If you could replace LFR with something better what would it be?

[TheramoreIsTheBomb]

Honestly, LFR right now as -far- as the community goes is toxic, if not the most toxic environment in WoW. You can AFK and get loot, you are stuck with toxic, idiotic, know-it-all morons and other negative people. What is good about it? How it kickstarts newbs and alts into raiding and has unique transmog you can get and makes it a bit easier for a raid schedule. As far as the negatives go or the entire structure of LFR, how would you change it for the better?

I'd redesign the overly-abused kick feature for sure. Median iLvL of the group determines boss difficulty and gear drops. [You get paired with the almost the same people of your iLvl but since it is LFR there would be a "max" so it doesn't become too hard.]. Remove deserter debuff because no one wants to wait 30m to get a chance to be stuck with another shitty group again. I'd remove gold from bonus roll that way you're guaranteed to get gear whether it's an upgraded duplicate or an item you don't have because fuck stupid ass RNG.

[Queen of Hamsters]

What is good about it?

It justifies the resources poured into raiding content.

That's enough for me, as a raider. Most of the toxicity tends to come from people like yourself when whining incessantly about the feature in any case.

[Byleth]

LFR is designed for non-raiders to see content. In that regard it does it's job.

It's people in LFR who expect top notch DPS and perfect execution that ruin the experience for casual players.

LFR is fine, leave it alone.

[TheramoreIsTheBomb]

LFR is designed for non-raiders to see content. In that regard it does it's job.

It's people in LFR who expect top notch DPS and perfect execution that ruin the experience for casual players.

LFR is fine, leave it alone.

I'm talking about the negatives not the positive and it's not fine at all. The community in LFR is toxic as hell and any denial is a flat out absolute lie.

[potis]

LFR is designed for non-raiders to see content. In that regard it does it's job.

It's people in LFR who expect top notch DPS and perfect execution that ruin the experience for casual players.

LFR is fine, leave it alone.

Or, its LFR players that are the problem by being afk because "lul the tryhard will just do it for me, fuck you no-lifer carry me" mentality that plagues LFR that makes it a problem.

All my wipes in Legion LFR were from LFR only players being fully on AFK, not because they "didnt have the gear or DPS or time".

Its simply the mentality "Just give me the loot".

LFR needs to get removed completely and replaced with some sort of solo-scenario were NPCs tank/mechanics for people to see the story/fights etc etc.

Or turned back to its original state were a few bosses require some learning at least.

Right out removing all abilities and making the rest hit for 10% of the actual ability is pointless.

[Indil]

Raid difficulties should be Heroic And Mythic. Lfr and normal mode are totally useless for the health of the game

[Logwyn]

Raid difficulties should be Heroic And Mythic. Lfr and normal mode are totally useless for the health of the game

I'd argue that heroic and mythic are a drain on resources spend on other things. They are totally useless for the health of the game and are a cancer.

[MisterBigglez]

For starters, ilvl requirements should match the same level as the gear that drops to ensure that you are capable of pulling your own weight. You'll still have shit players doing way less than they should, because lets face it, a lot of people just don't care, but at least with a higher ilvl requirement, the output won't be as bad.

Titanforging should be capped to 15 ilvl max. If your goal is to progress from LFR to Normal, then this should be just fine.

Mechanics shouldn't be dumbed down as much. A player will not learn if they just make the fights a cakewalk. They should be the same as normal but with lower hp.

I think these 3 things would be a step in the right direction. If it was not for LFR back in Dragon Soul, I may never have got into raiding or had the confidence to step into one with pugs. Now I am a mythic raider clearing the majority of raid tiers on the highest difficulty and I have LFR to thank for that push.

[TheramoreIsTheBomb]

I'd also implement an auto-kick AFK feature for those auto-attacking, plain out AFK'ing or pulling under the weight of "average" dps. Call a spade a spade. If LFR is supposed to teach you then let there be consequences for under performing just like in the other difficulties.

[Byleth]

Or, its LFR players that are the problem by being afk because "lul the tryhard will just do it for me, fuck you no-lifer carry me" mentality that plagues LFR that makes it a problem.

