Horde won the development battle for the elves.

[Beloren]

/\ wtf dude, chill

i'm quite chilled, though Belves aren't known for it.

[Fyersing]

The horde is the home for those who love liberalism and diversity that strengthens the alliance is the home for stagnating bigots and fascists with a very hypocritical holier than thou self righteous attitude that stinks of discrimination, segregation and all the worth things in our societies like racism, homophobia etc

The irony of this statement when we consider Garrosh and Sylvanas, a former and current Warchief, who are often depicted as being overtly racist.

[Kw1]

Wow is now humans vs blood elves. It wasn't the best "win" for orcs and trolls.

[Beloren]

@Fyersing. What’s so ironical? The horde actually progresses in a good direction too. The alliance just gets worse and worse. It really is terrible. Nothing like SWTOR where despite so much stuff happening in the two factions you love the story of both. You could literally cut the alliance out of wow story as a player faction and they’d be more interesting as an NPC faction. The better parts of the story characters, themes and writing are horde, but even they aren’t that great. Which says something.

Alliance is stagnating and terrible. Horde just gets better. Garrosh is gone and Sylvannas is quite progressive. She isn’t racist I mean her group are mostly humans and she is the first female leader of a faction too and the horde respect her as they have any warchief

[Khirok]

/\ wtf dude, chill

This is the future of the Horde playerbase.

[Syegfryed]

@Fyersing. What’s so ironical? The horde actually progresses in a good direction too. The alliance just gets worse and worse. It really is terrible. Nothing like SWTOR where despite so much stuff happening in the two factions you love the story of both. You could literally cut the alliance out of wow story as a player faction and they’d be more interesting as an NPC faction. The better parts of the story characters, themes and writing are horde, but even they aren’t that great. Which says something.

Alliance is stagnating and terrible. Horde just gets better. Garrosh is gone and Sylvannas is quite progressive. She isn’t racist I mean her group are mostly humans and she is the first female leader of a faction too and the horde respect her as they have any warchief

The horde is in a downfall since MOP, the main races forgot and in the dumpster, they keep putting elves in there and there is no progress on this

I mean even the elves are in a downfall, back in TBC they are rly cool, now they are just the generic elves devoted of the light, Liadrin is a Abomination, and the interesting elves like Rommanth and Lorthemar are forgotten to give her screentime.

And yes sylvanas is racist, especially about trolls

[ManiaCCC]

And yes sylvanas is racist, especially about trolls

Well, history of elves and trolls is as it is so it is not surprising, but she doesn't look like racists to me. Her race were most of the time under watch, distrusted, forsaken were from the beginning the race, which were struggling (not anymore I guess) and even while horde is quite race friendly faction, forsaken and she had quite a hard times in horde too.

She is overprotective of her people and honestly, it is good for the story. While she has own personal agenda, like almost every other leader, she actually did something for her people. I am not sure same could be said about other leaders .. on both horde and alliance side.

[Magnagarde]

The horde is in a downfall since MOP, the main races forgot and in the dumpster, they keep putting elves in there and there is no progress on this

I mean even the elves are in a downfall, back in TBC they are rly cool, now they are just the generic elves devoted of the light, Liadrin is a Abomination, and the interesting elves like Rommanth and Lorthemar are forgotten to give her screentime.

And yes sylvanas is racist, especially about trolls

The Horde had so much potential while Cataclysm was still live. They started adding the Dragonmaw clan and so on, with Blackrock orcs making a comeback. It all came crashing in MoP though, which is a shame. The Horde is now all about basically races who are in some form or way tied to the races of the Alliance, such as undead humans, a darker shade of night elves, blood elves and undead high elves.

The only ones who prefer a Horde like this and the way it is going are elf and undead fans or a combination of the two. This is why elves should always have been an Alliance-only thing, to keep them there and to prevent the complete ruination of the Horde's theme and purpose. I fear that within an expansion or two the Horde's capital will be Silvermoon or that Orgrimmar will be completely redecorated with elven tapestry, foutains and Italian ceramic tiles.

