Demo Changes!

[Baconeggcheese]

While i dont disagree with what you wrote, its important to consider for example that soulfire gives double the shards than sb (and also does more dmg iirc?). One of the problems demo has is target swaping and an important factor that this problem exists is that it cant really bank resources, it just keeps going like a train that cant stop. Maybe the new molten core procs are a solution to that in a way that you can bank shards and procs, so when you have a priority target you can "burst" with faster rotations using soulfire. At the moment i believe you can bank 4 molten core procs which means 8 fast shards with a generator that does more dmg than the regular one and also instant if talented.

All this is ofc speculation.

I mean its definitely better than starting from scratch, but SF as of right now doesn't exactly do a lot of dmg and the amount of time it'd take you to generate the shards and dump the imps and then the imps to do their damage would still be substantial.

Could always implode things in a worst case scenario I suppose.

[Kirroth]

New build!

A whole bunch of Demo talents got their locations shuffled. Waiting on calculators to update so we can get an idea of what the choices look like now, since I'm too lazy to create my own grid.

The Soulfire conflict with Destro has been solved by giving Demo Demonbolt instead. I'm okay with this.

Some small tweaks like HoG capping at 3 SS spent instead of 4 and Implosion not having a chance to return SS. It feels like they're still trying to work out what Demo's core rotation should look like.

[MisterBigglez]

The Soulfire conflict with Destro has been solved by giving Demo Demonbolt instead. I'm okay with this.

I bet all the demo mains are pissed off with this.

[rhorle]

I bet all the demo mains are pissed off with this.

I think Soulfire is catchier then Demonbolt. I just find Demonbolt to be boring or some other thing that I can't really describe. Lets campaign to have it renamed Impslap. Fits the theme of hurling an imp's energy at the bad guy and sounds cool.

[Kirroth]

I bet all the demo mains are pissed off with this.

Demonbolt is more uniquely Demo and fits the flavor of throwing demon essences at your foe. Soulfire used to be a big Destro nuke before Mists, so going back to that also fits. I think it's a fine solution.

[Netherspark]

I bet all the demo mains are pissed off with this.

I'm Destruction and I'm pissed off at this. They claimed that they regretted putting so much focus on spec fantasy at the expense of class fantasy, that they wanted to blur the lines a little more between them, and now they walk back on this by once more locking Demonology into pure shadow, and leaving yet more fire for destro.

I want some bloody fire for demo and some shadow for destruction!

[Kirroth]

I want some bloody fire for demo and some shadow for destruction!

The new Demonbolt will be shadowflame damage, plus all those wild imps shooting firebolts. Destro, meanwhile, can talent into Shadowburn. That isn't enough?

[Nere]

So hand of gul'dan can summon up to 3 imps now, only for blizzard to make a talent so it summons 4 imps...... These guys will never learn, stay classy Blizz.

[Netherspark]

The new Demonbolt will be shadowflame damage, plus all those wild imps shooting firebolts. Destro, meanwhile, can talent into Shadowburn. That isn't enough?

I'm not talking about a word in the combat log...

[MisterBigglez]

So hand of gul'dan can summon up to 3 imps now, only for blizzard to make a talent so it summons 4 imps...... These guys will never learn, stay classy Blizz.

But at the low cost of 3 shards!

[Walrock]

Did they nerf Implosion or is it just a mining error?
Bc they reduced the damage it does by 50% and it no longer refunds a shard if it hits 3 or more targets.
But it now says 0y instead of 8y.

[Kirroth]

The WoWhead BfA Talent Calculator has updated locations, although tooltips are outdated and several builds behind.

I'm seeing some potential builds take early shape. There's one where you're focused on SS cycling to proc Sacrificed Souls as much as possible and get Demon Commander up a lot; Power Siphon and Soul Conduit for extra SS gen, Riders for getting more out of all those HoG and feeding Power Siphon, and of course Sacrificed Souls. Another build avoids SacSouls to keep cooldowns aligned and takes Summon Vilefiend and GrimServ. Every GrimServ summon and every other Vilefiend summon will have its duration and power buffed by DemCom. Demonic Consumption might be a good pairing if it buffs the DemCom's buff aura and not just its damage.

ETA: Looking closely at today's changes, it seems like the Raging Imps effect is now baseline Molten Core makes Demonbolt instant cast. We'll have to see what replaces that talent in the next build.

[Shandalar]

Well, Demon AoE had last just 1 build. Actually is pure trash.

[AwkwardSquirtle]

I'm not talking about a word in the combat log...

