How Can PvP Be Realistically Improved?

[Whatever Dude]

From casual to competitive PvP, fire away with your ideas. A lot of people think Legion messed up with the PvP, but I still don't think PvP this expansion is that bad unless you're someone who hates PvP Templates, I guess. Arena is still pretty decent.

What improvements do you want to see in Arena?
What improvements do you want to see in RBGs?
What improvements do you want to see in casual BGs and World PvP (Bring back WorldDefense!)?
How can we revive dueling?
Do you think class design is off to a good start in the BfA Alpha?

[Almiria]

Something must be done about serverhopping or realm switch in general in World PvP, especially in BFA with the Pve / PvP flag, people can just run from fights by hopping to another realm. Maybe they should disable the realm switch until you are out of combat or put an accept or decline button when you join a group saying "You're going to switch to a PvE/PvP side" and make it unclickable while in combat.

[Craaazyyy]

From casual to competitive PvP, fire away with your ideas. A lot of people think Legion messed up with the PvP, but I still don't think PvP this expansion is that bad unless you're someone who hates PvP Templates, I guess. Arena is still pretty decent.

What improvements do you want to see in Arena?
What improvements do you want to see in RBGs?
What improvements do you want to see in casual BGs and World PvP (Bring back WorldDefense!)?
How can we revive dueling?
Do you think class design is off to a good start in the BfA Alpha?

pvp in legion is the worst its ever been..

what they need to do is unprune, remove templates, perhaps go back to resilience system cuz it was never broken.. that would help dueling

[Appelgren]

Arena:

1. Remove racials.
2. Lockout russians and asians from NA and EU.
3. Instantly fix balance issues. Faster and more frequent hotfixes.

Rbgs: Idc

Bgs: Fine/idc

World PVP: Idc at all.

[Schattenlied]

Balance around 10v10, not 3v3. Balacing around 3v3 only balances arenas, and specifically 3v3, the least participated in form of PvP. Balancing around 10v10 balances the most participated in form of PvP, Random BGs, and rated BGs as well. MMO PvP shouldn't be balanced around small group combat anyways, it's an MMO, not a MOBA.

Remove templates:
Templates are horrid for balance and customization. We have no customization of gear stats, we can't choose if we want versatility, or haste, or mastery, we are just forced into whatever Blizzard gives us, MOBAs legitimately have more character customization than WoW PvP does right now, and that's just pathetic... Not ok.
And the damage balance method templates use is nerfing primary stat (Str/Agi/Int), which also nerfs survivability spells like Flash of Light, Healing Surge, Ice Barrier, Power Word:Shield, etc, because most of them also scale off that stat, and that is also not ok.

Go back to the old PvP balance method they have used since MoP, Ability does X% more/less damage/healing to targets engaged in PvP combat. This accomplishes 2 things: we get to customize our gear again in PvP, and PvP balance works in the game world, as well as in instances. It currently only works in instances, which is, again, not ok.

After that, because people will say "but templates normalize stats to reduce power gaps in gear between new and old players!" yes, and that can be done without the current template system... Just reduce, or increase, the item level of the gear the person has equipped while in instanced PvP combat, exactly the same system timewalking uses, exactly the same system that was used to scale lower level players up to the top of their level bracket in BGs below the level cap during WoD.


Return PvP gearing to the Honor/Conquest system used in WoD. You get Honor and Conquest from playing, you buy gear from a vendor, not a token that gives you a random piece for that slot, but you buy a specific piece of gear, with specific stats on it and specific Azurite traits, so you know exactly what you are getting (I would prefer all catchup gear for PvE also return to this method too, TBH, I hate the random token treadmill, I want a specific goal to work for, not a potentially never ending conveyor belt of RNG useless gear that I will have to either sell or DE).

Unprune all the abilities they removed for no reason in WoD/Legion.


Do that, and PvP is fixed, far as I'm concerned.

[Dmitro]

Arena:

1. Remove racials.
2. Lockout russians and asians from NA and EU.
3. Instantly fix balance issues. Faster and more frequent hotfixes.

Rbgs: Idc

Bgs: Fine/idc

World PVP: Idc at all.

1)racials dont matter much unless you play at 2500+ (for some reason I am sure you dont)
2)stupid and racist (reported)
3)correct

rbgs - ignorant

ignorant

world pvp - ignorant


gonna create a whole topic later on with all my thoughts and hopes, so far major problems are class designs, some pvp talents (trinket should be baseline/other options removed) and templates

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Balance around 10v10, not 3v3. Balacing around 3v3 only balances arenas

nope, simply wrong, balance is not even among 3 top reasons why pvp is boring and dead today.
and the attitude is also simply wrong, 10v10 is the least skill-capped version of pvp (All of 2200+ rbgers that I see all the time cant even get over 1800 with 500 games played lmao in 3s (especially girl holy priests ones)). personal skill > team play

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pvp in legion is the worst its ever been..

what they need to do is unprune, remove templates, perhaps go back to resilience system cuz it was never broken.. that would help dueling

very true, sir

[Appelgren]

1)racials that dont matter much unless you play at 2500+ (for some reason I am sure you dont)
2)stupid and racist (reported)

Thanks for the laugh mate. Was having a slow night at work!

[Dmitro]

Thanks for the laugh mate. Was having a slow night at work!

ye, no problem my fellow 1600 player.