[Beloren]

The Horde had so much potential while Cataclysm was still live. They started adding the Dragonmaw clan and so on, with Blackrock orcs making a comeback. It all came crashing in MoP though, which is a shame. The Horde is now all about basically races who are in some form or way tied to the races of the Alliance, such as undead humans, a darker shade of night elves, blood elves and undead high elves.

The only ones who prefer a Horde like this and the way it is going are elf and undead fans or a combination of the two. This is why elves should always have been an Alliance-only thing, to keep them there and to prevent the complete ruination of the Horde's theme and purpose. I fear that within an expansion or two the Horde's capital will be Silvermoon or that Orgrimmar will be completely redecorated with elven tapestry, foutains and Italian ceramic tiles.

That was the horde, and it didn't sell, shouldn't we let go of that, it's a new horde now. Blizzard could have easily split each faction into 2, and run the sub-factions as allies keeping the game effectively 2-factions on a system level (i.e. for pvp, BGs, grouping guilding) but in the story you're not in the orcish, just allied to them.. but they didn't.

They wanted elves here - I guess it was a counter to the human popularity, but then they should have given some osrt of dark human, or vampire..well Forsaken for the horde, but made them less ghoulish - they didn't have to be so monstery, they could have been skinny cool European type humans or near undead humans - like the diablo 3 necromancer models.. but they didn't.

They could have created a more tribal like group of elves, no not the night elves, the night elves were never savage nor tribal, that was an early concept option they didn't run with, however they could have created those and made them the ancestors of the elves instead of the trolls, made them pretty and shoved them in the horde... but they didn't.

they wanted pretty gorgeous refined elves in the horde, they wanted to change the image of the horde. And i'm glad they did. Whiles a purist may not like it, the pure original horde is too niche for the needs of this game, most of the users aren't lovers of primitive, interesting cultures very different from their own, low tech, earth focused etc, and certainly not monsterish. double bad combo. so they had togive them something that fit the desire of most of their audience. Really hot sexy elf babes, not purple but white this time. And the rest was history. Add to that better racials, and the horde has been leading the alliance nad will continue to because this is how the developers want it.

Just enjoy it.

[Fyersing]

That was the horde, and it didn't sell, shouldn't we let go of that, it's a new horde now. Blizzard could have easily split each faction into 2, and run the sub-factions as allies keeping the game effectively 2-factions on a system level (i.e. for pvp, BGs, grouping guilding) but in the story you're not in the orcish, just allied to them.. but they didn't.

They wanted elves here - I guess it was a counter to the human popularity, but then they should have given some osrt of dark human, or vampire..well Forsaken for the horde, but made them less ghoulish - they didn't have to be so monstery, they could have been skinny cool European type humans or near undead humans - like the diablo 3 necromancer models.. but they didn't.

They could have created a more tribal like group of elves, no not the night elves, the night elves were never savage nor tribal, that was an early concept option they didn't run with, however they could have created those and made them the ancestors of the elves instead of the trolls, made them pretty and shoved them in the horde... but they didn't.

they wanted pretty gorgeous refined elves in the horde, they wanted to change the image of the horde. And i'm glad they did. Whiles a purist may not like it, the pure original horde is too niche for the needs of this game, most of the users aren't lovers of primitive, interesting cultures very different from their own, low tech, earth focused etc, and certainly not monsterish. double bad combo. so they had togive them something that fit the desire of most of their audience. Really hot sexy elf babes, not purple but white this time. And the rest was history. Add to that better racials, and the horde has been leading the alliance nad will continue to because this is how the developers want it.

Just enjoy it.

The problem isn't that Blizzard added these groups to the Horde, but rather that these new additions have largely supplanted the original races in terms of racial development and functional relevance. When is the last time you stumbled into a dangerous situation and immediately thought, "where are all the Darkspear Trolls, they're our best answer for this type of problem"?

