Time travel Orcs are a Tumor on the setting

[Skytotem]

I feel it's a mistake to use the Time-travel AU Fake-Draenor orcs as the allied race rather than ones from Outland using those Clan Aesthetics.

This raises a lot of problems from the terrible time travel nonsense.

What do we do about duplicate characters?

Why don't the orcs and draenei just resettle there? Why doesn't the existence of AU draenor solve all the stupid resource issues between Alliance and Horde?

If someone important dies why don't we just link to ANOTHER timeline where they didn't die?

It cheapens the whole of the setting, it cheapens Outland and WC1-2.

It cheapens REAL Grom's death.

It cheapens the entire orc story arc.

[Maxilian]

What do we do about duplicate characters?

They most likely will evade ever using duplicate character, they will A) Stay in Draenor B) Go like UA Velen

Why don't the orcs and draenei just resettle there? Why doesn't the existence of AU draenor solve all the stupid resource issues between Alliance and Horde?

Most of the Orcs and Draneai in Azeroth feel like that's their home already, most of them were born there, but yes, it does "solve" the resource problem, or just expand the war to Draenor

If someone important dies why don't we just link to ANOTHER timeline where they didn't die?

They don't have the power to create such portals, and pretty sure the Bronze Dragonflight will try to evade for more portals to be created to different timelines.

It cheapens REAL Grom's death.

Why? UA Guldan did not made our Guldan worse or better (i actually like how the UA Guldan was made -love him in the voice novel-)

[Skytotem]

They most likely will evade ever using duplicate character, they will A) Stay in Draenor B) Go like UA Velen



Most of the Orcs and Draneai in Azeroth feel like that's their home already, most of them were born there, but yes, it does "solve" the resource problem, or just expand the war to Draenor



They don't have the power to create such portals, and pretty sure the Bronze Dragonflight will try to evade for more portals to be created to different timelines.



Why? UA Guldan did not made our Guldan worse or better (i actually like how the UA Guldan was made -love him in the voice novel-)

1. Avoid it and leave an awkward elephant in the room.

2. It's just ridiculous, what do we do about the rest of the Au world?

3. Don't have the power? One Bronze dragon did this with a mess of sand from the timeless isle, if the factions can't figure it out between Suramar and the Kirin Tor that's nonsense. Who the hell gives a crap what the Bronze dragons want anymore though, they're WEAK since Cata.

4. he did cheapen MU gul'dans legacy, bringing him in just to usher in the legion was a bad idea that blizz executed reasonably well, just like the Nightborne and void elves seem to be terrible ideas with reasonable execution, but Fake-Grom cheapens the death of MU Grom, REAL Grom, the existence of Fake-Draenor cheapens the existence of Outland, it makes the sacrifices and the lore of the First and Second wars meaningless.

[sillag]

well obviously dude

we all breathed a sigh of relief when we got to legion and could finally forget about warlords of draenor. in fact it was as if every character was sworn not to talk about any of it. even though gul'dan was from there and archimonde was conspicuously missing no one brought it up not even khadgar. and we were happy. it was as if world of warcraft finally made sense again,.
but little did we know the wod team were in the back room the whole time concocting up the rancid blight that we would later come to know as battle for azeroth

i mean they didnt even bother addressing the problem with doppelgangers in the actual wod expansion they sure as heck arent going to do it here. even though we are almost certainly going to see mass-murdering ethnic cleanser grom hellscream return and take his seat at the horde specifically formed not to repeat his personal past mistakes

like the problems with bringing these orcs back into the main timeline are so numerous and obvious, both in-universe reasons and basic storytelling reasons, we all know them and blizzard presumably does too.

so how can we explain what we are seeing

are they sabotaging battle for azeroth on purpose producers style so we all quit in disgust and move to the classic server so they can boast about how many subs it gets when they launch it

is battle for azeroth the first of the "three lies" designed to drive us all insane by how stupid everything in it is

do the new generation of blizzard writers just not understand the story and setting and are throwing whatever they think might look cool at the wall <- this one its this one

tbh with this wow's lore is dead to me i can only laugh at it now.

[ello]

The weird thing for me is that not only are these Orcs leaving their planet, they are leaving their freaking universe. Even if it's just a sect of them it'll be weird. They must've had a really good reason for doing so.