Why cast fire when I have imps to do that for me?

[Maleific]

Why cast fire when I have imps to do that for me?

It is a little different when you're doing it yourself. It does break up the barrage of purple projectiles.

[Deleted]

It is a little different when you're doing it yourself. It does break up the barrage of purple projectiles.

Demonbolt animation has a fire animation too (as well as shadow). All they have to do to make people happy is to finally make the fire portion change to green if you have green fire. Other than that SF for destro and DB for demo makes more sence. I still believe till this day that the only reason demo got SF in the first place was because destro got chaos bolt and they didnt know what to do with it...since CB was the new big nuke. The thing is cb is not anymore what it used to be when they introduced it, its much more spammy and it isnt as "dangerous". Its the spender of the spec pretty much, it cant be be to powerfull.

Thematically it would make even more sence for destro to have soulfire as the spender and CB being the big nuke but they wont do such "drastic" changes anyway and i am getting offtopic.

What do you guys think of the removal of TKC? You think it was limiting the spec in terms of how many demons they would allow us to summon so it wont become to powerfull? Was it some other reason? Imo in legion getting out a good TKC (esp in pvp where you never can just sit and cast to get all the demons you want) was maybe the most satisfying feeling the spec had to offer.
Now in alpha the only similar ability is deathbolt in affliction which is..scary since at the moment with current tuning it has the most burst potential (in one spell) of all the warlock spells in all specs, it has fast set up time since you want to put the dots and cast it asap to get more dmg benefit AND its on the multidot spec..to give some context at the moment if it crits (with 2 UAs rolling + dots) it hits around the amount of 2 chaos bolts.

[Maleific]

Demonbolt animation has a fire animation too (as well as shadow). All they have to do to make people happy is to finally make the fire portion change to green if you have green fire. Other than that SF for destro and DB for demo makes more sence. I still believe till this day that the only reason demo got SF in the first place was because destro got chaos bolt and they didnt know what to do with it...since CB was the new big nuke. The thing is cb is not anymore what it used to be when they introduced it, its much more spammy and it isnt as "dangerous". Its the spender of the spec pretty much, it cant be be to powerfull.

Thematically it would make even more sence for destro to have soulfire as the spender and CB being the big nuke but they wont do such "drastic" changes anyway and i am getting offtopic.

What do you guys think of the removal of TKC? You think it was limiting the spec in terms of how many demons they would allow us to summon so it wont become to powerfull? Was it some other reason? Imo in legion getting out a good TKC (esp in pvp where you never can just sit and cast to get all the demons you want) was maybe the most satisfying feeling the spec had to offer.
Now in alpha the only similar ability is deathbolt in affliction which is..scary since at the moment with current tuning it has the most burst potential (in one spell) of all the warlock spells in all specs, it has fast set up time since you want to put the dots and cast it asap to get more dmg benefit AND its on the multidot spec..to give some context at the moment if it crits (with 2 UAs rolling + dots) it hits around the amount of 2 chaos bolts.

I've never understood why people obsess over a spec of red fire tbh. I'm fine either way, but I do lean towards Soul fire myself, because like I said in a spec full of purple fire spells do break it up a little. And since they've changed soulfire to be the flaming souls of our departed imps it's even more fitting imo.

For destruction Soulfire, i'd like it to be a replacement for incinerate that generates more shard bits.

TKC isn't gone, they've just shifted it to Affliction lol...

[Xanatas]

no change to mastery

[Deleted]

I've never understood why people obsess over a spec of red fire tbh.

Warlock obsession with green fire goes back to TBC release, when blizzard decided that fel had that color (and it was mainly present all over the place in shadowmoon valley). Earlier fel green was supposed to be the color of unholy magic. Since TBC locks were asking to have green fire and iirc there was also a mod to change the wow files to make all fire green colored back then that was very popular. Add also the ever going comparison that destro locks look like fire mages and you get the idea.
The addition of green chaos bolt later made things even "worse" untill finally they introduced the mop questline and ppl were happy.

Most are still cranky in legion because they took most of the visualls away for destruction, green fire doesnt even have updated fire casting models and demonbolt (the only chance that demo would see green fire with current spells) they didnt even bother to change it.

All in all its not that its a huge issue, obviously gameplay wise it isnt. But its wierd and annoying that in an expansion that focuses on class fantasy they just went full lazy mode on something that the warlock community was asking for 10(?) years untill they finally get it.

[Deleted]

no change to mastery

Probably going to be minion damage. And the scaling will determine if we go Master or avoid it for haste or crit.