HINT: That situation doesn't exist. The answer to any problem is Forsaken or Blood Elves. Speculatively, the Forsaken have the largest and most menacing military -- while the Blood Elves field some of the worlds most powerful mages, which will be augmented in Legion with... more elves (Nightborne). There's virtually no situation wherein another race out-perform these two, which is because the other races haven't actually changed or adapted for like 6 years. They sure do like to use the Frostwolf Orcs (as well as others, since they formally implemented them in Cataclysm) as plot devices when they need to make a tense situation more tense, though.

This particular issue doesn't exist on the Alliance, by any stretch of the imagination.

EDIT: If you need one example, compare Ironforge Dwarves with their mirror on the Horde (Thunderbluff Tauren). The latter lost their beloved leader, were utilized as a plot device to help a rebellion ferment, and experienced the entirety of their value to the faction at large be eclipsed by an upstart organization (Sunwalkers, which still receive more development than rest of the race). Otherwise, they've been in this same state for like 6 years now.

By comparison, each expansion we keep hearing more and more about how the Ironforge Dwarves are actively forming an allegiance with both the Wildhammer and Dark Iron Dwarves. Where the Tauren have become less and less relevant for the Horde, the Dwarves (with or without the inclusion of playable Dark Iron) are become more and more relevant.

[Mace]

Do yourself a favour then and don't try.



Well, here is newsflash for both of you; the night elves could only have started to become humanesque copies of themselves after they've joined the Alliance, not before, which is why talking about any other timeframe other than their Alliance-related one is complete nonsense. If you are going to talk about this, then the only timetable to consider is the one which includes them being Alliance; nothing before that and nothing after that.

Logic itself limits the discussion to their Alliance-related timeframe, not you, me or anyone else. If you talk about night elves and the way they're turning out to be human copies of their former selves, then this is the only period you can consider. I really hoped this wouldn't require explaining. My first reply was also directed at Zulkhan's post(which was all about the "bad" effects humans have had on night elves in WoW), not yours, which is why any eventual moving of goalposts is inherently tied to the post I quoted.

Now, within the Alliance, the night elves have had a much better treatment than humans have, who have - in contrast to the night elves - lost more ground than any other Alliance race has as its member. The Alliance night elves have gotten more screentime than most of the Alliance human characters(ie Malfurion in Cataclysm, Malfurion in Legion, Tyrande in Legion), which is why statements such as the Alliance being human-centric are completely untrue.

By analogy, the Horde is being misinterpreted the same way and has always been misinterpreted about being orc-centric.

On a side note, relative suffering of a racial group in comparison to humans does bring up the humanization point of the night elves I want to elaborate on.

Weren't the night elves more humanesque than people are giving them credit for BEFORE joining the alliance. Afterall, weren't they presented as the lawful good extreme (extreme for doing what was right, including the more dangerous parts like instantly killing people who were trespassing - ) which is why they in this raw nobility extreme fit more in the alliance than in the horde at that stage of the faction development and had it's own unique air seeing you don't expect lawfully good peeps to also be so aggressive and quick to act (we are use to seeing them debate loads, hold things to a committee - i.e. not swift justice.

The ruining of the night elves is really not due to humans directly, but rather indirectly - as night elves suffer from having limited development time in game. They got lore in books, 2 books, but whereas other races either got dungeons, patches or expansion focus (i'm looking at you trolls/dwarves & every new race introduced), they as a group just weren't developed, so all you see is the token night elf or night elf representation in stormwind and other alliance gatherings which is always around humans. They actually do nothing in those gatherings so it gives the impression they've been humanized, when in truth they've just not been developed.

The druids are the perfect example, druids were night elf and tauren, so whenever you saw druids it was those 2 races, however night elves feel a lot more druidic because you simply haven't seen their other roles in game due to lack of development - or you would have seen night elf huntresses, priestesses and highborne mages (post 4.0) in stories involving them. You don't think of Tauren as tree hugger hippies, even though every druid settlement has Tauren - the reason is because you actually see tauren active in other roles (warriors, hunters, shaman mostly) in addition to druids, whereas for night elves you just don't see them.