[Sliske]

I mean personally i'd prefer them to at least integrate it someway and this seems like a good way to do it. They pretty much abandoned Northrend, Outland, the Cata zones and MoP zones - its weird af that we have no progression for the scourge story. Its weird af that Outland is apparently still carrying on, despite it being basically an asteroid flying through space with no gravity and a bunch of fel magic everywhere. Its weird af that the Wildhammer clan didn't join the Alliance after Twilight Highlands. Its weird AF that we see no Tol'vir travellers at all in any part of the world despite us freeing them of corrupt elements and befriending them. Its weird af that we see no Jinyu or Hozen despite us befriending them and despite Garrosh bringing them to Orgrimmar in SoO.

All of this shit is weird, so fuck man, if I can get one bit of continuity even from a weird ass expansion like WoD, i'll take it.

[sillag]

there isnt even an excuse for it this time because we have the mag'har. we can just go to outland and get them. those are the ones from the actual story who have relationships to the characters. remember them?

maybe outland is finally falling apart and they're forced to come to azeroth and join the horde. or maybe they want to atone for garrosh's actions or even admire him and want to finish what he started by coming to azeroth. the story is literally there for them they can do anything with it. numbers dont even matter because of void elves

but no they are going to alternate draenor because

uh its honestly hard to think of a reason. like it cant be that they didnt want to use outdated looking tbc maps because they used the sunwell in the nightborne quest.

i can really only conclude that this is the work of some wod writer who has been nursing a grudge all this time because everyone correctly said that warlords of draenor's story was nonsense garbage. and this is his or her grand revenge

well great job blizzard you did it you finally ruined the lore beyond repair. we cant just ignore these guys once they're pc's.

or maybe we can i guess they did it with the gnomes

[cparle87]

I feel it's a mistake to use the Time-travel AU Fake-Draenor orcs as the allied race rather than ones from Outland using those Clan Aesthetics.

This raises a lot of problems from the terrible time travel nonsense.

What do we do about duplicate characters?

Why don't the orcs and draenei just resettle there? Why doesn't the existence of AU draenor solve all the stupid resource issues between Alliance and Horde?

If someone important dies why don't we just link to ANOTHER timeline where they didn't die?

It cheapens the whole of the setting, it cheapens Outland and WC1-2.

It cheapens REAL Grom's death.

It cheapens the entire orc story arc.

Considering 95% of the draenei living on Draenor are dead in our timeline it's pretty moot. I think Velen was the only prominent one who was alive and not evil in both.

The orcs and draenei, from our universe, don't want to settle there because one, it's not their world, and two, besides faction rivalries it's still a helluva lot more dangerous than Azeroth.

We can't link to any other timelines because the hourglass was broken trying to link just to one.

In your opinion.

Grommash is just as real as the one we were familiar with before.

In your opinion.

PS: I think WoD's biggest failing was the community. As soon as people hear alternate universe a part of their brain shuts down and they refuse to look at the situation logically or even more emotionally. OP, you put it very well "Fake-Draenor" "Cheapens" "REAL Grom". You didn't even try to get to know this world or these characters to even begin to make an emotional connection to them.

[sillag]

tbh how can you even say "our timeline orcs dont want to go there because its not OUR world" in the same breath as you are trying to justify the alternate orcs coming to the main timeline

like what does it take to write that and not spot the problem

[yetgdhfgh]

there isnt even an excuse for it this time because we have the mag'har. we can just go to outland and get them. those are the ones from the actual story who have relationships to the characters. remember them?

Can we? Last time we was there, there planet was doomed and Garrosh incorporated them into his horde and we then massacred them all in the siege of Orgrimmar so who in that village is left?

[Captain Kennedy]

I could deal with alternate draenor if the legion and nether didn't span all timelines, and Gul'Dan wasn't the reason our Legion invaded. There is actual potential for good story telling with WoD, but after 6.0/6.1 it all fell to the wayside to make way for the Legion and the universe breaking bullshit they brought with them. And now it's such a mess I don't even what to see any of that potential for-filled.

[sillag]

Can we? Last time we was there, there planet was doomed and Garrosh incorporated them into his horde and we then massacred them all in the siege of Orgrimmar so who in that village is left?

like i said numbers literally dont matter bro. where do you think garrosh got that many from when its only one village. i mean have you even played this game how can you think blizzard pays any attention to the "numbers" the races are supposed to have. theres like 10 void elves but in short order they will be the most populous race on alliance.

[Skytotem]

You didn't even try to get to know this world or these characters to even begin to make an emotional connection to them.

