Does Jaina have an equal in the Horde?

[Ravingmad]

As a mage for the horde, I think Aethas Sunreaver is the strongest mage they have. But I don't think he's as powerful as Jaina.
Theres also Meryl Feltorm (becomes a Mage Follower). He was one of the original member of the Council of Tarisfal, he was the guardian of Med'an and have about 3,000 years of existence and knowledge. He's undead but I don't think he's really in the Horde, but let's pretend he is.

The only one I know could kill her is Garona, as she almost killed Kadgar in WoD. (But she's not a mage)

The Horde is more melee oriented overall. Power-wise I think the Alliance have stronger heroes. Even if Hellscream/Garrosh (IMO the strongest Warriors in the WoW story) could wipe an army by themselves, they can't destroy a building or wipe a city as fast as a mage could.

Vol'jin is supposed to be very powerful as a Shadow Hunter, but we barely saw an of his skills in the matter, making him a only a Hunter (bowman) who can talks with the spirits so far.

[Saverem]

Alliance often had powerhouse characters or entities.
But powerhouses prob:
- Jaina
- Malfurion
- Varian (Goldrin spirit, but he be dead)
- Velen
- Thrall
- The Ancients
- The Naaru

Those last 3 don't work for the Alliance.

If you're talking in terms of character power, I'd put Thrall up there with Jaina when he was at his strongest. He lost his Doomhammer and most of the Elements are treating him like that smelly kid at school and ignoring him, so he's pretty weak right now. I'd put him in last place at the moment. That doesn't mean he can be BFFs with the elements again in the future in some kind of redemption mini-arc tho.

[Friendlyimmolation]

As a mage for the horde, I think Aethas Sunreaver is the strongest mage they have. But I don't think he's as powerful as Jaina.
Theres also Meryl Feltorm (becomes a Mage Follower). He was one of the original member of the Council of Tarisfal, he was the guardian of Med'an and have about 3,000 years of existence and knowledge. He's undead but I don't think he's really in the Horde, but let's pretend he is.

The only one I know could kill her is Garona, as she almost killed Kadgar in WoD. (But not she's not a mage)

Aethas is assuredly not as powerful as Rommath. It would be absurd if he was.

[Friendlyimmolation]

It's clear that undeath is not free will. People change drastically when brought back.

Blizzard confirmed it was free will, hell in the new book preview Nathanos comments that some forsaken disagreeing with her is what she gets for letting them have free will.

[Verdugo]

People change drastically when brought back.

So far the only character change after undeath is a bit more edge, so if anything, Jaina is going to be even more unstable than now.

Raising her would be a hindrance, just burn her corpse so that no one else gets ideas.

[Dellis0991]

This is rather unfortunate news.

I haven't experienced nor seen this Scenario, but if she really is as strong as people as claiming - and there is no counterpart against her on the Horde side - it's more than likely that they are setting her up to be a raid boss. And that is, quite frankly, getting annoying.

She hasn't been a personal favorite of mine for a while, due to rather silly storyline as of late, but I still had hopes for her.

I don't think she will be a raid boss, her mental state is hasn't been a issue anymore if you read war crimes and i got hopes too that she doesn't go out like a evil chump.

[Dartz1979]

Why do people hate on Jaina so much She's so sexy.. that's like you scrubs that hate on kalufa in dragon ball super come on people we need to love our female waifus more not hate them so much.. be like brother love: I looooooove youu!!! ahh only someone growing up in the 90's would understand the wrestling reference i just used.

[gcsmith]

you must have played another SW Rescue Scenario then there was no sign of any *pissing in pants , fear* whatsoever thalyssra didn't even seemed impressed

"Run, we cannot defeat her." Right, not impressed, but thought that even the whole group couldn't defeat her. They literally only escape at the end because she puts saving innocents over murdering invaders.

[Dellis0991]

Those last 3 don't work for the Alliance.

If you're talking in terms of character power, I'd put Thrall up there with Jaina when he was at his strongest. He lost his Doomhammer and most of the Elements are treating him like that smelly kid at school and ignoring him, so he's pretty weak right now. I'd put him in last place at the moment. That doesn't mean he can be BFFs with the elements again in the future in some kind of redemption mini-arc tho.

i remember when thrall and malfurion met back in cata...it was amazing seeing 2 titanic powerhouses chatting it up and just thinking that these 2 are so damn powerful they keep the world from breaking while we did our work.

[Instalock Bard]

Lol tar'Ogar!

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I hope we get to raid Stormwind and kill Jaina. That would be sweet revenge for alliance raiding Orgrimmar.

I mean.. to be fair- Garrosh was pretty messed up at the time, even the Horde wanted to take hm down. So really both factions raided Org

[gcsmith]

It's clear that undeath is not free will. People change drastically when brought back.

Undeath has free will, but, if you raise someone shortly after death they are raised in a state of agitation and blind anger (probably from being killed) and you can direct that towards friends and family.

Sylvanas doesn't brainwash those she raises, but that doesn't make her any less of a monster for raising others into what she believes is a cursed existance.

[Theoris]

Besides a conveniently placed sniper (like Shokia - except they'd be loyal to the Horde), I'm sure Sylvanas could give her a run for her money, what with banshees being able to cripple someone's ability to cast spells. Maybe Rommath too, but we haven't seen him in action yet (as far as I know) so who knows.

Saurfang and any other who fights in melee, probably not. She'd just freeze him solid and drop an ice comet on his head; or shatter him, as she does if you get too close to her in the BfA ALPHA Horde scenario.
Goddamn frost mages, man.