As such we can't really and truly say they've suffered because of humans although they have because humans are the alliance and blizzard suck at writing for several races. Sure night elves faded from the foreground they were in during WC3 where they were partof every major development as prominently as humans and orcs were, and it made sense, you don't create persona's and characters with that particular type of backstory you give them and have them sit on the bench when the world they're dedicated to protecting is in danger. SAdly whoever took over writing a few years later when the story resumes in TBC completely forgets this, and it is from this point on the story seems to go out of sync with the original flow it had in WC3, not just for night elves, but for orcs, the horde, the lot.

PErsonally I think TBC was just the very visible sign of something that started in wow development. This out of sync started when they decided that game will have people start in separate zones for their race. Originally we were all going to stat in Theramore or Orgrimmar [Alliance and horde], EK was a high level continent you would get to and visit the aftermath of the scourge war - once that changed and everyone got their racial homes - then the story skipped had gaps and the focus was out.

It is also noteworthy that unlike WC3, wow story and lore is developed by a team. And it's clear the person who wrote WC3, was not involved in every detail of TBC - or didn't read up on his previous work. What I suspect happened is this. He determined the overall plot, like the new story of SArgeras, the dranei, the blood elves going horde etc, but he didn't write the detail of the actual steps during your quests. Other people did that - this for example is where the night elves would have been present in safeguarding a future for their world given they were hunting Illidan, one of thier own. - but they are nowhere to be seen, at odds with their overwhelming dedication to their world. Since then they have been very carelessly written, not really matching the characteristics they were framed by in WC3 - because it is not the same person that is combing through every detail. The author himself would not have failed to include appropriate parts if he was doing his due diligence. However I think he was distracted trying to get a movie started and let others do the detail - others for whom the lore was just a job and not their precious prized passion.

[MORGATH99]

only race that matters on the horde is the orcs rest is just garbage

[Syegfryed]

they wanted pretty gorgeous refined elves in the horde, they wanted to change the image of the horde. And i'm glad they did.

Just enjoy it.

geez, thats disgusting.

Blizzard did rly destroy the horde, and guys like you are the reason

Like i said before, i can even see they changing the name and color of the faction, to suit more the shit the horde had become, like the elf bangaloo arise

- - - Updated - - -

The Horde had so much potential while Cataclysm was still live. They started adding the Dragonmaw clan and so on, with Blackrock orcs making a comeback. It all came crashing in MoP though, which is a shame. The Horde is now all about basically races who are in some form or way tied to the races of the Alliance, such as undead humans, a darker shade of night elves, blood elves and undead high elves.

The only ones who prefer a Horde like this and the way it is going are elf and undead fans or a combination of the two. This is why elves should always have been an Alliance-only thing, to keep them there and to prevent the complete ruination of the Horde's theme and purpose. I fear that within an expansion or two the Horde's capital will be Silvermoon or that Orgrimmar will be completely redecorated with elven tapestry, foutains and Italian ceramic tiles.

Thats true

I can even see the nightborne getting more screen-time and lore than trolls taurens and even orcs now.

People forget what made Horde popular was Warcraft 3 and how it was portrait there until WtLK, i don't mind giving other races screentime, i think everyone need to shine sometime, but they don't need to overtake and suffocate all other races, by takings they roles and changing the "face" of the horde

Like or no, alliance and horde will always be tied to orcs x humans, by this park, they develop other races lore. it worked (almost)pretty well until they start to change this in the end of MOP

[Mace]

geez, thats disgusting.

Blizzard did rly destroy the horde, and guys like you are the reason

Like i said before, i can even see they changing the name and color of the faction, to suit more the shit the horde had become, like the elf bangaloo arise

He's right though, your average american/european looks at people with piercings, alternate lifestyles, even smaller things like the wider noses of black folk or their skin colour as something alien and monsterish - anything that's not the catwalk fashion model look or hollywood hearthrob actor. If you're not "IT" you wanna be it IT .. and this is what the elves represent to most people - you can be that gorgeous sexy 10 you've always wanted and is sooo idolized in our society.

