What will Happen with the Tax Cuts

[Mormolyce]

What truly, truly fascinates me is how anyone can reduce such an incredibly complex science like economics to such basic observations.

We really wouldn't need economists if all it took was identifying that the number 24 was larger than the number 12.

And I mean, how many companies are headquartered in Ireland? This line of thinking doesn't survive five seconds of scrutiny.

[Antiganon]

Can you tell me how most people will pay more taxes? If they don't extend the plan then the tax rate revert back to EXACTLY what they are now. So people won't be paying more taxes than they paid last year, they may pay more than they will in 2018 and moving forward but lets not pretend as though it is a tax hike in x number of years because it is not.

The removal of personal exemptions is a net negative for a married couple with a single child, absent any other feature of this tax plan, as the doubled standard deduction does not quite cover the difference in AGI.

Furthermore, with other deductions and credits repealed (SALT and Mortgage Interest capped, Child Care Tax Credit repealed, etc) your effective tax rate continues to climb.

Some of us are actually paying more taxes, right now, in FY2018, because the specific deductions and credits that were removed target specific people.

[Deleted]

My long term predictions of how the recent GOP tax cuts for corporations will ultimately shake out.

First off, they will create jobs, at least in the short term. The majority of the new revenue created by the tax cuts that corporations will recieve will definitely go to boosting CEO pay and shareholders, but lesser amount will likely go to new projects and the creation of jobs. Everything will seem great for a moment, and republicans will have seemed to won and they will smear it in the face of democrats and lefties everywhere.

However, boom cycles do not last forever. After the tax cuts have run their course and the economy settles back to normal growth rates, there will be massively increased inequality in a country that already has a very large gap between the rich and the poor. This will lead to even greater levels of civil unrest than we see now.

Not learning their last lesson, conservatives/republicans will push for more tax cuts to corporations and the whole American political cycle will start anew.

This is not a sustainable in the long term. There is a limit to how much corporate taxes can be cut. What happens after corporations pay 0% in taxes? Do we start subsidizing them? How far must the upward funnel of wealth from the poor and middle class to the rich and corporations go until something changes?

Out of interest, what kind of work do you do OP?

[Machismo]

yes because cutting spending to programs that are essential to a lot of people's everyday lives is a great fucking idea. while your at it let's rename the united states to thunderdome.

Fine, you balance the budget... I'll wait.

[Growel]

The US has one of the highest corporate taxes in the world and EU the lowest, there goes that Theory.

My apologies; I was talking about income taxes. There is a big difference, and it is my fault for not being clear.

The USA most certainly does not have the highest incomes taxes; not by a long shot.

[bladeXcrasher]

Out of interest, what kind of work do you do OP?

He's a roustabout for some small time drilling company. Spends most of the time cleaning out tanks. Low skill labor job.

[Draco-Onis]

I will be saving on money this year with reduced taxes. So yeah, the market is doing well and so am I along with most Americans. More money to spend back into the economy. I fail to see that as a bad thing. For those who are into the stock market, which millions of every day citizens are with their thrift saving plans, based on stocks, is also another positive.

Aside for 401Ks most Americans are not invested in the market not sure what you are talking about, you lose money if you have a savings account thanks to central banks keeping rates low. The reason people are still angry even though the market is doing well is this exact reason the recovery has vastly benefited the rich while the average person lives are not improving.

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The new 21% corporate tax environment will be more business friendly than the 35% tax rate. Incentivizing more businesses to locate or further invest in their presence in the US. More wealth and jobs are created.

Except corporations had record amount of money and used it for financial engineering, no one paid the 35% rate thanks to loopholes and those same ones will enable them to pay far less than 21%. What makes corporate welfare money special? does it have magic properties that will make them treat it differently than the trillions they already have?

[Ghostpanther]

This isn't some grand epiphany. We get it dude.. you keep more money when your taxes are cut. This single fact alone does not guarantee a good bill. Otherwise let's just get rid of taxes, right?

It's in your interests in a home budgeting sense to have a tax cut, but generally speaking, depending on how they are designed, tax cuts are very inefficient ways to grow the economy. Dollar for dollar.

It's not smart. It's a handout given to those foolish enough to think an advance mortgage payment is suddenly the signs of economic growth.

The price tag on this tax bill is retarded. If I sell you a burger for 1000 dollars is the economy suddenly doing awesome?? I just made a thousand dollars!! Doesn't seem so awesome on your end, however... You need to acknowledge the American people as the one buying this shitburger.

Edit: Also.. lol.. you're a government employee? Now I think you're a troll...

I am retired. But I am not sure how that is related. You are mainly ranting nonsense because I happen to hold a different opinion than you do.

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Aside for 401Ks most Americans are not invested in the market not sure what you are talking about, you lose money if you have a savings account thanks to central banks keeping rates low. The reason people are still angry even though the market is doing well is this exact reason the recovery has vastly benefited the rich while the average person lives are not improving.

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Those are people who have their high state taxes to blame or the misinformed, who rely on the fake news reporting with their fear mongering rhetoric. Or they may simply be people who hate Trump so much, they will never be willing to give him any credit for anything good he does.

[Draco-Onis]

Those are people who have their high state taxes to blame or the misinformed, who rely on the fake news reporting with their fear mongering rhetoric. Or they may simply be people who hate Trump so much, they will never be willing to give him any credit for anything good he does.

