Increasingly Optimistic: BFA seems to be the start of a much-needed reboot

[CreatureLives]

I consider it to be part of WoW 3. Legion was the start of the current reboot and BFA continues that. These last 2 expansions definitely feel like a new era for WoW. Legion fixed a lot of the internal shit and BFA seems to be fixing a lot of external shit. These last 2 expansions make WoW feel like it's becoming a game again.

Vanilla/TBC/Wrath = WoW 1
Cata/MoP/WoD = WoW 2
Legion/BFA/??? = WoW 3

[Aeula]

If they wanted to please more the vanilla-crowd, they wouldn't shove us a crappy alliance vs horde story down the throat. Alliance vs Horde is more cataclysm-like; and we know how this ended.

That’s story, which vanilla barely had.

I’m talking about gameplay, which is what most Vanilla fans beg for.

[Sencha]

I agree it seems to go in the right direction. First time I'm getting some hype for an extension since WotLK.

[Mask]

The audience for vanilla is very niche at best

For sure. The vanilla audience only brought 7 million players to WoW at a time when MMO's weren't popular at all. Only the shut in nerds played them. Definitely don't want a game of that caliber again.

[Deleted]

WoW2 is never happening and they have no problems attracting new players, since that's what the majority of players is. They reported a while back during MoP I believe that they had reached 100 milion of accounts, which would mean (ignoring the core million or so) that there's roughly around 10 million of new players each expansion entering and 10 million new or older players leaving the game, assuming it holds to this day in a similiar way. That's why the game feels so much different from the earlier versions, it shifted it's focus group and it seems to work out for them. At least that's what I got from it.

[Grokresh]

Why do people always talk about wow dying? still, by far the largest pay to play MMO, still very profitable and expansions themselves still sell a shit ton of copies. This sort of talk comes all the time over the years, with most estimates putting is around 5 million players it's only two million less then classic which wasn't even remotely considered a faliure, not to mention paid transactions help make up a good chunk of profits regardless of the lost players. Games doing fine, I know it seems like it has to die evenutally but it doesn't seem like it cares about that so called fact.

[lummiuster]

Max level should go back to 60 or 70 along with the hard leveling and the low level wpvp that we used to have. Leveling seemed to be as big as max level. Everything you were doing seemed relevant. It was worth investing a week in Zulfarak to farm the 2 swords that would form the legendary sword or Wailing cavern for the leather shoulders or.. Now they want us to see the whole content without spending too much time leveling so they killed the importance of all level below 110.

[cuafpr]

I’m seeing indications that they’re making changes to bring Vanilla players back.

For example I’ve heard that some threat reducing enchantments have been datamined. This overall has me worried for the future of the game. The audience for vanilla is very niche at best and the vanilla community has proven to be so toxic that I wouldn’t be wanting those kind of players back anyway as they’re likely to drive off new comers and the existing casual player base.

I was ready to pre order BfA no matter what for the Allied races. Now I’m not even sure if I’ll buy the expansion at all.

as a tank i'd love for them to kill our DPS in groups and go back to threat mgmt.

[shoc]

The intimidation factor of leveling is a moot point if Blizz offers a free level 110 to allow players to quickly jump into the new action.

[Kieldon]

I consider it to be part of WoW 3. Legion was the start of the current reboot and BFA continues that. These last 2 expansions definitely feel like a new era for WoW. Legion fixed a lot of the internal shit and BFA seems to be fixing a lot of external shit. These last 2 expansions make WoW feel like it's becoming a game again.

Vanilla/TBC/Wrath = WoW 1
Cata/MoP/WoD = WoW 2
Legion/BFA/??? = WoW 3

Pretty much the way I see it. I did enjoy both Cata and MoP but it was a different feeling than the previous trio. Legion felt fresh compared to the rest and it felt like it's really dealing with some shit from the past. I am very optimistic about BfA after a long era of scepticism.

[Aeula]

For sure. The vanilla audience only brought 7 million players to WoW at a time when MMO's weren't popular at all. Only the shut in nerds played them. Definitely don't want a game of that caliber again.

There were no casual alternatives at that time and many quit for reasons other than the direction of the game. Such as real life problems.

[Deleted]

Threat is just an example.

The whole deal with level scaling shenanigans and how they overtuned timewalking dungeons are making me feel like they’re gearing the game back towards the Vanilla crowd.

Not to mention I didn’t like Legion or WoD and things aren’t improving.

Just sounds like the game isn't for you anymore if you didn't like the last expac, don't like the current and already seem negative towards the next. Maybe find something else before you grow bitter.

