Hopefully, this is not the extent of our BfA utility...

[Saverem]

Making RoP and Leg Sweep baseline is not the utility boost that Blizz promised all classes are getting.

On top of that, our Paralyze was nerfed down to 1m CD.


LS and RoP will only be useful in dungeons. There will still be nothing useful that a Monk will bring to raids. Look at DHs, they are getting a +5% magic damage increase buff pretty much solidifying their spot in any high end progression raid. Rogues get a +5% physical damage buff on top of their current utility toolkit. Warriors are getting three useful utility, Inspiring Presence, Last Stand, and Battle Shout. Pallies and Shamans are keeping all their fabulous utility, Shamans are getting WF totem back. Priests are getting Fort and Mages Arcane Int. Locks still bring 3 unique utilities that only they have Gate/HS/summons.

Meanwhile, Monks bring RoP and an AoE stun.... Both useless for 99% of raid encounters. Hopefully they add that Mastery raid buff to help out.

[Tech614]

On top of that, our Paralyze was nerfed down to 1m CD.

Umm, most all hard CCs got that same nerf. It's not a nerf if it's baseline in the game mechanically.

[Saverem]

Umm, most all hard CCs got that same nerf. It's not a nerf if it's baseline in the game mechanically.

If by "most" you mean just Paralyze and Imprison, then yeah...

Fear Root and Poly still spammable, Repentence still 15s, Hex and Trap still 30s.

[thesmall001]

We were promised no such thing. The utility "un-nerf" was aimed at classes who lost a lot of utility since Cataclysm. We walked through that process mostly unscathed and so have not had anything "given back to us".

[Tech614]

Root

Root.

The hardest of CCs.

[Jester Joe]

If by "most" you mean just Paralyze and Imprison, then yeah...

Fear Root and Poly still spammable, Repentence still 15s, Hex and Trap still 30s.

Fear, poly, repent, and hex are all casted.
Trap requires landing it, which granted in pve doesn't matter much usually.

[Super Kami Dende]

If by "most" you mean just Paralyze and Imprison, then yeah...

Fear Root and Poly still spammable, Repentence still 15s, Hex and Trap still 30s.

The difference is the spammable ones are casted.

[Saverem]

Fear, poly, repent, and hex are all casted.
Trap requires landing it, which granted in pve doesn't matter much usually.

The difference is the spammable ones are casted.

I'd very much prefer taking 1.5s and be able to spam cast it then have an instant cast on a 1m CD. If they're going to keep it on a 1min CD then they also need to make it not break immediately if someone so much as farts towards the mob being CC'd because that is what happens to it 99% of the time while running a M+ and I have to re-CC it.


Also, you all seem to be concentrating on a very small part of the bigger picture that is my argument. Monk utility is GARBAGE going into BfA unless they add something more to their toolkit. They're right on track to continue being a filler class no one cares about.

Going to 100% be jumping ship to DH main if they don't get something else. DH's +5% spell damage utility is looking great and that alone would make them a welcomed addition to any high end progression raid.

[Deleted]

Root.

The hardest of CCs.

Doesn't matter at all how "hard" it is.

There is not a single encounter in Antorus, or legion, where a root is worse than another CC.

Dungeon Odyn ? Root is good enough
Coven ? Root is good enough
Agrammar ? Root is good enough

And so forth.

[Julmara]

do dps at last keep the movement speed buff ?

[keqe]

Going to 100% be jumping ship to DH main if they don't get something else. DH's +5% spell damage utility is looking great and that alone would make them a welcomed addition to any high end progression raid.

That 5% spell damage is part of the readded buffs/debuffs which are unique to each class and every class should have one. Back near blizzcon we saw monk having the mastery buff as their unique buff. Granted DH's 5% spell damage is one if not the most powerful of all the buffs (it probably will be nerfed to 3% at some time).

But the point is we "should" be having one of those buffs too. No idea why some are missing in the alpha while some are in.


Shaman Capacitor Totem, Shadowfury for all lock specs ("new"), and Leg Sweep are the only full duration (3s) AoE stuns in BFA. Shaman totem has delay and Shadowfury a cast time. Not really an issue 99% time when planned but still it is quite good to have it instant. It is quite strong utility for m+ to be honest. And in raids utility is far less often useful and even there AoE stuns are most common in use. Quite unlikely we will see another aggramar like CC fiestas any time soon.