If we idolized hunters, warriors, people who had a respect for the land and valued it sacred - if tribal cultures intrigued and fascinated us and we longed for the simplicity and refreshing honesty they lived their lives, then it would be the alliance needing a horde like race to boost its numbers.

One of the challenges blizzard must feel they face is how do you make them appealing yet distinctively different and true to their original? I guess blood elves was the shortcut answer and the lore is paying a heavy price for it. But it fixed the gameplay imbalance amongst the players.

[Syegfryed]

He's right though, your average american/european looks at people with piercings, alternate lifestyles, even smaller things like the wider noses of black folk or their skin colour as something alien and monsterish - anything that's not the catwalk fashion model look or hollywood hearthrob actor. If you're not "IT" you wanna be it IT .. and this is what the elves represent to most people - you can be that gorgeous sexy 10 you've always wanted and is sooo idolized in our society.

If we idolized hunters, warriors, people who had a respect for the land and valued it sacred - if tribal cultures intrigued and fascinated us and we longed for the simplicity and refreshing honesty they lived their lives, then it would be the alliance needing a horde like race to boost its numbers.

One of the challenges blizzard must feel they face is how do you make them appealing yet distinctively different and true to their original? I guess blood elves was the shortcut answer and the lore is paying a heavy price for it. But it fixed the gameplay imbalance amongst the players.

i didn't understand what you said

you mean, people want to be elf, because of they appeal, by this reason they change he horde to be a elf party?

they did this in TBC the faction of monsters get a normal race, and the alliance in cata get a monster race, it worked pretty well until WoD, it was fine, why they need change even more and make elves the face of the horde when its was all about monsters? orcs, trolls, undeads etc? i know why, to sell, and thats disgusting, instead of working on other races so they could be popular, they did the easy way shoving LofTR elves

i have for myself the concept of the pandora's box of fanservice, they open the box after the WoD fiasco, And what is more fanservice than putting the most playable race of the horde in the pedestal? who cares about lore anyway? lets build new lore upon this and call done.

[Magnagarde]

i didn't understand what you said

you mean, people want to be elf, because of they appeal, by this reason they change he horde to be a elf party?

they did this in TBC the faction of monsters get a normal race, and the alliance in cata get a monster race, it worked pretty well until WoD, it was fine, why they need change even more and make elves the face of the horde when its was all about monsters? orcs, trolls, undeads etc? i know why, to sell, and thats disgusting, instead of working on other races so they could be popular, they did the easy way shoving LofTR elves

i have for myself the concept of the pandora's box of fanservice, they open the box after the WoD fiasco, And what is more fanservice than putting the most playable race of the horde in the pedestal? who cares about lore anyway? lets build new lore upon this and call done.

Instead of putting every race they got no idea where to put directly into the Horde, they should start working on their faction systems and implement more factions, other than just the Horde and the Alliance.

Every Blizzard meeting about how to add a race to the Horde seems to go like: "Hey, we can just say they need allies and script a quest or convo to justify why they join the Horde, right?". It feels like the way they add races to the Horde is based on who is enemies with one of the races of the Alliance or the entirety of it, instead of looking to add races which actually make sense having.

For example, Thalyssra doesn't like what Tyrande told her? Too bad, let her stay on her own then, but just because she doesn't like Tyrande, it doesn't mean she should join the Horde in which she doesn't fit into.

[Steampunkette]

Do yourself a favour then and don't try.



Well, here is newsflash for both of you; the night elves could only have started to become humanesque copies of themselves after they've joined the Alliance, not before, which is why talking about any other timeframe other than their Alliance-related one is complete nonsense. If you are going to talk about this, then the only timetable to consider is the one which includes them being Alliance; nothing before that and nothing after that.

