Would JRPGs appeal more to Western audiences if they had older protagonists?

[Planetdune]

I don't like the art style nor the age displayed in these pictures... I have been around teens enough of my young life to not subject myself to that (naive and usually dumb) mindset anymore.

[The One Percent]

If you don't like the aesthetics of JRPGs, don't fucking play them. EZ

[ManiaCCC]

Honestly, I'm surprised that the art style is such a deal breaker for most people. I figured it would be the gameplay, or the lack there of. JRPG's have typically been woefully lacking in gameplay, and recent attempts at bizzare hybrids of real time and turn based combat have done little to change that.

Keeping the mechanics but changing the art style gets you a game like the aforementioned Undertale. Do the people slamming the Anime art style enjoy Undertale? I'd be willing to bet the answer is "Yes" for at least some. Because, mechanically, Undertale was is JRPG. Just something to think about.

If you don't like artstyle, you feel pretty disconnected from the game. I have no idea how good or bad JRPGs are, because I couldn't play any more than 30 seconds.

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Out of those games only DO2 and Witcher are RPGs. Skyrim, F4 and (lol) Undertale are not RPGs.

What is, in your opinion, RPG? While I am not big fan of Skyrim or F4, I can't see how these are not RPGs.

[Arrashi]

What is, in your opinion, RPG? While I am not big fan of Skyrim or F4, I can't see how these are not RPGs.

A game that actually has all, or almost all core rpg elements. Not games like skyrim or F4 that are missing more of RPG elements than have them remaining. But to be quick - RPG is a game that tries to simulate pen&paper session.

[ManiaCCC]

A game that actually has all, or almost all core rpg elements. Not games like skyrim or F4 that are missing more of RPG elements than have them remaining. But to be quick - RPG is a game that tries to simulate pen&paper session.

was playing pen&paper D&D for almost 15 years and not a single game could come even close to this experience. However as much as I love Witcher 3, it is as shallow , rpg mechanics-wise, as Skyrim or F4 is. Only what is left from pen&paper rpgs here is some character progression, loot and simple decision making via quests.

Where is Witcher 3 much better is quest design and feel of the world (and combat). It is overall, imo, better game..but it is not more RPG than Skyrim or F4.

My 2 cents.

[Arrashi]

was playing pen&paper D&D for almost 15 years and not a single game could come even close to this experience. However as much as I love Witcher 3, it is as shallow , rpg mechanics-wise, as Skyrim or F4 is. Only what is left from pen&paper rpgs here is some character progression, loot and simple decision making via quests.

Where is Witcher 3 much better is quest design and feel of the world (and combat). It is overall, imo, better game..but it is not more RPG than Skyrim or F4.

My 2 cents.

It is more of an RPG than skyrim and F4 in a sense that it at least tries to have RPG-esque storytelling. Rather than "Open world - do radiant quests". Tho it definately lacks skills that translate to your interaction with world.

[ManiaCCC]

It is more of an RPG than skyrim and F4 in a sense that it at least tries to have RPG-esque storytelling. Rather than "Open world - do radiant quests". Tho it definately lacks skills that translate to your interaction with world.

Well.. I don't know. Story is there. It is not that as good story as witcher has, that's for sure, but I don't think it is right to downplay some games as RPGs just because we don't like their stories.

Also in classic D&D, there were some adventures, which was basically open world sandbox and players loved it back then.

Anyway, we are just throwing our opinions back and forth. Until there will be some definition of RPG, we can think whatever we want and still be not sure if we are wrong or right.

[Skytotem]

They'd appeal more if they gave me more non-human characters to play.

EDIT:

And not elves or catgirls either! Or prettyboi dragons!

GIVE ME ORCS AND GOBLINS DAMNIT

[Arrashi]

Well.. I don't know. Story is there. It is not that as good story as witcher has, that's for sure, but I don't think it is right to downplay some games as RPGs just because we don't like their stories.

Also in classic D&D, there were some adventures, which was basically open world sandbox and players loved it back then.

Anyway, we are just throwing our opinions back and forth. Until there will be some definition of RPG, we can think whatever we want and still be not sure if we are wrong or right.

There is no RPG definition mostly because of complete degradation of that term. It was in early 2000's where term "With RPG elements" was everywhere, pretty much blurring the line. The fact that many smaller genres (like hack'slash, dungeon crawler) got absorbed into RPG genre, resulting in it becoming this shapeless blob.

[StrawberryZebra]

Out of those games only DO2 and Witcher are RPGs. Skyrim, F4 and (lol) Undertale are not RPGs.

Undertale very explcitly uses the same gameplay mechanics and hooks as old school JRPGs.

If you don't like artstyle, you feel pretty disconnected from the game.

I get that.

I was more interested in why that was the case when JRPG's have almost uniformly had bland and repetative rock-paper-scissors gameplay since they their inception. They've always leaned heavilly on their narrative to carry the game because they knew the gameplay was shallow.

Personally, I've always considered that other genres being able to tell compelling stories as hardware and storage space improved was what spelled the death of the JRPG. Until the PS2 era, JRPG's pretty much had a monopoly on compelling gameplay stories. These days, even balls to the walls FPS games have deep stories. Exposing the lack of gameplay in JRPG's left them with out much of a niche to call their own anymore.