[Deleted]

The other major issue has been leveling. Now with 120 levels, beginning a new toon - especially as a new player with little gold and few if any heirlooms, is extremely intimidating (and one free max level isn't that helpful for a new player who will more than likely choose a class that won't end up being best suited for hem).

sorry but THIS is just a bunch of BS. leveling is not intimitating as
#1 you get a char boost
#2 you have class trials to test out EVERY class to see what fits you best.

I also think BfA is doing right by moving more away from toons being demi-gods to them simply being great warriors again.

no it doesnt and why should it? just because YOU dont like it? our heroes have slained Dragons, Elemental Lords, etc, etc we ARE bigh Heroes no matter that YOU dont like it. its YOUR flaw that in YOUR story you just wanna be a janitor who digs through poo and nothing more.

Vulpera certainly look like they are made to join the alliance with the Sekarath finally giving the Horde a snake-race soon

Lies and speculation from you. PS: blizzard stated we WONT get snake people....

It appears a mild-reboot can occur via an expansion or two and a slew of patches.

there wont be and we dont need a REBOOT. if you dont like the game go play classic in 2019 and be just a janitor.....I prefer my hero to evolve FORWARD not backwards.

[Kuruption]

I like that they're adding back stuff that they pruned (Fort, Arc Int, Battle Shout, de-enrage abilities, tremor totem, etc). For some reason, that alone is getting me more excited about this expansion than anything else I knew about it beforehand.

[Deleted]

Yeah, a single current story not the one we have now where you time travel to a different period every 10-20 levels

Exactly. Also the zones aren't connected as strictly as they are once you get to Draenor.

That needs some work. Also, seeing all the new models, I really hope the old zones get them as well.

[Mafic]

WoD and Legion were terrible because of class design and excessive RNG.

BFA is pruning 3.0 which defeats the entire point of system revamps when the classes have been boring to play in two consecutive expansions.

[Deleted]

From a lore perspective it seems that's exactly what they're doing. But instead of the Legion being the looming threat, it'll be the void and old gods.

[Deleted]

This game won't get any new players while the level cap is 120. It needs a massive nerf. No one see's 120 levels and thinks "oh yeah, i'll try that".

Honestly, they should make it 30 levels or something and have every level take longer but reward something substancial (skill or talent). That would bring people in.

[Deleted]

Not sure how 1-120 is indimidating. I guess that's going to be about 4 days played for a new player. Compared to the 10-15 days it was in classic, it's still a very quick experience. Other than this I agree that the game has way too much information to take in for a new player and it's full of players with 10+ years of experience. It's really hard to get to the level of veteran players. I've seen lots of people coming from other games and boy they sucked even after months of training.

5-7 days not 10-15

[Mirishka]

I've thought about the long-term future - and viability - of WoW since MoP. It has generally been my opinion - until recently - that the franchise would eventually have to do WoW 2.0, beginning fresh with maybe some way to transfer old WoW accounts to maintain some continuity. The issue as I saw it was the need to attract new players; a lot of us who have been playing for several expansions are getting older and playing less and we know the playerbase is much smaller than it was at its prime. While WoW can't really hope for those numbers of subscribers again (barring substantial expansion into untapped markets), the game needs to attract new players and WoW has become to unfriendly to newcomers - something a 'reboot/sequel' would seemingly achieve.

However, the increasingly effective means of upgrading the games' systems and graphics has made it easier to patch in, and use expansions for more major revamps, the changes needed to keep WoW viable. This makes part of the need for a 'real sequel' moot - we can get totally new systems, entirely new graphics engines, etc. without every destroying the existing WoW realms.

The other major issue has been leveling. Now with 120 levels, beginning a new toon - especially as a new player with little gold and few if any heirlooms, is extremely intimidating (and one free max level isn't that helpful for a new player who will more than likely choose a class that won't end up being best suited for hem). Fortunatetly, it appears Blizzard is very aware of this (and how it also affects alts - with each new expansion, beginning a new alt becomes all the more tedious). Even before BfA we've seen an expansion sized change with the change to leveling. I tend to think this is just the beginning; I think we'll see continuous work on consolidation of leveling, the story, old zones, etc).

I also think BfA is doing right by moving more away from toons being demi-gods to them simply being great warriors again. Moreover, the new subraces appear to be just the beginning of a huge expansion on choices for customization of existing races, the addition of many new sub-races and the easy addition of new races (Vulpera certainly look like they are made to join the alliance with the Sekarath finally giving the Horde a snake-race soon). They also seem more interested in increasing spec/toon customization.

It appears a mild-reboot can occur via an expansion or two and a slew of patches.

You lost me at 'new graphics engine'. WoW looks fine, it is exactly what it wants to be, unlike all the 'uncanny valley' games that try so hard and fail to actually look real.