[Deleted]

Making RoP and Leg Sweep baseline is not the utility boost that Blizz promised all classes are getting.

Why are you lying?

Blizzard specificly said they wanted to remove a lot of the aoe stuns in the game. The Hard aoe CC*s

[dcc626]

i could have sworn you were "jumping ship" from monks months ago. suprised you are still here and arguing about how bad we have it...

[Jester Joe]

Doesn't matter at all how "hard" it is.

There is not a single encounter in Antorus, or legion, where a root is worse than another CC.

Dungeon Odyn ? Root is good enough
Coven ? Root is good enough
Agrammar ? Root is good enough

And so forth.

Not even close to true.
Aggramar needs the adds fully cc'ed on heroic.
Same for coven.

[keqe]

Not even close to true.
Aggramar needs the adds fully cc'ed on heroic.
Same for coven.

His examples are correct though. Root is just as good for aggramar as any other disabling CC. Only banish is superior since it can't be accidentally broken.

Mass Entanglement is pretty much standard for Coven. Immobilizes a wall near completely for entire duration of the adds.

[dhays]

Pretty sure we are in EARLY ALPHA. There is no reason to panic right now. From the Alpha notes it looks like they are doing minor changes here and there for each class followed by some major changes. Until this reaches Beta there is absolutely no reason to panic and stir up a shit storm for nothing.

That's my 2 cents at least.

[Saverem]

That 5% spell damage is part of the readded buffs/debuffs which are unique to each class and every class should have one. Back near blizzcon we saw monk having the mastery buff as their unique buff. Granted DH's 5% spell damage is one if not the most powerful of all the buffs (it probably will be nerfed to 3% at some time).

But the point is we "should" be having one of those buffs too. No idea why some are missing in the alpha while some are in.


Shaman Capacitor Totem, Shadowfury for all lock specs ("new"), and Leg Sweep are the only full duration (3s) AoE stuns in BFA. Shaman totem has delay and Shadowfury a cast time. Not really an issue 99% time when planned but still it is quite good to have it instant. It is quite strong utility for m+ to be honest. And in raids utility is far less often useful and even there AoE stuns are most common in use. Quite unlikely we will see another aggramar like CC fiestas any time soon.

I don't think it'll be nerfed to 3%, but I do think Inscription will let you make something that has a 3% effect since they seem to be getting a bootlegged Battle Shout/Fort/Int etc for when there are no class that can provide that buff in raid.


As for the second part, that is the point of my entire post. All the utility Monks are getting is for M+. We have NO RAID UTILITY. We have no Spirit Link Totem/Lust/Brez/Gateway/Lock Candy/Buffs/etc that will be useful for raiding.

- - - Updated - - -

Not even close to true.
Aggramar needs the adds fully cc'ed on heroic.
Same for coven.

Someone should tell my guild that, we've been killing H Agg and Coven for a few months now using roots/mass entangle.

[Jester Joe]

Someone should tell my guild that, we've been killing H Agg and Coven for a few months now using roots/mass entangle.

I was thinking snares, not roots for some reason.

Either way, you know this is more than just PvE balancing right?

Still compare Entangling roots that has a cast timer, to paralyze.

[Saverem]

I was thinking snares, not roots for some reason.

Either way, you know this is more than just PvE balancing right?

Still compare Entangling roots that has a cast timer, to paralyze.

Root also have a 35 yard range and Paralyze 20, root also doesn't break with 1 DoT tick. Who wouldn't trade +15 yards and spammable casts for an extra 1.5s cast time? Literally no one for no reason. Paralyze/Imprison was severely overnerfed no matter how you look at it. I could maybe get a 30s CD IF they increased its range to 30 yards to compensate, but 1 min CD on a 20 yard ability that'll break on 1 point of damage is just garbo.

[lewdest]

I wish they'd delete monks, literally no one is as whiny as those losers.

10% movement speed aura isn't bad, unless they removed it. DH's 5% magic debuff is worthless because ALL Warlock specs have the same thing on top of being a much better class and having Healthstones and Gateway. The Monk/DH incap change was because it's retarded in PvP, people use it just to interrupt casts while mongoloiding a target down. Who even uses ANY non-stun CC in dungeons? Do you really need to spam it? Are you really so inept that you can't simply move away from the target you CC'd? You're also missing that they're removing AoE stuns from a lot of classes, so Monk having one is amazing for dungeons.