View Poll Results: Bell Curve for M+ Scores?

Voters
170. This poll is closed
  • I don't know because I never check.

    18 10.59%
  • <500

    5 2.94%
  • 500-1000

    6 3.53%
  • 1000-1200

    5 2.94%
  • 1200-1400

    5 2.94%
  • 1400-1600

    4 2.35%
  • 1600-1800

    5 2.94%
  • 1800-2000

    9 5.29%
  • 2000-2200

    11 6.47%
  • 2200-2400

    7 4.12%
  • 2400-2600

    14 8.24%
  • 2600-2800

    5 2.94%
  • 2800-3000

    9 5.29%
  • 3000-3500

    21 12.35%
  • 3500-4000

    11 6.47%
  • 4000+

    11 6.47%
  • 5000+

    6 3.53%
  • I don't like M+ scoring and I'm triggered even seeing this poll.

    18 10.59%
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  1. #21
    Elemental Lord Felfaadaern Darkterror's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ceall View Post
    I'm in the between 2.2-2.4K bracket but voted that I hate the scoring system.

    I even have 2 dungeons with 0 score, as one is cancer (seat of triumvirate, I just don't like it) and the other one hasn't appeared at all for our guild (DHT) for since the new "m+ season" has started.

    But I do like 95% of my keys with my guild, and only do a random +15 when it's Tuesday (playing in Europe with Wednesday reset) and didn't have the time to do any key with the guild throughout the week, which can happen as I have 12 hour shifts.

    To me, the best way to handle m+ experience is something in-game, alike the 15 intime AV. But instead, when queueing for m+, the group leader only sees what mythic level you have done. So, for example, you have done a +18 MoS, and want to queue for a +15 HoV, but you only have done HoV on +10 before. The group leader would see, that you have completed a +18 before and therefore, you're likely to get picked. Mind you, the group leader would not see WHICH dungeon you have done on +XX but rather, that you have done ANY dungeon on +XX.

    Third party websites/addons would also be only able to track, which Keystone level you have completed, basically disabling their functionality, as you'd already have that in-game.
    I would argue that someone looking to fill a group for Seat of the Triumvirate has a right to see that you have little experience with that one. Maybe they'll take you anyway based on your other credentials, especially if it's late and they are having trouble filling their group. But it's only fair that they be forewarned you don't know the instance very well. And if someone else in queue has a history of completing high Seat keys in time, it's fair that they can see that too. It's also fair that you can see whether the group leader has any history with the instance, so you can make an informed decision on whether to even apply to that group. Remember the addon works both ways. They can see whether to invite you, but you can see whether to apply.

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  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by ceall View Post
    Well, maybe it can be tweaked to show which Keystone level you have done on tyrannical and which level you have done on fortified for the respective weeks. So in tyrannical it shows +XY, while in fortified it shows +YZ. To show people's experience for the +10 affixes.
    That still doesn't make up for removing information regarding the specific dungeon you're about to do. Tyrannical HoV and tyrannical Vault are not comparable, for example.
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  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by ceall View Post
    Well, maybe it can be tweaked to show which Keystone level you have done on tyrannical and which level you have done on fortified for the respective weeks. So in tyrannical it shows +XY, while in fortified it shows +YZ. To show people's experience for the +10 affixes.
    That's what we sure agree on. Best would be in-game, not external sources.

  4. #24
    Elemental Lord Felfaadaern Darkterror's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fiestatastic View Post
    I'll pick up mythic raiders with 1k scores all day vs players with no mythic kills that pst me their 2-3k scores.
    But what about mythic raiders with high M+ scores? If someone had mythic raid kills but also a high M+ score, would you hold that against them? Because when I look at leader boards, I see a lot of correlation.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by webw0lf359 View Post
    1200-1400 bracket. 1,267 to be exact. Have scores from 16-11 and none for CoEn, Seat ,Kara Lower and Arcway (I've no score so cannot get an invite to 10+ - I should do a 5 or something on these just to push my score up)
    Yeah that was first thing we did, when we decided to work on raising our scores. We ran the ones we didn't have scores for so at least we wouldn't have zeroes. Took a couple weeks, as we were working with the keys we had among the five of us, but we've got them all now. We still haven't made the timer on a high Seat key. But we're getting better even at that one.

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  5. #25
    Please wait Temp name's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tradu View Post
    The problem is that having done a Maw+18 in time says nothing about your experience in HoV, which is the point of raider.io. Removing information from the playerbase is a terrible idea as well, if anything more information needs to be available.
    Adding an in-game way to show highest dungeon overall and highest level of the dungeon queued for would be nice though, and basically remove the need for the R.io addon for a lot of people

  6. #26
    Currently at the 5300+ bracket. Just casually doing some high keys with ma boyz.
    Last edited by lonely zergling; 2018-03-06 at 10:15 AM.

