Since Blizzard said they listen to what fans want.

[Biggles Worth]

Here I am leveling up a character to get away from maximum level content.

[Shrouded]

Propose a solution to this problem.

Well, it's not really my place to do so since I'm not a designer working on WoW.

But for me it's very simple - either there's a point to levels 1-100, or there isn't. If there isn't a point, then why do those levels exist? Blizzard created this issue themselves by stacking levels on top of each other, while simultaneously deciding that every expansion (and later, every tier) should be a complete split from the rest of the game. Their "solution" was the paid character boost.

My quick and dirty solution in turn would be to provide character boosts for free. However, that's both unlikely to ever happen (because moneys!) and not a great solution, since it still leaves a large part of the game unusable and pointless. A proper solution, though one I haven't given that much thought, would be something like creating a "character journey" type of progression system that spans all expansions and content and that you can't outlevel. Perhaps it could supplement the existing types of progression, but I think something like that is necessary since the problem keeps growing as Blizzard adds content.

[Dalheim]

Hold on I am laughing really hard right now at some of the comments.


This game is how many years old? If some of you enjoyed leveling so much, You should have a ton of max level chars. Taking extra time to kill mobs, on content you already done so many times. Are you mental? Taking longer to do things is more fun?

If there was risk of dying, or if it was more rewarding for the work you did. I could understand, but to say clearly that taking more time to kill mobs is more fun for you, I question it. In fact, I am calling you out on lying.

What it really is, that most of the people who enjoy this. Have max level chars filled on the server, and don't want to level again... but they enjoy it being tedious for others, because that is the type of community wow has.


That makes more sense than a bunch of morons telling me this is a better system, when all it did was make things take longer and no risk at all.

I have leveled tons of toons and currently leveling another toon that I saved to level just for the patch, and guess what? I enjoy it. I'm taking it slow and easy.
I get to do zones I WANT to do and I enjoy completing them fully. I'll probably level another toon since I actually enjoy leveling again.
Havent felt this much fun since I started back in Cata release.

[anaxie]

Get back to that when I have opened 10+ threads on the same complaint.

- - - Updated - - -



Asking "are you new?" on a forum tends to make it relevant.

It was in relation to past game development. Are you that simple minded.

[ManiaCCC]

Well, it's not really my place to do so since I'm not a designer working on WoW.

But for me it's very simple - either there's a point to levels 1-100, or there isn't. If there isn't a point, then why do those levels exist? Blizzard created this issue themselves by stacking levels on top of each other, while simultaneously deciding that every expansion (and later, every tier) should be a complete split from the rest of the game. Their "solution" was the paid character boost.

My quick and dirty solution in turn would be to provide character boosts for free. However, that's both unlikely to ever happen (because moneys!) and not a great solution, since it still leaves a large part of the game unusable and pointless. A proper solution, though one I haven't given that much thought, would be something like creating a "character journey" type of progression system that spans all expansions and content and that you can't outlevel. Perhaps it could supplement the existing types of progression, but I think something like that is necessary since the problem keeps growing as Blizzard adds content.

First flaw in your thinking is that you believe, leveling and leveling content is ultimately pointless and unusable. Which is objectively false.

You just don't like what is the goal of the leveling and you find that goal "pointless", however there is a reason why leveling still exists and while many people still love it.

I also leveled countless of characters and yet, I am leveling another. And with 7.3.5, leveling is the most interesting since WotLK or Cata.

[Shrouded]

First flaw in your thinking is that you believe, leveling and leveling content is ultimately pointless and unusable. Which is objectively false.

You just don't like what is the goal of the leveling and you find that goal "pointless", however there is a reason why leveling still exists and while many people still love it.

I also leveled countless of characters and yet, I am leveling another. And with 7.3.5, leveling is the most interesting since WotLK or Cata.

No, you're wrong. I like levelling. I think levelling should be an important part of the game. I do not think that it should be disconnected from the endgame the way it currently is, and that's where I think Blizzard has gone wrong. It's almost as if levelling is an entirely different game than WoW at max level, both in gameplay and in terms of reward separation.