Logic itself limits the discussion to their Alliance-related timeframe, not you, me or anyone else. If you talk about night elves and the way they're turning out to be human copies of their former selves, then this is the only period you can consider. I really hoped this wouldn't require explaining. My first reply was also directed at Zulkhan's post(which was all about the "bad" effects humans have had on night elves in WoW), not yours, which is why any eventual moving of goalposts is inherently tied to the post I quoted.

Now, within the Alliance, the night elves have had a much better treatment than humans have, who have - in contrast to the night elves - lost more ground than any other Alliance race has as its member. The Alliance night elves have gotten more screentime than most of the Alliance human characters(ie Malfurion in Cataclysm, Malfurion in Legion, Tyrande in Legion), which is why statements such as the Alliance being human-centric are completely untrue.

By analogy, the Horde is being misinterpreted the same way and has always been misinterpreted about being orc-centric.

Alright, Spock, time for another little "Your Logic is Flawed 'cause it doesn't take into account as much as you think it does"

The first thing is: Your argument about the Humans losing more than anyone has fuck-all to do with whether the Alliance is Human-Centric in presentation and interactions.

The second is: Logic dictates that -if- you want to discuss the Human-Centric tendencies of the Alliance you must first establish racial parameters as a baseline PRIOR to the forming of the Alliance in order to demonstrate change towards the Human-Centric situation if you're going to make an argument -about- such cultural shifts. Otherwise you're unable to discuss any cultural shift because the "Only" topic for discussion exists post-facto any change of ideology or identity.

Essentially "Well yeah it was water BEFORE it turned to Ice, but you're only allowed to discuss it -after- it's ice and try and demonstrate how it changed into ice!"

Make sense?

You seem to be conflating -several- arguments all together and declaring the result logically sound, but once the arguments have been pulled apart, the holes are clearly visible.

If you wanna talk about lost territories, let's do that. If you wanna talk about the Human-Centric cultural tendencies of the Alliance let's do that. But don't mistake the two as a single argument. The humans can lose "More Territory" than any race "In Recent History" and still have a massive cultural influence on other societies.

Because cultural impact isn't based on land size, but a battlefield of ideas and ideals.

[Magnagarde]

You seem to be conflating -several- arguments all together and declaring the result logically sound, but once the arguments have been pulled apart, the holes are clearly visible.

If you wanna talk about lost territories, let's do that. If you wanna talk about the Human-Centric cultural tendencies of the Alliance let's do that. But don't mistake the two as a single argument. The humans can lose "More Territory" than any race "In Recent History" and still have a massive cultural influence on other societies.

Of course the holes are visible when you rip a cohesive arguement(influenced by what others posted alongside the main arguement) appart and the parts essentially lose all meaning that they initially gave to eachother. Note that those parts kept adding up because others kept bringing up more and more lacking arguements as to how humans affected the night elves' transformation.

The talk about territory started when it was said that humans are the dominant force within the Alliance. That is absolutely untrue and their loss was stated to back this up because that is the only thing they are dominant at; having only one kingdom left and a few settlements outside of it, with a bunch of generic towers spewn across new zones - while also continously losing everything else you've ever had - hardly makes something dominant. The only thing dominant about it is being the dominant cannon fodder for all of the Alliance and being the dominant loser within, not the go-to standard for everyone else. The human culture has gotten the same treatment; it doesn't reach further than these few settlements and generic forts, which is why there is absolutely no cultural effect on other races, except for certain dwarves, gnomes and high elves(which are still Alliance) that are lorewise set into human settlements. The night elves haven't changed their society, their civilization, their preferences and their ideas in any way ever since they've gotten in touch with humans; they've only become a bit less xenophobic, which is an expectable change for a race that has undergone 13 years of lore material within which it works together with various members of other races, but this isn't influenced by humans only.