[Gaaz]

Why would Sylvanas raise her, so that she can have pissed off undead Jaina hunting her?


Free will, remember.

It does not work like that in game. If you do quests for Horde in the Silverpine Forest, you have a chain quest to raise several Alliance individuals. They went completely 180 from "we would never surrender to you Horde scum..." to "What is thy bidding my Queen" after resurrection. Now, I do not know if it is cannon or not, but in game, if you are raised as an undead by Sylvanas, you are serving her. Free will might just give you more reasoning ability as to how to serve her better and not being a dumb drone. But changing allegiance is likely out of the question.

[Friendlyimmolation]

It does not work like that in game. If you do quests for Horde in the Silverpine Forest, you have a chain quest to raise several Alliance individuals. They went completely 180 from "we would never surrender to you Horde scum..." to "What is thy bidding my Queen" after resurrection. Now, I do not know if it is cannon or not, but in game, if you are raised as an undead by Sylvanas, you are serving her. Free will might just give you more reasoning ability as to how to serve her better and not being a dumb drone. But changing allegiance is likely out of the question.

That is a mistake over gameplay over lore. Blizzard outright said there is no mind control when raising new Forsaken. This was confirmed back in an Ask CDEV.

[Friendlyimmolation]

Sorry, but there's no chance undeath doesn't change how a person behaves. Otherwise the SI:7 wouldn't have had to avoid the Forsaken in Silverpine and Slyvanas wouldn't waste time resurrecting the people on the isle that were willing to become Worgens to avoid undeath.

If undeath was a simple as you get up again and your body is dead then it would've been more advantageous for them to fight the Forsaken with humans instead of calling them all back and sending other races to fight.

There's even the undead Trollbane NPC in Arathi Highlands that willingly tells you where to find his still alive friend so you can kill him for a sigil. They may be able to choose not to side with Slyvanas, but they clearly aren't the person they used to be and a lot of them do choose to follow Sylvanas even though she was ruthless to them while they were alive.

Also I refuse to believe Slyvanas can't control people if she chooses to. At the very least she could destroy Jaina's brain and have her walk around as a mindless puppet to mock the Alliance.

None of that changes that no mind-control is involved. Being undead dampens your emotions. Galen murdered his dad for power, so I don't think he would have trouble killing his friends for more.

Not to mention they re-kill those who don't want to work with the Forsaken. If the Val'kyr could enter Sylvanas's mind, im sure they can detect treachery with newly raised forsaken.

[gcsmith]

It does not work like that in game. If you do quests for Horde in the Silverpine Forest, you have a chain quest to raise several Alliance individuals. They went completely 180 from "we would never surrender to you Horde scum..." to "What is thy bidding my Queen" after resurrection. Now, I do not know if it is cannon or not, but in game, if you are raised as an undead by Sylvanas, you are serving her. Free will might just give you more reasoning ability as to how to serve her better and not being a dumb drone. But changing allegiance is likely out of the question.

I mean, if you're going to quote ingame sources, I would like to point out that there is a forsaken in Eastern PLague lands who after the cataclysm said "I used to be a royal apocathary, but decided to join the Argent Crusade after sylvanas went nuts and decided to become what she and we all hated." and Then you have lilliana vess, sorry I mean Lillan Voss, as well as that undead troll bane. All that prove long term at least you get free will.

[Friendlyimmolation]

Point is that an undead Jaina would no longer be the Jaina everyone knew.

Probably not. She still would in all likelihood not be Horde though, unless they went extreme in fucking with her, at which point there's not real use for her anyways.

[gcsmith]

Sorry, but there's no chance undeath doesn't change how a person behaves. Otherwise the SI:7 wouldn't have had to avoid the Forsaken in Silverpine and Slyvanas wouldn't waste time resurrecting the people on the isle that were willing to become Worgens to avoid undeath.

If undeath was a simple as you get up again and your body is dead then it would've been more advantageous for them to fight the Forsaken with humans instead of calling them all back and sending other races to fight.

There's even the undead Trollbane NPC in Arathi Highlands that willingly tells you where to find his still alive friend so you can kill him for a sigil. They may be able to choose not to side with Slyvanas, but they clearly aren't the person they used to be and a lot of them do choose to follow Sylvanas even though she was ruthless to them while they were alive.

Also I refuse to believe Slyvanas can't control people if she chooses to. At the very least she could destroy Jaina's brain and have her walk around as a mindless puppet to mock the Alliance.

Being undead does change you, maybe people still hold firm that they wouldn't be accepted by friends and family, when the only reason that is is because the forsaken have a tendency to murder the living that trust them. They also no longer feel sensations like pain and pleasure. That will do a lot to someone. Especially if, like forsaken who haven't gone through nathanos' ritual which uses up a Valkyr, you feel like you're constantly rotting because you are.

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Point is that an undead Jaina would no longer be the Jaina everyone knew.

Probably not, she'd probably still murder horde though.

[Gaaz]

That is a mistake over gameplay over lore. Blizzard outright said there is no mind control when raising new Forsaken. This was confirmed back in an Ask CDEV.

There is no mind control. No one assumed that. It was a change in perception and loyalties. Sylvanas does not control them mentally. She just switched a circuit breaker in their brains, so to speak. So technically, it is not mind control.

[Friendlyimmolation]

There is no mind control. No one assumed that. It was a change in perception and loyalties. Sylvanas does not control them mentally. She just switched a circuit breaker in their brains, so to speak. So technically, it is not mind control.

"Serve me , run off, or die," isn't really a switch in circuits though.