[Vargur]

My main issue with the changed levelling is that they forgot the one essential thing - nothing you do during levelling matters once you reach max level, STILL. Slowing down levelling is fine, but with 1-100 being so entirely disconnected from the rest of the game what's the point?

There is no point, it's old content, been there, done that, they shouldn't have touched it.

[Kokolums]

My main issue with the changed levelling is that they forgot the one essential thing - nothing you do during levelling matters once you reach max level, STILL. Slowing down levelling is fine, but with 1-100 being so entirely disconnected from the rest of the game what's the point?

Well, once allied races are implemented later this year, leveling will matter for those who want transmog.

[Hctaz]

How does it get you to this day still? Cause of private servers? If so, I've played on private servers too, and it's easy as fuck to level even on blizzlike ones like Nost. You just have to use your brain and be ready to use a burst of damage at low health in order to kill them before they run to other groups.

Well, yes obviously. But there are times where that doesn't line up right for some classes. You get an unlucky crit before you needed it and suddenly you're chasing down a full speed enemy into a pack of mobs. It can happen. Plus there are usually a ton of patrols in those areas where things get a little tricky. You can find yourself in a situation where a patrol comes around a corner that you didn't even know was there. Obviously not a big problem if you have knowledge of the game beforehand, but I haven't leveled through classic since Wrath (obviously).

Plus, some private servers implemented dynamic mob spawning, which is not something that classic should have. Trust me. It's a pain in the ass when you get to your quest objective and there are no mobs, but it's a bigger pain in the ass when the mobs respawn so quickly that you only kill three of them before they start respawning behind you. Ordinarily you'd take out the problematic mobs first like patrols and then be set for you to clear out the area before they come back. Not the case when the pat respawns before you can even get a quarter of the way through your kill quest.

The point that I was getting at though is that modern WoW doesn't have this problem AT ALL, and I think that it should. Burning Crusade content still has a lot of these same traps and the same annoying enemies that classic had, but it's a joke. I was leveling my shaman through Netherstorm the other day and I completely forgot about humanoids fleeing and all that jazz. Dude ran into a pack of 4 mobs and I was suddenly fighting two casters with full health and 2 other melee guys on top of the initial caster I was fighting. I was enhance. Killed them all without even being concerned for my health. I only popped spirit wolves and healed myself twice. Could have used lust to absolutely demolish them. The classic style of annoying mobs is basically solely limited to BC sans a few pats, so, in any area that isn't Outland, you will never need to think at all about your safety. They should at least make the mobs require you to use your brain, no?

[Flarelaine]

It was in relation to past game development. Are you that simple minded.

No, it was in relation to flooding the forums with whining threads. If that was game development, MMO-C could publish an AAA game every week.

[Frolk]

Who am I to blame for this stupid scaling that we have?


I was all like, I am down with it being tougher. I forget this is Blizzard and Tedious means tougher to them.


1) Up the damage of mobs by a good 30ish percent.
2) Cut back on the HP buff just a bit. 20 percent
3) Put the xp back to where it was. What is wrong with you nerfing the xp?


Wow is fun because of the fast combat, but there is no risk at all, and clearly no reward.


This is common sense. Why do you lack it?

I like the new system, dont hate.

[ManiaCCC]

No, you're wrong. I like levelling. I think levelling should be an important part of the game. I do not think that it should be disconnected from the endgame the way it currently is, and that's where I think Blizzard has gone wrong. It's almost as if levelling is an entirely different game than WoW at max level, both in gameplay and in terms of reward separation.

So what really changed in your mind that leveling became useless?

[lockybalboa]

They always claim that they do, but it's not the case most of the time of course.

[derpkitteh]

see, this has been my problem with the game since cataclysm. they think big health sponges = challenge.

no, that's not the case at all. it's ridiculous and boring. pre-cata, mobs had ok health, but they dealt more severe damage. the mobs actually dealing damage is where the challenge is.

[Shrouded]

So what really changed in your mind that leveling became useless?