I think you are VASTLY overstating this problem. Does it happen - absolutely! Does it happen to levels that are a problem that is breaking LFR? Not at all.

Personally, I always pull my weight if I run LFR. I don't like the idea of someone mooching off my work, so if I notice it, I vote to kick and the problem is solved!

The OP's real issue seems to be that he brings toxicity to LFR and gets kicked for it regularly. This is an assumption, but based on his forum posts it seems likely.

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I'd also implement an auto-kick AFK feature for those auto-attacking

YES!

plain out AFK'ing

YES!

or pulling under the weight of "average" dps.

DEFINITELY NOT!

As I stated earlier, LFR is designed to be casual story mode so non-raiders get the opportunity to see the content.

[Marrilaife]

Change it to solo mode adventure with progressively higher "determination" buff going on if you die, so a person could be completely unskilled and in the end finish it with bazillion buffs, but they could NOT afk through it. There would be npcs helping but they would stop helping if player dies / afks and the progress would stop or encounter would reset. The npcs would also scale with the player's output and determination buffs.

Tbh most people who complain about matchmade content are antisocial to the bone and just want an easy loot. Simply remove the illusion of "social experience", if they wanted social experience they would be in guilds / organized groups. Same rules for loot as it's now, so you have weekly lockout etc.

Solo players and people who are antisocial but want to prove how quick they can breeze through it would be fine. Afk leeches would throw tantrums though, what do you mean I actually have to play the game now to get shinies?

[potis]

I think you are VASTLY overstating this problem. Does it happen - absolutely! Does it happen to levels that are a problem that is breaking LFR? Not at all.

Personally, I always pull my weight if I run LFR. I don't like the idea of someone mooching off my work, so if I notice it, I vote to kick and the problem is solved!

The OP's real issue seems to be that he brings toxicity to LFR and gets kicked for it regularly. This is an assumption, but based on his forum posts it seems likely.

I am, and i am not, the problem has 2 sides.

1)The complete utter leechers that once every 20 LFRs you will find many together (especially during first 2 days of reset) and if you play up to ~2 alts you will probably do find such group every week that -are- there and simply dont do shit, just move a bit, auto-attack, cast a heal every minute etc etc.

2)The "I wont play as good someone else will just carry".

Both are as problematic when many people of the same mentality do gather and it happens -a lot-.

- - - Updated - - -

I'd also implement an auto-kick AFK feature for those auto-attacking, plain out AFK'ing or pulling under the weight of "average" dps. Call a spade a spade. If LFR is supposed to teach you then let there be consequences for under performing just like in the other difficulties.

Doesnt work, i have said this many times before that a system that auto-kicks or disables loot if AFK needs to exist, its actually met with a logical response.

"Some people do not know you are supposed to fill every global cooldown".

"Some people do not even know what global cooldown is".

Which i didnt believe it was possible before,i had a few familiars try out of the game while starting to "Game" with other MMOs or easier games etc etc and you will be surprised how bad people can be in WoW because of other(slower) games.

[clevin]

I'm talking about the negatives not the positive and it's not fine at all. The community in LFR is toxic as hell and any denial is a flat out absolute lie.

Get stuffed. You're nothing but an attention seeking drama bomb. Fuck, I should report this for trolling.... you do't even want to hear other opinions, you just want to be right. You're not. Deal.

[Byleth]

Both are as problematic when many people of the same mentality do gather.

I am saying that this is not a problem that occurs on a regular basis.

In fact it's NEVER happened to me, I have yet to do an LFR in years of experience where a swift kicking of one or two peeps doesn't fix the issue.

I'm not dismissing your point though, I can see that it could be a problem... It's just not currently, for me anyway. And if it were an issue, there's tools to address it.

[potis]

I am saying that this is not a problem that occurs on a regular basis.

In fact it's NEVER happened to me, I have yet to do an LFR in years of experience where a swift kicking of one or two peeps doesn't fix the issue.

