US Federal Government Shutdown

[Machismo]

Dude...if that were true, the Government wouldn't be in shutdown. They got 50 votes.

And they needed 60...

If they opt for reconciliation (which would require more hurdles in creating the bill), they would need a simple majority.

Are you even paying attention?

[Cthulhu 2020]

The fact that only 50% (with a majority of that being very liberal democrat) is only making my statement even stronger so why bother including that? Dems should be sweating at these numbers.

Dems don't need more braindead California liberals on their side. Where the hell do they expect to gain seats in already solid blue areas? They need more moderates and rust-belt voters. And they're sacrificing any possible support among those voters.

I guess you haven't been paying attention to the special elections for the entire last year.

The ones that Republicans actually win, it's only by nose hairs that they win... in districts where they normally win by over 20%. They're winning by less than 5%. In districts where they normally don't win by such a large margin, they're losing seats... in solidly red states.

Can't wait for election results in these swing states come 2018 tbh. Polling numbers from this shutdown mean jack. Some Americans don't like that Dems are holding their ground on DACA, but most of America has been upset with everything Republicans have done for the last year. And nearly half of Americans still blame Republicans for the shut down, since they have majorities in all branches of government and they can't even rally their own party. How sad is that.

[Sky High]

yeah I'm at a lose as to how this will pan out badly for the Dems, the balls not really in their court to get this bill passed.

[Belize]

The fact that only 50% (with a majority of that being very liberal democrat) is only making my statement even stronger so why bother including that? Dems should be sweating at these numbers.

Dems don't need more braindead California liberals on their side. Where the hell do they expect to gain seats in already solid blue areas? They need more moderates and rust-belt voters. And they're sacrificing any possible support among those voters.

... Right... Nooo...

With only 30~ % of people blaming Dems, we can safely assume its the same 30% that support Trump unconditionally.

Dems aren't losing support.
Circumstential evidence, but everyone I talked to at the Women's March I went to is glad that the Dems are holding their ground. Both Democrats and registered Republicans.

Keep living your Trumpian fantasy world though

[Rokom]

I think you are thinking of Reconcillliation, not filibustering. In this case, they only have 50 votes, so they can't pass it on Reconcilliation. If they had 51 votes, the Democrats couldn't filibuster it because of Reconcilliation, it would just pass.

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Trump will 100% sign the plan they can't pass in the Senate.


That's because the Pubs sent a bill to Obama in 2013, so it was Congressional Pubs vs the Dem President. In this case the President (Trump) will not refuse to sign whatever the Pub congress puts in front of him. The problem is that the Senate Pubs can't get 51 votes.

Republicans already blew their Reconciliation for the fiscal year on the Tax Cut bill, but I'm pretty sure Mitch McConnell could invoke the final "nuclear option" to get rid of the filibuster if they did have 51 votes.

[LaserSharkDFB]

Here's the thing:


Yes, I know, it's Chuck Schumer, and the Trumpists are going to discount everything he says. But this is consistent with the things we already knew. Schumer and Pelosi met with Trump and apparently came to an agreement about DACA, then he changed his mind. Durbin and Graham went to meet with Trump (and a bunch of hardliners), and Trump went with the Shithole comment. They came to another bipartisan agreement, giving Trump high military funding and money for the wall, and then Trump changed his mind.

You can't negotiate with someone who keeps changing the rules. Trump is a shitty, shitty businessman and negotiator who makes decisions based on the last person he talked to. That is why this is Trump's fault.

[Ragedaug]

And they needed 60...

Are you even paying attention?

I'll concede that. I'm just saying, they can pass the budget with 51 votes through Reconciliation.

The other funny thing here is they aren't even voting on the annual budget, but rather the 4th Stop Gap (short term patch) since September.

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Here's the thing:
-- Schumer video --

Yes, I know, it's Chuck Schumer, and the Trumpists are going to discount everything he says. But this is consistent with the things we already knew. Schumer and Pelosi met with Trump and apparently came to an agreement about DACA, then he changed his mind. Durbin and Graham went to meet with Trump (and a bunch of hardliners), and Trump went with the Shithole comment. They came to another bipartisan agreement, giving Trump high military funding and money for the wall, and then Trump changed his mind.

You can't negotiate with someone who keeps changing the rules. Trump is a shitty, shitty businessman and negotiator who makes decisions based on the last person he talked to. That is why this is Trump's fault.

And you could change the video to have Ted Cruz up there, replace "Trump" with "Schumer", replace "Republican" with "Democrat", and it would be the exact same speech.

[LaserSharkDFB]

I'll concede that. I'm just saying, they can pass the budget with 51 votes through Reconciliation.