The talk was about how the Alliance made the night elves become something they were not is completely out of place to begin with. Humans have had absolutely no effect on the way night elves developed in World of Warcraft, other than the fact that they share the same gameplay amenities due to being put into one faction(ie BGs, arenas, raids) and a few roleplay scenarios that are covered either in the game or in novels/books. The development or better yet, the absence of development they've seen is autonomous and tied to the way Blizzard wrote them, not the way Blizzard wrote the humans and in turn effected the night elves.

Because cultural impact isn't based on land size, but a battlefield of ideas and ideals.

Seeing as you know this and seeing as I know this too, can you then explain how exactly the night elves lost their cultural authenticity because of humans, because that was what the other guy argued for in the first place.

How has running after Cenarius made Malfurion lose what he is all about in established night elven lore? How is running after Ysera half the expansion against what we knew of Tyrande and the night elves? How is doing her own business in Suramar with her long forgotten kin unreflective of what night elves are about? And to tie it all in, how have humans impacted all of this and where exactly did they impact the night elven "culture" in this whole expansion? I'll give you the answer - they have not.

[Steampunkette]

How about this simplest and most basic bit, @Magnagarde:

Nelf Society is Matriarchal. Staunchly so. Striated to the point of it almost being a Caste System wherein Women are Priests and Warriors and Men are Druids or Hunters, which women could also be.

As soon as Vanilla launched, male Nelf Warriors were totes cool. Female Druids, alongside them. Male Priests as well, even though the Priesthood was completely presented as women-only during WC3.

Yeah, yeah. It's a Gameplay thing rather than a Lore thing. Players should, absolutely, be able to break the mold and be whatever they want. But all the Nelf warrior trainers and priests are female so it's cool, right?



Oh, look. A plate armor clad male Nelf wearing the colors of Stormwind, completely bucking the previously established history.

There's plenty of other examples, feel free to go look for them. Byeeeee!

[Magnagarde]

How about this simplest and most basic bit, @Magnagarde:

Nelf Society is Matriarchal. Staunchly so. Striated to the point of it almost being a Caste System wherein Women are Priests and Warriors and Men are Druids or Hunters, which women could also be.

As soon as Vanilla launched, male Nelf Warriors were totes cool. Female Druids, alongside them. Male Priests as well, even though the Priesthood was completely presented as women-only during WC3.

Yeah, yeah. It's a Gameplay thing rather than a Lore thing. Players should, absolutely, be able to break the mold and be whatever they want. But all the Nelf warrior trainers and priests are female so it's cool, right?



Oh, look. A plate armor clad male Nelf wearing the colors of Stormwind, completely bucking the previously established history.

There's plenty of other examples, feel free to go look for them. Byeeeee!

So you're saying humans are the focal lore-based problem that is to be blamed why there are female night elf druids and why male night elves are priests? That makes absolutely no sense. Humans have got nothing to do with how the matriarchal nature of the night elves erroded, but the fact that they transfered a RTS universe into a MMO.

All of the NPCs in your picture are parts of one coherent fighting force called the Alliance, which is why they fly unified colors. Why did Blizzard make the Alliance base color blue is an answer only Blizzard can give you, just as I can't give you the answer as to why the Horde flies red banners. Blue versus red however is known to be a popular color setup from the RTS games which they most likely transfered over.

Lorewise, it is the 7th Legion, founded during WoW's timeline(at a point in time in which it would make sense for some night elves to be in Stormwind and eventually join an unit based off of its style) and an elite Alliance taskforce that was present throughout WoW. Are you implying that the male night elf in your screen should've come with leaves covering his genitals and a bear hide covering his back? Are you implying that they should all wear different colors and look like a ragtag militia, instead of one unified fighting force? Had Shandris and her sentinel army in Feralas/Ashenvale, had Malfurion and his druids and had Tyrande and her priestesses started wearing Lion ornaments on golden and blue variants of whatever type of armor, then you'd have made a valid point about Stormwind's humans voiding night elf culture.

I guess humans also degraded the tauren culture because Blizzard makes the average tauren paladin look like Uther the Furrybringer.