I'm not dismissing your point though, I can see that it could be a problem... It's just not currently, for me anyway. And if it were an issue, there's tools to address it.

Then you are very lucky.

I gave up on alts this expansion for this as the third reason.

Farming AP, yeah okay passively comes, bad legendary? Ugh..

Getting into a NH-->Tomb LFR and 5mins after the boss is still at 60% for some reason, you check the DPS, my alt and some equally shit alt are first, 50% ahead of the rest, 1 healer is literally solo healing and the rest are half-AFK or forced-death apart from the tanks.

Cant even joke about it, i got kicked for pointing it out, only to be whispered by the second DPS that the group literally wiped and disbanded next try cause no one did anything and they wiped again.

This was a particular one that reached insane levels were ~15 DPS and 4 Healers were AFK, completely, i havent seen such a thing before so its stuck to my memory.

There were mostly others with just AFK healers or once every few months you hit 10 AFK DPS and wipe to an enrage timer.

But the times i have wiped because mostly healers are AFK, especially during new/just released LFRs is way more.

DPS is usually carried by people farming stuff, but the healing cant be hidden.

[Byleth]

This was a particular one that reached insane levels were ~15 DPS and 4 Healers were AFK, completely, i havent seen such a thing before so its stuck to my memory.

That actually sounds hilarious. I would've loved to have seen this.

But yes, I imagine that wasn't fun for you. Still though, this is the exception, not the norm.

[Dakara]

After I quit organized raiding in early Cata, LFR has been my staple, I honestly find the PUG scene vastly more toxic than LFR which is why I haven't bothered with M+ this expansion, or anything other than LFR.

Honestly, I think LFR has seen increased toxicity this expansion due to Legendary farming, it's seen a lot more "Elitist" players in LFR who nerd rage over the slightest hiccup which players like myself have come to expect and tolerate.

As I've said before, LFR exists for the same reason the other difficulties do. Remove LFR, and Blizzard should remove the others, returning to a fixed raid size/difficulty model as they did in the past. I can already taste the tears from a select group of raiders who wont get past the 2nd boss without farming gear from the easier difficulties first. "I'm a Mythic raider brah! We're Hardcore!" After farming LFR/Normal, then Heroic for set pieces/trinkets before downing the first boss in Mythic

[MoanaLisa]

1) Activity monitor which also looks for those with auto-attack or who aren't doing anything. Boots them right out of the group without warning. Use flex technology to reduce damage/boss+add health appropriately.

2) Removing any form of chat in the raid group. It's not really necessary. Replace raid leader instructions with their own raid warning system. If they wanted to do so they could more effectively use the raid warning system to teach people the encounter. Most instructions are not really that difficult.

- Go here.
- Group up.
- Spread out.
- Watch out for adds.
- Go all out on the boss.

3. Set it up that only the group leader can start an encounter.

I have no idea if LFR is all that toxic or not. I see people not doing anything but I dismiss my chat window whenever I'm in there. Unimaginable how much that helps.

EDIT: Agree with PUGs being much more socially difficult and soul-destroying that LFR.

[TheramoreIsTheBomb]

I think you are VASTLY overstating this problem. Does it happen - absolutely! Does it happen to levels that are a problem that is breaking LFR? Not at all.

Personally, I always pull my weight if I run LFR. I don't like the idea of someone mooching off my work, so if I notice it, I vote to kick and the problem is solved!

The OP's real issue seems to be that he brings toxicity to LFR and gets kicked for it regularly. This is an assumption, but based on his forum posts it seems likely.

- - - Updated - - -


YES!


YES!


DEFINITELY NOT!

As I stated earlier, LFR is designed to be casual story mode so non-raiders get the opportunity to see the content.

Doing average dps isn't hard. Blizz is already forcing us to learn rotations with slower leveling.

[Byleth]

Doing average dps isn't hard. Blizz is already forcing us to learn rotations with slower leveling.

You seem to have a lot of misplaced anger towards Blizz.

At some point you should probably take a step back and look at yourself. Maybe you are the problem?