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btw, if you wanna read my opinion on CORE pvp issues (not this "more balance" bullshit) read this

https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...s-of-Skill-Cap

[Cyanu]

for starters PvP needs it's prestige and sense of accomplishment back, the most obvious way to get there is by considerably increasing various PvP related rewards, make them rival those of hardcore raiding (i mean in terms of mounts,achievs,transmogs etc) Glads should be among the most shiny folks walking in orgrimmar

next solo queue is a ridiculously obvious absent feature: pvp needs to be more accessible and more readily available, sometimes it's such a chore to get a decent group (especially during seasons when your friends take a break till the next xpac) that it ends up being a poor time investment (wait time> play time), obviously the solo part should not be as fabulous as the current pre-made ladder but it should have some lesser rewards too

and finally balance and gameplay improvements, unpruning etc are all steps in the right direction

i'm neutral regarding the templates, i can see pvp being good( or bad) both with and without them

[Schattenlied]

nope, simply wrong, balance is not even among 3 top reasons why pvp is boring and dead today.
and the attitude is also simply wrong, 10v10 is the least skill-capped version of pvp (All of 2200+ rbgers that I see all the time cant even get over 1800 with 500 games played lmao in 3s (especially girl holy priests ones)). personal skill > team play

Literally irrelevant. Battlegrounds have immensely, no doubt orders of magnitude, more participation than Arenas, the most participated in form of PvP should be where balance is focused, not the least participated.

[Appelgren]

ye, no problem my fellow 1600 player.

You go ahead and tell yourself whatever it takes for your logic to make sense

[Craaazyyy]

Literally irrelevant. Battlegrounds have immensely, no doubt orders of magnitude, more participation than Arenas, the most participated in form of PvP should be where balance is focused, not the least participated.

rbgs are less popular than arenas btw..

[Dmitro]

Literally irrelevant. Battlegrounds have immensely, no doubt orders of magnitude, more participation than Arenas, the most participated in form of PvP should be where balance is focused, not the least participated.

nope, it is relevant, because both in cata and mop (already with rbgs), their participation was lower than arena's, simply due to the fact arenas were more fun to play and more prestigious, today rbgs are more popular only because arenas are utter trash, not on its own.

It happened to me too, was not even touching rbgs in cata in mop (was considered to be noobie trash bracket which it is), started to play them in legion after having to try to play this miserable thing called "legion arenas"

once they fix classes (hopefully) and some pvp talents, your bracket full of girl healers who play at 1700 max but have 2400 (cause rbgs) will be forgotten

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rbgs are less popular than arenas btw..

not really, he is right, in legion it looks like rbgs are more popular (simply because arena population dropped by 250% even from wod lvls lmao)

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You go ahead and tell yourself whatever it takes for your logic to make sense

my logic makes sense on its own sadly, but thanks!

[ls-]

Balance arenas independently from the rest of PvP. BGs suffer because everything is balanced w/ arenas in mind.

[Craaazyyy]

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not really, he is right, in legion it looks like rbgs are more popular (simply because arena population dropped by 250% even from wod lvls lmao)

u said it they are more popular only because arenas are trash.. but well so are rbgs

but again u have way less ppl at 2200+ in rbgs than there are in arenas

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Balance arenas independently from the rest of PvP. BGs suffer because everything is balanced w/ arenas in mind.

bgs suffer cuz the whole game is trash.. bgs need the same things arenas need..

[ls-]

bgs suffer cuz the whole game is trash.. bgs need the same things arenas need..

I agree that many BGs are trash, esp older ones.

But gameplay-wise BGs and arenas are quite different. In BGs dying is a part of experience, everyone dies and then they simply respawn, moreover dying and killing faster allows for a more interesting gameplay, comebacks and stuff. Whereas in arenas death is the worst thing that can happen, it means that classes need to be able to stay alive for much and much longer.

[Sithalos]

They could always try making PvP rewarding. A balance patch more than once every six months might help too.

[Wildmoon]

I see " PvP is at its worst" every expansion. -_-"

[Dmitro]

I agree that many BGs are trash, esp older ones.

But gameplay-wise BGs and arenas are quite different. In BGs dying is a part of experience, everyone dies and then they simply respawn.

its not even close to be the major difference between arenas and rbgs, but ye, dying is rbgs does not mean lose, so thats why there are so freaking many literally low iq low skill 1600 in arena but 2200 in rbgs girl healers (mainly mws and hpriests) who get into good groups mainly by sanding nudes via snapchat.

such a cancerous community man

[digichi]

From a casual pvper, only incentive to PvP was for marks of honour (tmog) and prestige levels (stopped at lvl 2 because got bored of PvP)..

Stat templates and honour talents get boring really quickly. It's short term fun, no progression (yes getting 2 shot by a geared pvper wasn't fun. But with perseverance, you would get there yourself eventually. A regular bg had a variety of players in it.)
Burst was kind of fun, which is what makes the heroism buff you find in bgs pretty fun as well. The food buffs, random invis or sprints you buy with marks of honour are fun for a little while (but it is more fun and interactive finding buffs within the bg, rather than buying them from a vendor or getting them from a loot box.)

(Side note, twinking a char for bgs between content droughts was fun. That unintended playstyle has been completely neutered. Even at lvl 70, you would run into many other twinks rather than 1 shorting some poor soul. Some fond memories I have of the game was doing this as ret in cata and enhance end of mop. Ppl would recognise twinks and you'd come together as a bg group to target down the geared players on another team, or support your own geared players. It was not uncommon to run into twinkled healers and even the occasional tank on both teams, making for fun and intense matches. As soon as WoD changes rolled around, the fun has disappeared. Stat templates are fun for hardcore pvpers I hear, not so much for the regular bg. They really gotta go.)

World PvP- something tells me it's a legion side effect. Huge ilvl desparity, wep artefact lvls, concordance, netherlight crucible, legendaries, honour talents unlocked... all of this makes for intense power gaps. If ilvl can be more compact it may potentially be better for the experience.