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  1. #61
    Does Blizzard really think people other than alliance fans will fall for this? Retconing everything about a character just to cower your own fuckup has to be the most pathetic writing mistake. Someone take their keyboards and beat their faces with them.

  2. #62
    I’m in a minority of Horde players that are actually happy about Garrosh retcons, I think.
    I never appreciated this character. Starting from Ulduar trailer I hated that asshat with the same passion I disliked Varian. I always felt like he was shoved down Horde’s throat just to make this faction an antagonist of the Alliance in more ways then were logically possible at the time.
    There was a tweet, if I remember correctly (I think I will be corrected if anything), when a Horde player asked Blizz if the Horde would loose all of it’s honor in Cata and the answer was something along the lines of “There will be a little of it left”. That is all I see in Garrosh, from the start he embodied this horrible downfall of my faction.
    So I see no issue with Blizz correcting some sharp turns in Lore to make him even worse then he initially was. He’s dead anyway.

  3. #63
    Quote Originally Posted by Kwento View Post
    So I see no issue with Blizz correcting some sharp turns in Lore to make him even worse then he initially was. He’s dead anyway.
    And this is why we can never get good story out of wow, as long as there are people like you, ok with blatant rewriting of characters if it aligns with their headcanon.

  4. #64
    Quote Originally Posted by Verdugo View Post
    And this is why we can never get good story out of wow, as long as there are people like you, ok with blatant rewriting of characters if it aligns with their headcanon.
    Yep, I ruined your favorite lore! I admit it.

  5. #65
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    How do you ruin a piece of shit though?

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  6. #66
    Quote Originally Posted by Venziir View Post
    How do you ruin a piece of shit though?
    Apparently by not minding retcons..? I don’t know.

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by Verdugo View Post
    And this is why we can never get good story out of wow, as long as there are people like you, ok with blatant rewriting of characters if it aligns with their headcanon.
    *Looks at text, looks at WH40k image* Surely, you must be pissed at GW too then. From what I'm reading at the 40k forums, people aren't exactly thrilled about everything they've done for the past year or so, from the re-naming of the Elder, to the the ressurection of Rowboat Girlyman, to the new Necron fluff.

    Amazing sig, done by mighty Lokann

  8. #68
    Quote Originally Posted by Venziir View Post
    *Looks at text, looks at WH40k image* Surely, you must be pissed at GW too then. From what I'm reading at the 40k forums, people aren't exactly thrilled about everything they've done for the past year or so, from the re-naming of the Elder, to the the ressurection of Rowboat Girlyman, to the new Necron fluff.
    I dont exactly follow new shit, from the sound of it I am not losing much.

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by Verdugo View Post
    I dont exactly follow new shit, from the sound of it I am not losing much.
    Unwilling to accept the flows of time and change? Hm, sounds like a terrible Chaos Sorcerer.

    Amazing sig, done by mighty Lokann

  10. #70
    Quote Originally Posted by Venziir View Post
    Unwilling to accept the flows of time and change? Hm, sounds like a terrible Chaos Sorcerer.
    "Change is sometimes necessary. But I prefer order. It is more...predictable."

    Ahriman of the Thousand Sons.

  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Black View Post
    Because he always was supposed to be villain? Jesus even Blizzard told you so and Stonetalon Mountains was fuck up on cooperation among writers. Garrosh was idiot, racist and fcking emo with daddy issues.

    Chronicles just clear up the mess.
    Basically this. Stonetalon was the fuck up, Chronicles fixed that.

  12. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by Verdugo View Post
    "Change is sometimes necessary. But I prefer order. It is more...predictable."

    Ahriman of the Thousand Sons.
    Indeed, however, times change, as does the things we know or thought we knew regarding whatever story or lore.

    "The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance." - Ahriman

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Tauror View Post
    Basically this. Stonetalon was the fuck up, Chronicles fixed that.
    Quite so. They even had, what's-his-name, tweet that. Urgh can't remember that guys name for the life of me. The nerdy looking one, with the shrill voice, that took over the story section after Metzen and insisted on making Vol'jin the main character of the Horde

    Amazing sig, done by mighty Lokann

  13. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by Baddger View Post
    Garrosh was turned evil because blizz needed a villain for MoP
    False, he was planned to be the bad guy since WotLK and Cataclysm showcased it. Stonetalon was a miscommunication between the writers.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Venziir View Post
    Quite so. They even had, what's-his-name, tweet that. Urgh can't remember that guys name for the life of me. The nerdy looking one, with the shrill voice, that took over the story section after Metzen and insisted on making Vol'jin the main character of the Horde
    Kosak.