The fact that many smaller genres (like hack'slash, dungeon crawler) got absorbed into RPG genre, resulting in it becoming this shapeless blob.

Those genres still exist independently of RPG's though. Hell, modern day Hack n Slash titles have evolved more into Shooter Looters with games like Warframe and Destiny.

What you're referring to as "degeneration" was developers attempting to innovate on the "Who has bigger numbers?" model of RPG combat. It produced wildly varying RPGs like Kingdoms of Amalur and Mass Effect, and both the video game industry and the RPG genre are better for them having been made.

[Krothar]

That's kinda the whole thing NieR did which is why we only got Old Man NieR. Didn't really work out though.

[ati87]

Biggest issue with JRPG's isn't the sometimes lazy graphics or art-style but more gameplay, for some reason it has to have something annoying.

I bought my PS4 because of Jrpgs's (since the pc ports are travesties) but every game I played has something annoying gameplay wise.

[Deleted]

There is no RPG definition mostly because of complete degradation of that term. It was in early 2000's where term "With RPG elements" was everywhere, pretty much blurring the line. The fact that many smaller genres (like hack'slash, dungeon crawler) got absorbed into RPG genre, resulting in it becoming this shapeless blob.

Pretty much this. RPG has become a useless term due to being overused extensively in the last decade. I mean, even WoW still gets called a RPG, despite so many basic RPG features being removed. JRPG isn't really a good term either, so many different games get that tagged with that identifier, from Action, Adventure, tactical and Walking Simulators. Maybe Moe is a bit of over-represented the last 2-3 years, but they still don't represent the whole market. They are just very visible and western purists game magazines love to rip them apart. Guess that's why so many think that really is all there is to JRPGs, they just lack the information.

Still don't understand why those devs should cater to the western audience. It will backfire with their primary market.

[Video Games]

That's kinda the whole thing NieR did which is why we only got Old Man NieR. Didn't really work out though.

Sales wise sure, but papa nier is so much better than onii nier even if it was more depressing because he had to fuck old men for money to buy food

[Shanden]

My interest for jrpg was mostly killed due to overuse of waifus, catgirls, lolis, personification of weapons as bodysuit schoolgirls with hugh tits and so on. If you cannot sell your game without fanservice then I am just too old for your shit. It is really a shame what has become of animes and jrpg these days (last 20 years). Ecchi was once a somewhat niche occurance but now its "normal" and put into everything wether it fits or not.

[Velshin]

Pretty much this. RPG has become a useless term due to being overused extensively in the last decade. I mean, even WoW still gets called a RPG, despite so many basic RPG features being removed. JRPG isn't really a good term either, so many different games get that tagged with that identifier, from Action, Adventure, tactical and Walking Simulators. Maybe Moe is a bit of over-represented the last 2-3 years, but they still don't represent the whole market. They are just very visible and western purists game magazines love to rip them apart. Guess that's why so many think that really is all there is to JRPGs, they just lack the information.

Still don't understand why those devs should cater to the western audience. It will backfire with their primary market.

I remember the days in the 80s and the early 90s where an RPG video game was something so rare and niche. To the point that was only getting 1 or 2 per year. RPGs games were rare until late the late 90s and early 2000 where things starting to overflow the market and the term RPG is being overused.

[Val the Moofia Boss]

JRPGs appeal to me because they have younger, idealistic protagonists with actually morals, as opposed to the edgy, middle-aged military men who stand around talking about how Machiavellian they're willing to get for the sake of "the greater good".

[Gandrake]

Would protagonists like these appeal more to Western audiences than teenagers?

I think when you want to talk about a JRPG that did appealing to western audiences right, you have to look at a game like dragon's dogma. it's not gay weaboo shit. you have warriors, you have assassins, you have mages; none of that naruto ninja bullshit. it's like shadow of the colossus meets skyrim meets a baby version of dark souls. there are basically no hair gel cactus haircuts in the game, it's a little more real looking and was originally based on the Berserk anime.

I think that the hairstyles and generally rail-thin teens being on the cover of JRPGs is probably what doesn't sell the game to a broader audience. the men look like women or they are someone's roided up grandpa that's still juicing up at 70 years old and pumping iron and snorting 10 fat rails of white lightning every day.

one of FFXIV's selling points is probably Gladiolus Amicitia. He was a pretty boy, but he was still very manly. He wasn't a bitch either, he told Notcis off when he was acting like a pussy; the guy had a lot of grit and fire and was a fine representation of masculinity. I can't speak for others, but it's pretty rare that JRPG players can congratulate a game maker on making a very masculine and well received character. Additionally, it was disappointing that you never got to play Cor as he was made very well too.

[Kaleredar]

JRPGs all tend to mush together. Similar art styles, similar characters, similar worlds... If all of them seem a dime a dozen, none of them are going to become very popular, "age of the protagonist" notwithstanding.


Give me an JRPG that's solidly rooted in... something, other than the generic amalgam medieval sword and sorcery filigreed style and maybe you can catch my interest.

(And no, dropping a "but it's in the future" at the end of that generic descriptor doesn't cut it.)

[Xar226]

It isn't the protagonists age that turns me off, it's the art style.

Same.

I would absolutely fucking love more games in the vein of oldschool Final Fantasy, etc. I love that art style, I love that gameplay, etc. But the "anime garb" as the OP put it really turns me off.