Othmar Garithos VS Nathanos Brightcaller

[Toppy]

And because Arthas himself killed almost all paladins at that time

Yes, as an undead, fighting with an army of undead, with the kingdom having been in chaos and getting its shit kicked in, by undead.

[Syegfryed]

I'm not suggesting it be ignored, I'm saying that just because he can cast holy light doesn't mean he can cast other holy spells. The game deliberately avoided classifying him as a Paladin and gave him a mixture of abilities from various different classes. It's a totally different thing to suggest that he can cure disease and poison.

Sure it doesn't mean, but can be very implied on it.

Th game didn't classify him as paladin because frozen throne had all this heroic classes, like the wiki say he is a different archetype in the rpg series, maybe it was scrapped, but Garithos could easily fit in the scarlet crusade paladin vibe

and im not saying paladins always win against undead, like some no-brains think, im saying paladins have the uphand, an advantage, and in a melee frontal combat, Garithos would have the advantage against nathanos who is more know about his ranged abilities

As for the mind control point it wasn't a matter of proving he's weak to void/shadow magic, rather it does imply that he isn't strong against it. Someone who is strong against shadow magic should probably be able to break their mind control.

not if you don't know you are being controlled, and thats how Dreadlords work

- - - Updated - - -

Yes, as an undead, fighting with an army of undead, with the kingdom having been in chaos and getting its shit kicked in, by undead.

but he is not merely an undead, he was the most powerful death knight at time, with the most powerful rune blade, with a army of endless undead, who i bet Nathanos don't have

[bloodmoth13]

Really? Garithos fucked an entire race of elves, Nathanos couldnt even fuck one

While im team nathanos for this one, damn thats a sick burn!

[Toppy]

Sure it doesn't mean, but can be very implied on it.

Th game didn't classify him as paladin because frozen throne had all this heroic classes, like the wiki say he is a different archetype in the rpg series, maybe it was scrapped, but Garithos could easily fit in the scarlet crusade paladin vibe

and im not saying paladins always win against undead, like some no-brains think, im saying paladins have the uphand, an advantage, and in a melee frontal combat, Garithos would have the advantage against nathanos who is more know about his ranged abilities



not if you don't know you are being controlled, and thats how Dreadlords work

- - - Updated - - -



but he is not merely an undead, he was the most powerful death knight at time, with the most powerful rune blade, with a army of endless undead, who i bet Nathanos don't have

At the lowest point in his power, which was at the time low according to canon, with an army of almost nothing but ghouls, Arthas bested the greatest two of the greatest Paladins of all time (one of which may have been THEE greatest).

Point being, Paladins arent some big auto counter to undead. They have an advantage yes. But Nathanos is one of the mightest of all undead right now and was one of the mightiest of all humans in life (only getting far stronger in death).

In the same way that Sylvaanas wouldn't just fall down dead to Maxwell Tyrosus, Nathanos woudln't just fall down dead to Garithos, who we can at the most say is a entry level Paladin with a leaning towards warrior.

[bloodmoth13]

OT:hmar wins. No contest. Nathanos may have nice red eyes, be a nice ranger etc. But he is no match for the Garithos.

The only reason why Nathanos is winning because people don't know lore in WoW, and Nathanos is COOL looking and more fresh. I bet that 90% people who did vote Nathanos don't even know who the hell Othmar is.



And Nathanos abilities in the WoW is also just a gameplay. So your arguement is invalid.

He's a warrior... on a horse, full plated with shield and axe. He has Shockwave, Divine Light, Devotion Aura and Avatar.... Not sure how Summon Skeletons and Black Arrow is going to counter that. It's just impossible.

I think people are voting nathanos because they DO know the lore.
Nathanos was a badass, was a vanilla raid boss and has a bunch of lore that pretty much just states that this dude is lit.
Garithos was some pious asshole who screwed over the elves and got 1 shot by a dreadlord.

In game stats dont count for much, he might have been a good unit in war3 campaign, but that doesnt mean he was good in lore.

Though i dont really mind people liking the guy, i just think lore wise nathanos wins hands down

[Syegfryed]

At the lowest point in his power, which was at the time low according to canon, with an army of almost nothing but ghouls, Arthas bested the greatest two of the greatest Paladins of all time (one of which may have been THEE greatest).

how is the lowest point? ingame lv don't count that much, and even in his lowest point he was still goddamn strong, with the most powerful runeblade, the army of undead was endless, ingame numbers are not canon

Point being, Paladins arent some big auto counter to undead. They have an advantage yes. But Nathanos is one of the mightest of all undead right now and was one of the mightiest of all humans in life (only getting far stronger in death).

I never say they are "the most big counter" but they have advantage, this is obvious, because of the holy magic, i know he is stronger, and one of(if not) the best Rangers, but Garithos was also stronger and a skilled warrior

We are talking about a 1x1 open frontal fight, his ranger skills are not a big win, and he is going against a mounted warrior with full heavy armor with light spells, Garithos should have the uphand and should probably win, in this fight scenario, any other case Nathanos would obvious win

In the same way that Sylvaanas wouldn't just fall down dead to Maxwell Tyrosus, Nathanos woudln't just fall down dead to Garithos, who we can at the most say is a entry level Paladin with a leaning towards warrior.

And i didn't say that would happens.