    Heck, Afrasiabi himself said he fucked up:

    https://www.engadget.com/2014/11/11/...rnate-azeroth/

  14. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aeula View Post
    They well and truly fucked Garrosh due to the moronic anti-faction peace brigade and the Alliance whining about him. Now they’re trying to cover their mistake via retcons.
    "When all things fail we retcon" ~Blizzard

  15. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tauror View Post
    False, he was planned to be the bad guy since WotLK and Cataclysm showcased it. Stonetalon was a miscommunication between the writers.
    ]
    they didn't say some shit like they would build Garrosh to be leader the horde would be proud off? it rly was not just stonetalon

  16. #76
    Quote Originally Posted by Baddger View Post
    Garrosh was turned evil because blizz needed a villain for MoP cause they knew people was laughing at the xpac so they told us Garrosh was gonna be the end guy of it to create excitement! Clearly they thought well we cant have the Sha be the end bad even though logically it should have been.
    Lei Shen should have been the endboss of MoP.

  17. #77
    Quote Originally Posted by True Horde View Post
    Removing Cho'gall involvement in new Chronicles 3, just adds more reasons to blame on Garrosh, and that really just pissed me off as Warchief Garrosh fan. It sucks to see a favourite character getting stomped and then written off as psychopath with no good sides.

    Why can't we have 1 single nice thing about Garrosh. Is it because Blizzard sees that Thrall's reputation is suffering with Garrosh being simply plain cooler than Thrall was? So in response Blizzard rewrites Garrosh into a bigger jerk than he already was?

    Then what's next?

    Naz'grim is threatened and blackmailed by Garrosh to stay with his Horde?
    Garrosh knew about Magatha's poison and stayed quiet?
    Malkorok never existed?
    Garrosh did not fight for his people, but for his own enjoyement?
    Garrosh is the child of the Void Lords?

    I hope they stop pushing Garrosh towards, irredeemable evil like Cho'gall, Gul'dan, Kil'jaeden. He should have been the Vegeta or Talandar of Warcraft/Horde.

    Instead, they just making Garrosh a warrior version of the one sided psychopath Gul'dan.
    Malkorok came in MoP, Vol 3 ends with Deathwings defeat.

  18. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tauror View Post
    False, he was planned to be the bad guy since WotLK and Cataclysm showcased it. Stonetalon was a miscommunication between the writers.

    - - - Updated - - -



    Kosak.

    Heck, Afrasiabi himself said he fucked up:

    https://www.engadget.com/2014/11/11/...rnate-azeroth/
    Bingo! Yes Kosak! Whatever happened to that guy?

    Amazing sig, done by mighty Lokann

  19. #79
    Deleted
    I think people has forgotten what the OP is saying. He is not complaining about Garrosh being/becoming evil. He is complaining about Chronicles retconning a quite ok story to put instead a generic “evil guy wants to conquer the world”.
    We had a complex story. A story where the bitterness of both factions, spiced with the machinations of a third party triggered a world war. Garrosh wanted to take Ashenvale resources yes, but it was the cancellation of the trade agreement by the nelves (triggered by the involvement of the Twiligth Hammer) which make him go full war. We had a character who, even as a supremacist, was doing what he thougth was the better for his people. Later on he started to switch to more on a full racist, hungry power dictator, but it was how his character was developed. It started with a guy who didn't even wanted to be a leader. It ended with an aggresive autocrat who didn't care about executing anyone who was against him.
    And it was nice. It was an interesting story, overall with Blizzard standarts.
    Now what we have? A guy who was evil since the very first moment, who attacked Ashenvale without any other reason than "I want more". In this story Saurfang stands as a stupid who didn't do nothing about his people going to war because of one moron. In the previous case at least he was kind of forced because of the nelves atittude (since the orcs still needed the resources).
    We had a complex story where different parties and actions triggered a war. Now we have an asshole who started a war with his whole faction following him because, well, he is the leader rigth?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kwento View Post
    So I see no issue with Blizz correcting some sharp turns in Lore to make him even worse then he initially was. He’s dead anyway.
    But the thing is it wasn’t needed. And now everythings fits even worse. With the extra of having a simpler story.
    The only thing which could not fit is Stonetalon, and there were better ways to retcon it.
    Like not mention it and leave everyrhing else as it was.
    And saying being ok with this is like saying “I never liked Arthas, so I’m ok with this new retcon who says he was always a full spoiled brat who never cared about his people and who never harbour any feelings to them. He was always a selfish asshole until he became the Lich King”.
    I'm ok with retcons "fixing" some holes Blizzard has left. I'm not ok with retcons which leave things in a worse state and which damage the story.

  20. #80
    Quote Originally Posted by Qualia View Post
    The thing is, "If they show they are worth" was judged purely by his values - which isn't quite the same as most - so he turned out to be an aggressive jerk even to Horde member. Even before MoP, this is the one who butted-head against Thrall multiple times, and both Cairne and Saurfang were concerned with his aggressiveness or bloodthirst. Those are some of the most respected and wise member of the Horde. How much more worth would they need to have to be considered worthy?
    It is interesting how some people tend to ignore that, and just focus on Stonetalon mountains as the "true garrosh" moment.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Venziir View Post
    Bingo! Yes Kosak! Whatever happened to that guy?
    Think he is on Heathstone now

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