One of the reason that Trump got elected is because of that difference and it is still there until a politician addresses it with good policies. The rich got exceedingly richer while the middle class and the poor are in the same boat or worse, neither Obama or Clinton understood this. Trump saw the opportunity but has done nothing about it aside from lip service there is plenty to blame here.

[Tiwack]

He's a roustabout for some small time drilling company. Spends most of the time cleaning out tanks. Low skill labor job.

You state that as if that somehow detracts from his argument.

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Out of interest, what kind of work do you do OP?

Do you care out of interest or out of whataboutism to undermine his argument?

[Deleted]

Do you care out of interest or out of whataboutism to undermine his argument?

Interested to see where his love for Communism comes from.

[Tiwack]

Interested to see where his love for Communism comes from.

How about addressing his point instead of his purview and political leanings? Would you care to share your private circumstances too, or perhaps where your love for robber-barons come from?

[Ghostpanther]

One of the reason that Trump got elected is because of that difference and it is still there until a politician addresses it with good policies. The rich got exceedingly richer while the middle class and the poor are in the same boat or worse, neither Obama or Clinton understood this. Trump saw the opportunity but has done nothing about it aside from lip service there is plenty to blame here.

I disagree. He has kept close to his campaign promises more than any President during which I was alive did. Considering all the amount of obstructiveness he has had to deal with , his first year was very successful.

[Spiffums]

The fact that someone else has more money than I do is not a problem that's the government's responsibility to solve. If it's a problem at all, it's mine to solve. Or to accept.

Get out of here with all the "self reliance" stuff.................

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The government will run out of money, and they will need to cut things, or ask for more of it from themselves.

The Government ran out of money when they started borrowing money. It's like people living on credit cards and just paying the min payment each month.

[Draco-Onis]

I disagree. He has kept close to his campaign promises more than any President during which I was alive did. Considering all the amount of obstructiveness he has had to deal with , his first year was very successful.

What obstruction? all the bills that have been proposed were tanked by republicans. The republicans control all of government, most of Trump's problems are self made due to his personality issues. Trump has done nothing that would help wage stagnation, pass a budget or infrastructure which has taken a back seat. He claimed to be a great negotiator but he can't even get his own party to act together not to mention hiring more scumbags in the history of the US to positions of power they even call it government Sachs.

This is not only Trump, Obama also ran a good campaign only to go soft on wall street but Trump has basically spread the butt cheeks of the American public without any lube with his deregulation madness.

[Low Hanging Fruit]

It will do well for a while. Business will return some assets. A majority of people will see short gains for a few years. The rich will get richer as fuck. But eventually business types will start moving stuff over seas again because where you illegally hide your money you often pay zero instead of even 22%. The rates go up steadily for everyone but the rich over 10 years. This all of course matters a lot on the stock market. If a housing bubble or something like that pops again than the ability to pay for the cuts becomes impossible because has business income falls or even businesses fail 22% doesn't work anymore. Then since about 80% of the wealth held by the 1% has also gotten greatly reduced the government won't be able to function without either raising rates (and republicans will refuse to do this) or just exploding the debt (which they will say they dont want to do but will because their rich over lords would rather see USA fail than them not being able to have 75 homes with 20 cars each).

[hakujinbakasama]

Obviously perfect equality is unwanted and probably impossible. I don't think many people have a problem with a moderate wealth gap between the poor and middle class and the wealthy, but the income inequality gap in our country is anything but moderate. In instances like that I believe it is the government responsibility to redistribute wealth by some means.

I know right... I mean, look at the gap between a guy who didn't even bother to get past the 9th grade and Mark Zuckerberg. That's some shit right there. Mark should give most of his money to that guy who didn't finish school because of inequality.

[Varvara Spiros Gelashvili]

I disagree. He has kept close to his campaign promises more than any President during which I was alive did. Considering all the amount of obstructiveness he has had to deal with , his first year was very successful.

He's gone back on so many I've lost count. Aren't the supreme court and senate basically owned by republicans. You're the definition of a cuck man and the ban is worth it.

He's lagging behind on Obama on everything as well.

[Krigaren]

Or you could simply make the US market competitive and with the same exact demand we have today bring back the jobs that were lost to other countries also bring back the offshore money and corporations being taxed on that such as Apple.

With the exception of finding ways to stop corporations from offshoring money, those things won't happen. Trying to directly compete with other countries that can afford to have single digit corporate tax rates, little to no regulations, and pay their employees .50c USD a day is a race to the bottom and will only serve to turn the US into a 3rd world economy, too. Simply put, US companies - particularly manufacturing and low-skilled customer support - will not bring their operations back to the US regardless of how low the tax rates are because of all of the other highly profitable benefits they enjoy overseas.

Besides, "bringing back jobs" is a pipe dream. It's the stump that the GOP and Trump run on, but for industries that have already shifted jobs overseas, there's no chance to bring them back. But that's fine too, that's how economics works. Instead of trying to bring back coal and manufacturing jobs, we should be focusing on new, higher-tech industries and developing world-leading infrastructure that would require jobs to be created and maintained here. The government needs to help with that - they need to be the carrot to incentivize these things, as it was during WWII and the economic boom afterward that gave us a world-first coast-to-coast highway system, electric grid, etc. Shifting more money to the military, cutting taxes, and gutting "entitlement" programs won't do that. GOP economic policies are failure policies.

[melodramocracy]

Get out of here with all the "self reliance" stuff.................

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The Government ran out of money when they started borrowing money. It's like people living on credit cards and just paying the min payment each month.

It's more in line with people relying on mortgages for home ownership.