  7. #27
    Elemental Lord Felfaadaern Darkterror's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brewmaster Kolee View Post
    I would argue that someone looking to fill a group for Seat of the Triumvirate has a right to see that you have little experience with that one. Maybe they'll take you anyway based on your other credentials, especially if it's late and they are having trouble filling their group. But it's only fair that they be forewarned you don't know the instance very well. And if someone else in queue has a history of completing high Seat keys in time, it's fair that they can see that too. It's also fair that you can see whether the group leader has any history with the instance, so you can make an informed decision on whether to even apply to that group. Remember the addon works both ways. They can see whether to invite you, but you can see whether to apply.
    Imagine if RL putting together a pug for Antorus could only see your logs for Emerald Nightmare? That might tell them if you are good player, but would not tell them if you knew the fights for Antorus.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by lonely zergling View Post
    Currently at the 5300+ bracket.
    Impressive! Kudos.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Too early to say for sure, but looks like we might get a double curve?
    With those who mostly farm weekly chest in low 1000s, and those who aim higher in mid 2000s.
    Outliers all around, as is normal.

    "I Am Vengeance. I Am The Night. I Am Felfáádaern!"

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by That guy maybe View Post
    Adding an in-game way to show highest dungeon overall and highest level of the dungeon queued for would be nice though, and basically remove the need for the R.io addon for a lot of people
    Raider.io already does that (so when you queue for Vault people can see your highest dungeon ever, lets say +24 HOV and the highest you have in done in Vault).

    Blizzards stance on features provided by them is that as long as there is an addon that does it well they will not provide it.

  9. #29
    Elemental Lord Felfaadaern Darkterror's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brewmaster Kolee View Post
    Too early to say for sure, but looks like we might get a double curve?
    With those who mostly farm weekly chest in low 1000s, and those who aim higher in mid 2000s.
    Outliers all around, as is normal.
    But now as more people vote we're seeing a surge in 3000-3500.

    "I Am Vengeance. I Am The Night. I Am Felfáádaern!"

  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by klaps_05 View Post
    Raider.io already does that (so when you queue for Vault people can see your highest dungeon ever, lets say +24 HOV and the highest you have in done in Vault).

    Blizzards stance on features provided by them is that as long as there is an addon that does it well they will not provide it.
    That's the point, r.io shows WHICH dungeons you have done. What I was pointing out in my posts, is that this is a bad idea and Blizz should include it in-game but anonymously only showing your highest m+ dungeon completed on tyrannical and fortified without showing WHICH dungeon you have done the keys on.

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by ceall View Post
    That's the point, r.io shows WHICH dungeons you have done. What I was pointing out in my posts, is that this is a bad idea and Blizz should include it in-game but anonymously only showing your highest m+ dungeon completed on tyrannical and fortified without showing WHICH dungeon you have done the keys on.
    So you want to know if the person has experience with tyrannical affix, but not which bosses with tyrannical affix? On Tyrannical, certain bosses are a complete joke, while others are nearly unbeatable.

    For example Hyrja in HoV - if you are making a group for +20 HoV, would you invite a person who you dont know if he has done it or not? I use Hyrja specifically as it is one of the bosses where if you dont have experience you have 0% chance to beat.

    Same applies to Fortified affixes and certain trash. On fortified affix, certain trash is always skipped in order to beat the timer - how would you know if this person has experience doing that?

    If a person lacks the specific dungeon's trash & boss experience on tyrannical/fortified affixes, your key will most likely end up dead no matter how much you try to explain to them how to do it(as in, practice makes perfect).

    And an extreme example - you are telling me you will invite a person who has done Vault on +20 tyrannical to a +20 Seat, without knowing if he has EVER even stepped inside Seat, let alone +20 tyrannical?

  12. #32
    3913 atm, exlusively trough pugging and no voice comm. Feels like I'm close to the limit (for me at least), unless I find a regular team and start using comms. I think I should be able to reach a few points above 4k after next push week though.

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by klaps_05 View Post
    So you want to know if the person has experience with tyrannical affix, but not which bosses with tyrannical affix? On Tyrannical, certain bosses are a complete joke, while others are nearly unbeatable.

    For example Hyrja in HoV - if you are making a group for +20 HoV, would you invite a person who you dont know if he has done it or not? I use Hyrja specifically as it is one of the bosses where if you dont have experience you have 0% chance to beat.

    Same applies to Fortified affixes and certain trash. On fortified affix, certain trash is always skipped in order to beat the timer - how would you know if this person has experience doing that?

    If a person lacks the specific dungeon's trash & boss experience on tyrannical/fortified affixes, your key will most likely end up dead no matter how much you try to explain to them how to do it(as in, practice makes perfect).

    And an extreme example - you are telling me you will invite a person who has done Vault on +20 tyrannical to a +20 Seat, without knowing if he has EVER even stepped inside Seat, let alone +20 tyrannical?
    There is multiple ways to do every dungeon.

    Them having completed it does not mean they're going to know the way YOU want them to do it.

  14. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Tech614 View Post
    There is multiple ways to do every dungeon.

    Them having completed it does not mean they're going to know the way YOU want them to do it.
    Certainly, there are many strategies. But if you have done at least 1 strategy, regardless which one, you are familair with the bosses/dungeon, what can kill you and what cannot. If you have not run the dungeon even a single time, a player's performance will entirely depend on how well he can understand what you are explaining.