The other funny thing here is they aren't even voting on the annual budget, but rather the 4th Stop Gap (short term patch) since September.

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And you could change the video to have Ted Cruz up there, replace "Trump" with "Schumer", replace "Republican" with "Democrat", and it would be the exact same speech.

What? No, you couldn't. For one thing, Ted Cruz hasn't done a single thing in his entire worthless life. And Schumer didn't change any deals after the fact; Trump did. You're just being contrarian for the sake of defending Dear Leader.

[Ragedaug]

What? No, you couldn't. For one thing, Ted Cruz hasn't done a single thing in his entire worthless life. And Schumer didn't change any deals after the fact; Trump did. You're just being contrarian for the sake of defending Dear Leader.

You have me mistaken if you think I like Trump. Nice ad hominem though, you are quite skilled.

I guess I forgot how righteous the Democrats are. I should have known by all the white suits they wear. They are obviously the good guys.

[PosPosPos]

You have me mistaken if you think I like Trump. Nice ad hominem though, you are quite skilled.

I guess I forgot how righteous the Democrats are. I should have known by all the white suits they wear. They are obviously the good guys.

You don't like Trump, but somehow you perform a lap dance for him in every post.

Something tells me you are just bullshitting like all "awoke independent" alt-righters do.

[Ragedaug]

You don't like Trump, but somehow you perform a lap dance for him in every post.

Something tells me you are just bullshitting like all alt-righters do.

You got me PosPosPos. All those negatives things I've said about Trump and the no-good-things-ever I've said about Trump have been a scam to fool you, but you've seen right through me.

[Dacien]

You got me PosPosPos. All those negatives things I've said about Trump and the no-good-things-ever I've said about Trump have been a scam to fool you, but you've seen right through me.

Don't listen to Pos. Of all the ad hominem nonsense this forum has to offer, Pos is undoubtedly the worst offender.

[Ragedaug]

Don't listen to Pos. Of all the ad hominem nonsense this forum has to offer, Pos is undoubtedly the worst offender.

Yeah, I normally don't reply to the upside-down elephant, for those reasons and more. I just think it's funny that the Democrat's first line of defense is "YOU LOVE TRUMP!" without any understanding of what you actually believe.

[Macaquerie]

I'll concede that. I'm just saying, they can pass the budget with 51 votes through Reconciliation.

The other funny thing here is they aren't even voting on the annual budget, but rather the 4th Stop Gap (short term patch) since September.

It's been explained to you already that you can only use reconciliation once per year, and the GOP already blew their wad on the tax bill. Honestly, the Democrats should just hold firm and force McConnell to use the nuclear option, if this is really the cross they want to die on.

[GennGreymane]

Im still confused as to how a GOP president, GOP house, and GOP senate managed to get a shut down

[Ragedaug]

It's been explained to you already that you can only use reconciliation once per year, and the GOP already blew their wad on the tax bill. Honestly, the Democrats should just hold firm and force McConnell to use the nuclear option, if this is really the cross they want to die on.

Yeah, I was a bit confused. I was mixing up the stop gap voting they were doing with reconciliation.

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Im still confused as to how a GOP president, GOP house, and GOP senate managed to get a shut down

In short, the Republicans don't have enough votes to pass anything through the Senate, so whatever they do it's got to be compromise - which is where they keep getting stuck. And even then there are a good couple dozen Republican Senators who are more moderate and won't vote hard line with the more Tea Party like Senators, so even in the Republican caucus it's tough to get anything they'll agree on as a party without a lot of internal compromise.

[GennGreymane]

Yeah, I was a bit confused. I was mixing up the stop gap voting they were doing with reconciliation.

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In short, the Republicans don't have enough votes to pass anything through the Senate.

Sounds like a GOP problem then

[Milchshake]

Im still confused as to how a GOP president, GOP house, and GOP senate managed to get a shut down

For the hat trick, I'm sure they'll find a way to collapse the economy again. I mean the last 3 times in history the GOP has had full control there's been an economic calamity. A regime full of deregulation, weak government, and flush cash for the elites. How could speculation go wrong?

But a one party government shut down... that's a new one. Message to Washington, totally received.

[Ragedaug]

Sounds like a GOP problem then

Partially it is for sure. But you also had the voters who split the Senate pretty evenly, so with anything that needs 60 votes, they aren't going to get any traction regardless. But yeah, it's how politics works. They even had 5 Dems voting with the Republicans for the current stop gap. But McConnell and four other Pubs voted against it, not counting no-show McCain, so they are kinda all over the place in getting anything done. One of the reasons you'll never see a "Wall".

[Milchshake]

Lots and lots of vodka...

Why else would they invite Russia into the Party?