I thought I explained that? It's the disconnect from the rest of the game:

• Levelling doesn't teach you how to play your class, it teaches you how to level up.
• Levelling doesn't help you form any social connections since it's a solo experience from start to finish, with the odd anonymous dungeon finder run thrown into the mix.
• Nothing you do while levelling carries over to max level - none of the reputations, items or equipment you pick up really matters.

In fact, I'd say the only thing you get out of levelling these days is experiencing the quest lines, but does that have to be done in a levelling context? Again, Blizzard's "solution" to this was to offer a paid ticket past the levelling, which I think is ridiculous. They should either make the levelling experience good or make it optional, not this wishy washy in-between solution.

[ManiaCCC]

I thought I explained that? It's the disconnect from the rest of the game:

• Levelling doesn't teach you how to play your class, it teaches you how to level up.
• Levelling doesn't help you form any social connections since it's a solo experience from start to finish, with the odd anonymous dungeon finder run thrown into the mix.
• Nothing you do while levelling carries over to max level - none of the reputations, items or equipment you pick up really matters.

In fact, I'd say the only thing you get out of levelling these days is experiencing the quest lines, but does that have to be done in a levelling context? Again, Blizzard's "solution" to this was to offer a paid ticket past the levelling, which I think is ridiculous. They should either make the levelling experience good or make it optional, not this wishy washy in-between solution.

Let's say they realize leveling itself is a problem and they made it a lot better (for me at least).

But let's look on your points.

First point, this was always the case (except there were more things to do per class). Only way, how you will learn, how to play your class was some sort of group content. And with current changes to dungeons, this seems to be pretty much solved (tbh, outside of some proper rotation, there is nothing else to learn and yes, dungeons will teach you that)

Second point, I agree to the point. It was possible to solo all the way up even in Vanilla (i did it actually few times). Yes, you wouldn't clear dungeons, but who cares? It was always about the choice. Currently, playing solo is just much easier thanks to LFG. But don't kid yourself. Even in TBC or early WotLK, you could easily join any group (LFM spam was all over the place), finish dungeon and don't say a single word.

Third point, I agree partially and it something what I am missing too. To be fair, while you are leveling, everything carries to the max level, but question is, about what you really care? The biggest problem is not that reputation or gear is not carried over (it is), but fact, that reputation, outside of some pathfinder achievement doesn't matter for very long time. And in the moment, you hit level cap, you can instantly get new gear. But this is not problem of the leveling nor is making leveling useless. Leveling was always pretty much separate from end game. It just took a while to get some proper gear. That's all. (and reputations currently suck - so maybe fix reputations?)

[oathy]

Its the best laugh ever.
one of the main reasons I stopped taking part in BETA's people would spent a lot of time
actually trying to help them. Report issues. Give feedback about things that clearly didn't work.
during WOD Every single thing that harmed the Expansion had been reported very early on.

At the time they posted back saying "it wont be like that when we launch", yet it was.
I accept completely they cant listen or act on everything they are asked, But its been
almost a constant in recent years, They ask for Genuine feedback and they ignore it.

Classic Example people said the Garrisons killed off the cities that were now ghost towns,
there wasn't enough player interaction,

[anaxie]

No, it was in relation to flooding the forums with whining threads. If that was game development, MMO-C could publish an AAA game every week.

Why are you still talking. We were done already

[cparle87]

Lets be real here, when people said leveling was too easy, I thought maybe, but Blizzard answer would be make it tedious.

Blizzard can't win because they lack common sense. They could have easily added more damage, make the mobs last a little bit longer, and not go overboard with the hp.Do a revamp to questing rewards and be like here you go. New leveling system. Go back earn some rewards, have fun. Nope

Then they'd get inundanted by people going "wah I've already levelled up 40 characters and it was boring and now you're forcing me to do it again for cool rewards wah blizz you're bad."

[Osiria]

Weird, I don't remember fans asking for copy-pastes of current races with a miserable customization and an even more restrict selection of classes to choose.

I mustn't have been in the forums that day, I suppose...