[Toppy]

how is the lowest point? ingame lv don't count that much, and even in his lowest point he was still goddamn strong, with the most powerful runeblade, the army of undead was endless, ingame numbers are not canon



I never say they are "the most big counter" but they have advantage, this is obvious, because of he holy magic, i know he is stronger, and one of(if not) the best Rangers, but Garithos was also stronger and a skilled warrior

We are talking about a 1x1 open frontal fight, his ranger skills are not a big win, and he is going against a mounted warrior with full heavy armor with light spells, Garithos should have the uphand and should probably win, in this fight scenario, any other case Nathanos would obvious win


And i didn't say that would happens.

Arthas was powered by Frostmourne which was in turn powered by souls. Its stated outright that Arthas was the first of which it stole, so he was not all that powerful untill he started racking up a big kill tally, which was at a low point when he faced down Uther.

During his fight with Uther, Uther had been winning until the Lich King gave him some more power, so he wasn't entirely powered by the Lich King at this point either. He never became especially powerful until he got the Helm of Dominion. Until then he slowly grew in power, only for most of it to go away later on and then grow again.

[Orby]

even though he had some Paladin abilities in game, in lore he wasnt a Paladin, just a knight and Grand Marshal. Just something to take into account there.

[omeomorfismo]

How Garithos is weak to weapons, what is the logic behind this? when he is wearing a full bulky heavy armor and a massive shield with a 2H axe?

Garithos is skilled in melee combat, also is a paladin with holy magic, in an open close fight Garithos would win

an human stabbed potentially will die.
an undead even when lose entire parts of his body can continue to fight.

exactly like the holy.
an human receive normal damage meanwhile an undead receive even terrible pain.


and we dont know how much garithos is skilled, i mean, a typical human, even at high military position is weak relatively to other races. only a bunch of human like varian and lothar could somewhat reach orc level.
then light isnt a jolly free win against undeads, even ashbringer that is a naruu in a sword need a strong light user to be effective.
for all we see in w3 garithos is weak, is only achievement was being mindcontrolled with all his army by a dreadlord.

meanwhile being a zombie is basically a boost, more endurance, more defense, apparently even more strenght (at least considering that a bunch of ressed hungry farmer put in difficulty arthas and his guards)
nathanos himself is a very skilled human that could reach even high elves standard

[Deleted]

even though he had some Paladin abilities in game, in lore he wasnt a Paladin, just a knight and Grand Marshal. Just something to take into account there.

This is big kicker, WC3 abilities and spells mean jack fuck.

[Toppy]

This is big kicker, WC3 abilities and spells mean jack fuck.

You mean Garithos isnt also a mountain king and tauren chieftain?

[Verdugo]

This is big kicker, WC3 abilities and spells mean jack fuck.

But why didnt Cairne reincarnate after Garrosh killed him?

[Highwhale]

I think people are voting nathanos because they DO know the lore.
Nathanos was a badass, was a vanilla raid boss and has a bunch of lore that pretty much just states that this dude is lit.
Garithos was some pious asshole who screwed over the elves and got 1 shot by a dreadlord.

In game stats dont count for much, he might have been a good unit in war3 campaign, but that doesnt mean he was good in lore.

Though i dont really mind people liking the guy, i just think lore wise nathanos wins hands down

Yea sure. Read bold text. ROFL.

[CasualFilth]

He's dead isnt he?

So was Illidan, wasn't he? Don't underestimate THE POWER OF RETCON!!!!!111

[Highwhale]

So was Illidan, wasn't he? Don't underestimate THE POWER OF RETCON!!!!!111

I think Garithos would die from heart attack looking at current Alliance with goats, wolves and pandas...

- - - Updated - - -

He's basing it off of lore you daft twit. Lore is not a stat.

Nathanos' story is that while alive he was the ONLY human to be given the title of ranger lord, something obtained through merit of skill and achievement. As undead he managed to kill an assassination squad of five SI:7 agents sent after him, also he was part of the vanilla story as being a raid target, but escaping by faking his death.

Garithos' story is that he was in the military, had some modicum amount of tactics to win a few battles, received a promotion that may have been reliant on his father's social standings and land holdings, was racist that cost the Alliance the Elves, helped the forsaken, then died a forgettable death.

There's not a lot to go on to compare the two, but with what we do have the favor is leaning more towards Nathanos.

He basically saying Nathanos is cool and one of the reasons is because he was raid boss (game mechanic). Then he says game stats is irrelevant for discussion.

Its the same if i say Garithos is fucking boss because he was Hero unit.

Also no need for personal insults.

[Deleted]

I think Garithos would die from heart attack looking at current Alliance with goats, wolves and pandas...

- - - Updated - - -



He basically saying Nathanos is cool and one of the reasons is because he was raid boss (game mechanic). Then he says game stats is irrelevant for discussion.

Its the same if i say Garithos is fucking boss because he was Hero unit.

Also no need for personal insults.

http://www.yourdictionary.com/in-denial

"The definition of in denial is a refusal or unwillingness to accept something or to accept reality."

Honestly it's like you could write a book about being wrong.

[caervek]

The last and only human ranger lord trained by Sylvanas herself

AKA a faceroll group quest mob from Vanilla.

If green geared L60s could pwn his zombie ass then I doubt a fully trained paladin would have much trouble.

[Deleted]

Garithos hands down if anyone has bothered to read lore and know of his history and his abilities including his many, many genocidal accomplishments.

[Verdugo]

Garithos hands down if anyone has bothered to read lore and know of his history and his abilities including his many, many genocidal accomplishments.

Fanfiction.net is not a good site for lore buddy.

[Toppy]

AKA a faceroll group quest mob from Vanilla.

If green geared L60s could pwn his zombie ass then I doubt a fully trained paladin would have much trouble.

Ha. No. Even in TBC most classes couldnt solo him. You needed a group no matter your gear level in vanilla.