of any analysis, filled with guesses and suppositions, whiney as all hell, and the author routinely undermines their argument that it's a "scam"

Jesus, I could spend all day dissecting how awful this blog post is and why nobody should ever take it seriously.

But problem with those is that they are outdated or imposible to find. And big game sites usualy dont report on those.

Report on what, ignorant blog posts proclaiming the game a scam without actually backing it up with arguments that stand up to a stiff breeze?

The most recent thing i could find is this:
https://www.bungie.net/en/Forums/Pos...&page=0&path=1
There is probaly more, but anything new gets moderated before we can even see it. Youtube is simpy the best source of info we got right now.

So...uninformed randoms whining? Curse of Osiris is underwhelming as all hell, but calling it the worst DLC ever and using that as "proof" the game is a scam?

Dude, you really need to get better sources of information than complete randoms in forums/personal blogs.

[Yunru]

Some choice excerpts

This is the kind of in depth, stunning analysis that we can expect? This piece is one of the most ignorant whines I've read in a long, long while. Why on earth are you reading this nonsense? It's devoid of any analysis, filled with guesses and suppositions, whiney as all hell, and the author routinely undermines their argument that it's a "scam"

Jesus, I could spend all day dissecting how awful this blog post is and why nobody should ever take it seriously.



Report on what, ignorant blog posts proclaiming the game a scam without actually backing it up with arguments that stand up to a stiff breeze?




So...uninformed randoms whining? Curse of Osiris is underwhelming as all hell, but calling it the worst DLC ever and using that as "proof" the game is a scam?

Dude, you really need to get better sources of information than complete randoms in forums/personal blogs.

The problem is getting those. (every big gaming site that i read gives them positive feedback, but those are un-trusteable)
The latest news i could find is this:
http://www.pcgamer.com/bungie-outlin...iny-2-in-2018/

But problem is that people want them to remove the ever-crap in 1.st place. Not the hotfixes. They dont listen to their community at all.

[Dhrizzle]

I am a robot...see my gears.
There are only 3-4 youtubers that i know that they look at shady practices. At least those that made a good point.
Unless you want me to link blogs:
http://dragonchasers.com/2017/09/20/...y-2-be-a-scam/
The “right” way for me to play Destiny 2 appears to be to log in for an hour on Tuesday after the reset, do the Flashpoint and then set the game aside for a week.

But problem with those is that they are outdated or imposible to find. And big game sites usualy dont report on those.
The most recent thing i could find is this:
https://www.bungie.net/en/Forums/Pos...&page=0&path=1
There is probaly more, but anything new gets moderated before we can even see it. Youtube is simpy the best source of info we got right now.

The big problem seems to be you looking at click-bait that tries to paint it as "shady" or "a scam." Really it's either poor design or bad implementation (depending on whether Bungee really thought it was a satisfactory system or they fucked up trying to make something better) compounded by the fact it has similar problems to the previous version of the game, and you get that impression from articles on the mainstream sites.

My problem with the youTube videos is they just seem to target whatever controversy will garner the most clicks, then drone on about it for way too long without giving any decent incites. The bot comment comes from your habit of just dropping videos (often from the same guy) with really generic comments.

- - - Updated - - -

WoW atleast still has raid progress in between patches. Destiny's raid doesn't last even remotely as long.

WoW also has the advantage of new content coming for free so lapsed players are more likely to come back, the paid "DLC" expansions are more like a full sequel where you can get your money's worth even if the endgame sucks. If Destiny had given me a reason to log in every week then I would have probably grabbed Osiris but as it is I moved on and don't see much reason to go back when there are so many games vying for my attention.

[RobertoCarlos]

The problem is getting those. (every big gaming site that i read gives them positive feedback, but those are un-trusteable)
The latest news i could find is this:
http://www.pcgamer.com/bungie-outlin...iny-2-in-2018/

But problem is that people want them to remove the ever-crap in 1.st place. Not the hotfixes. They dont listen to their community at all.

Only person you can trust is yourself. Letting critics decide what you should and shouldnt do for entertainment has never made sense to me. Its subjective someones enjoyment anyway. Yes you can judge the quality but quality doesnt mean it hit the intended effect of the artwork. And after watching game reviewers like this one



I'm not even sure they could understand the effect even if it was following them home one night

What do you think the intended effect was for someone playing destiny 2? For me I would guess "increased monetization through engrams and online competitive play" and by this being the focus they ended up ruining their intended effect because the player base just dropped off and didnt stick around to be whales so I would give destiny 2 a F in all categories it can be judged on.

[Edge-]

The problem is getting those. (every big gaming site that i read gives them positive feedback, but those are un-trusteable)
The latest news i could find is this:
http://www.pcgamer.com/bungie-outlin...iny-2-in-2018/

However there’s little here that immediately jumps out as being a game-changer. Most of these improvements are basic quality of life things which should have been included in the first place, or returning features from the original game which were inexplicably cut for the sequel.