    If you can see that someone has done the dungeon, then you know they are at least familiar with it. He implies that having done any dungeon on Tyrannical/Fortified is enough to indicate you will do well in a dungeon which you have no done in Tyrannical/Fortified (as he wants Blizzard to hide which dungeons specifically you have done).

  15. #35
    Elemental Lord Felfaadaern Darkterror's Avatar
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    Wishing now I had made the increments even all the way up, instead of some 200 and others 500.
    I thought I knew where the bulk of respondents would be, but I was wrong. Way more over 3000 than I anticipated.
    If I redrew it from above data, it might look something like...

    Last edited by Felfaadaern Darkterror; 2018-03-09 at 07:02 AM. Reason: replaced text with graph image

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  16. #36
    What you get is likely to be skewed as people who come on MMO champ are likely to care more/be more interested than the general player base IMO.

    That said, it's interesting to see this.

    To the person who said about mythic boss kills, I disagree with you (i would because I have none). But I have about a 3.5k m+ score and I frequently play with people who have 6/7/8 mythic kills and absolutely no idea of what's dangerous in M+ (helping friends/guildies with weeklies). The other day I literally solo'd Hyrja from 40% because they had all died -ideally I would go for the people with Mythic kills *and* score but if I had to pick one or the other score wins every day.

  17. #37
    Elemental Lord Felfaadaern Darkterror's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Loosecannon View Post
    What you get is likely to be skewed as people who come on MMO champ are likely to care more/be more interested than the general player base IMO.

    That said, it's interesting to see this.

    To the person who said about mythic boss kills, I disagree with you (i would because I have none). But I have about a 3.5k m+ score and I frequently play with people who have 6/7/8 mythic kills and absolutely no idea of what's dangerous in M+ (helping friends/guildies with weeklies). The other day I literally solo'd Hyrja from 40% because they had all died -ideally I would go for the people with Mythic kills *and* score but if I had to pick one or the other score wins every day.
    I would agree with this, and Hyrja is a great example. Bosses and even trash mobs that geared raiders are used to zerging can one-shot random players (non tank) on high keys. Players who don't know which spells have to be interrupted or which bosses require Prydaz + avoidance gear can be in for rude awakenings.

    "I Am Vengeance. I Am The Night. I Am Felfáádaern!"

  18. #38
    If you are around 965 ilevel equipped and in a semi-decent Mythic guild, so lets say 8/10 (top 5%), you can easily pug clear a +20 key within time with any comp with similar gear/xp, with some small exceptions like Hyrja or MoS on Tyrannical, which already will give you 3.2k or so.

    The problem with raider.io is a lot of ppl want to pug it instead of trying to build their team. I am not saying its easy, but you can manage to pug up to 3.5 at least and build connections along the way. If you group with 4 random people every time, chances are at least 1 of them will like you and eventually you dont pug anymore.

    Raider.io score is a problem for people ONLY when pugging. If you build a team, the score is irrelevant and you will most likely do much much better.

  19. #39
    Elemental Lord Felfaadaern Darkterror's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by klaps_05 View Post
    If you are around 965 ilevel equipped and in a semi-decent Mythic guild, so lets say 8/10 (top 5%), you can easily pug clear a +20 key within time with any comp with similar gear/xp, with some small exceptions like Hyrja or MoS on Tyrannical, which already will give you 3.2k or so.

    The problem with raider.io is a lot of ppl want to pug it instead of trying to build their team. I am not saying its easy, but you can manage to pug up to 3.5 at least and build connections along the way. If you group with 4 random people every time, chances are at least 1 of them will like you and eventually you dont pug anymore.

    Raider.io score is a problem for people ONLY when pugging. If you build a team, the score is irrelevant and you will most likely do much much better.
    Yeah that's basically what happened with me and my friends, except we're plebs and mostly runs 18-19-20s We met each other pugging, added each other, and eventually formed a regular team. Now we have our own discord channel where we link guides and tips and weak auras we've found, and we meet twice a week to run what keys we have between us.

    "I Am Vengeance. I Am The Night. I Am Felfáádaern!"

  20. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brewmaster Kolee View Post
    Won't be scientific, as it's self-reported and we all know some in forums like to screw with these things. No mechanism to ensure that anyone is being truthful. I was just curious where most of us are these days. Mine is very average, but it's higher than when I first started paying attention back in January. The poll is completely anonymous, and I am in no position to judge anyone's score even if I was that kind of person. Just thought it might be interesting to see how the curve forms. Poll incoming.

    Edit: Emperor raises a great question in first comment. Let's use RAIDER.IO scores for consistency.

    Edit 2: I made some increments 200 and some 500 because I thought I knew where most would be (I thought 3000+ would be outliers). Taking the responses so far and making the increments all 500 each, the chart would look like...

    I am working on some statistik from the Raider.IO scores. I can share them when I am done, which should be during the weekend.

    My plan was to only look at amount of chars in each score bracket, is there anything else what could be of interest?

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