I have an emotional connection to Outland and WC1-3 which is being shit on by this time travel nonsense.

[cparle87]

Can we? Last time we was there, there planet was doomed and Garrosh incorporated them into his horde and we then massacred them all in the siege of Orgrimmar so who in that village is left?

Source? Pretty sure Outland is still inhabitable. Besides Old Horde defectors like Malkorok and the Dragonmaws under Zaela I can't recall any other group in the Horde that universally joined Garrosh to be "massacred".

[yetgdhfgh]

Source? Pretty sure Outland is still inhabitable. Besides Old Horde defectors like Malkorok and the Dragonmaws under Zaela I can't recall any other group in the Horde that universally joined Garrosh to be "massacred".

Well Outland was breaking apart the last time we was there https://wow.gamepedia.com/Outland

Plus how many Brown orcs did you know back in MOP who could fill his Kor'kron? That village wasnt that fucking big its the reason the Horde didnt know there was any uncorrupted orcs left in Outland when they first got there!

[cparle87]

I have an emotional connection to Outland and WC1-3 which is being shit on by this time travel nonsense.

How? We hardly knew anything about the warlords, their pasts, ambitions, or personalities, from WC1-2? It's like that breadisfunny person whining about how Alleria has been "assassinated". The characters from WC1-2 were pretty one dimensional. It wasn't until WC3 and WoW that lore characters started getting fleshed out. Take the big names from WC1 for instance, like Gul'dan, Blackhand, and Orgrim. Before WoD did we know that Gul'dan was a cripple, was thrown out of his home, or how Kil'jaeden contacted him? Did we know how Blackhand got his name or anything about him besides "Gul'dan knew he would be a good puppet? Or was Orgrim anything but Blackhand's second who saw a chance to sieze power, took it, and only then discovered the Shadow Council and the corruption. Hell, in the original WC1 lore the player character WAS Orgrim and we didn't even get the name mentioned. It was like the "Commander" or "Executor" from SC1.

You have an emotional connection to cardboard cutouts that you've projected all these traits onto, only to have your headcanon ruined when it's revealed what they're actually like.

[Skytotem]

Well Outland was breaking apart the last time we was there https://wow.gamepedia.com/Outland

Doesn't mean it's breaking apart so fast it's an issue (could be breaking very slowly) or that it can't be slowed/stopped by shaman or druids.

[yetgdhfgh]

Doesn't mean it's breaking apart so fast it's an issue (could be breaking very slowly) or that it can't be slowed/stopped by shaman or druids.

and iam sure the draenai shamans can repair Argus??!

Did you not see that half eaten apple of a planet that was Argus? Iam sure Outlands looks much worse than that now!

Did you not see Netherstorm?

[Skytotem]

How? We hardly knew anything about the warlords, their pasts, ambitions, or personalities, from WC1-2? It's like that breadisfunny person whining about how Alleria has been "assassinated". The characters from WC1-2 were pretty one dimensional. It wasn't until WC3 and WoW that lore characters started getting fleshed out. Take the big names from WC1 for instance, like Gul'dan, Blackhand, and Orgrim. Before WoD did we know that Gul'dan was a cripple, was thrown out of his home, or how Kil'jaeden contacted him? Did we know how Blackhand got his name or anything about him besides "Gul'dan knew he would be a good puppet? Or was Orgrim anything but Blackhand's second who saw a chance to sieze power, took it, and only then discovered the Shadow Council and the corruption. Hell, in the original WC1 lore the player character WAS Orgrim and we didn't even get the name mentioned. It was like the "Commander" or "Executor" from SC1.

You have an emotional connection to cardboard cutouts that you've projected all these traits onto, only to have your headcanon ruined when it's revealed what they're actually like.

Because none of WC1-2 MATTERS anymore. Outland is essentially ignored. The lore characters from the past and the impact they had on the modern horde might as well not exist because their legacy and anything we COULD have learned about them has been shit on by this fake AU lore.

Even Ignoring how badly Kargath got treated in the MU, going from a character with towns and bays named after him, to being revealed to have been on the shadow council all along, it's worse now that we learn he WAS some gritty gladiator but this more recent version of him that died pathetically in highmaul is all that'll really be remembered.

The orcs had to murder their old characters and they've been reduced to hostile omnicidal idiots who could be talked into some grand orc crusade by GARROSH of all people.

[Deleted]

What if i don't give a damn? It's a game, relax.