Literally what, did you even read the article? Genuine question. Most of it is dealing with reporting on the contents of the dev update, and it finishes on a not terribly optimistic note.

What are your specific issues with the piece?

But problem is that people want them to remove the ever-crap in 1.st place. Not the hotfixes. They dont listen to their community at all.

That's never happening. Period. And anyone that thinks it will is fooling themselves. It's sticking around, and honestly the changes they announced to rewards via Eververse vs. gameplay sound like a much, much better balance.

What are you problems, other than the unreasonable and never gonna happen desire to remove Eververse entirely?

[Yunru]

The big problem seems to be you looking at click-bait that tries to paint it as "shady" or "a scam." Really it's either poor design or bad implementation (depending on whether Bungee really thought it was a satisfactory system or they fucked up trying to make something better) compounded by the fact it has similar problems to the previous version of the game, and you get that impression from articles on the mainstream sites.

My problem with the youTube videos is they just seem to target whatever controversy will garner the most clicks, then drone on about it for way too long without giving any decent incites. The bot comment comes from your habit of just dropping videos (often from the same guy) with really generic comments.

- - - Updated - - -



WoW also has the advantage of new content coming for free so lapsed players are more likely to come back, the paid "DLC" expansions are more like a full sequel where you can get your money's worth even if the endgame sucks. If Destiny had given me a reason to log in every week then I would have probably grabbed Osiris but as it is I moved on and don't see much reason to go back when there are so many games vying for my attention.

Its true that youtubers make it clickbait, but some on them do for a reason. To tell you to save your money.
But other reason that they use this is because youtube search sucks.

I generaly dont post larger posts when i link a video, since its explained in video. Just a basics of the content if you dont like to click. (if its a long one)
But every time i make a long post, people ask me for a proff, i link them video where i found info and they keep asking me for more (since they never watch those).

If you know any youtuber that doesnt post crap and clickbait, but also adds a great info let me know.
I know 3 good ones (sid, this guy and jim) and 20 bad ones.

- - - Updated - - -

Literally what, did you even read the article? Genuine question. Most of it is dealing with reporting on the contents of the dev update, and it finishes on a not terribly optimistic note.

What are your specific issues with the piece?



That's never happening. Period. And anyone that thinks it will is fooling themselves. It's sticking around, and honestly the changes they announced to rewards via Eververse vs. gameplay sound like a much, much better balance.

What are you problems, other than the unreasonable and never gonna happen desire to remove Eververse entirely?

Problem is that game is build araund it. And those *changes* are like the Ea waiting for people to cooloff and forget abauth it.
If they were trusted, they would disable the real money purchases till they *fix* it. But that wont happen.

[Edge-]

Problem is that game is build araund it.

No they didn't, that's an unsupportable allegation. They emphasized it too much, absolutely, and they acknowledge that in the letter and lay out how they're going to spread out rewards outside of Eververse to de-emphasize that.

And it's a pretty good solution.

And those *changes* are like the Ea waiting for people to cooloff and forget abauth it.

I get it, you're just looking for reasons to be outraged/offended. That doesn't make any of them reasonable by any measure.

If they reverse course, the community will revolt. Again.

If they were trusted, they would disable the real money purchases till they *fix* it. But that wont happen.

So...you're not going to address what issues you had with the PC Gamer article?

Yunru, are you ever going to actually try to engage in discussion like...ever? It's frustrating trying to have a discussion with you only to have you ignore 99% of what I actually write and then link to random shit that has little to nothing to do with the discussion we're trying to have.

Its true that youtubers make it clickbait, but some on them do for a reason. To tell you to save your money.

This is a lie. They do it for the same reason press do - to get clicks and generate money.

But other reason that they use this is because youtube search sucks.

It has issues, but this is false. If their content is good, they'll pop up highly in searches. But they rely on clickbait and ignorant viewers to get those views instead.

I generaly dont post larger posts when i link a video, since its explained in video. Just a basics of the content if you dont like to click. (if its a long one)
But every time i make a long post, people ask me for a proff, i link them video where i found info and they keep asking me for more (since they never watch those).

When have you ever made a longer post? And yeah, it's hard to sift through a 20 minute video of some guy ranting and raving about X to try to find what you're talking about : /

[Zephyr Storm]

Pretty good video talking about the development update:



Basically, all of the shit Bungie is talking about is too little, too late. We’ve been here before with Destiny 1 and we are repeating history with Destiny 2. Bungie’s lost the goodwill and forgiveness of the community. They launched the game in a half baked state and we won’t be getting the game we should have received until Fall 2018 at the earliest. And this is coming from Triplewreck, a big time PvPer from D1 who strongly supported the game.