Nvidia are being bad again

[Remilia]

Well the RX580 Strix is still on Amazon: https://www.amazon.com/Asus-Radeon-S...OG-STRIX-RX580

Sold by ServerSalvage and Fulfilled by Amazon in easy-to-open packaging.
vs
Ships from and sold by Amazon.com. Gift-wrap available.

One gets updated by Amazon the other gets updated by the 3rd party vendor. Guess which one has bigger obligation towards the manufacturer and quicker to update.

[Zenny]

Sold by ServerSalvage and Fulfilled by Amazon in easy-to-open packaging.
vs
Ships from and sold by Amazon.com. Gift-wrap available.

One gets updated by Amazon the other gets updated by the 3rd party vendor. Guess which one has bigger obligation towards the manufacturer and quicker to update.

Still on Overclockers UK as well: https://www.overclockers.co.uk/asus-...gx-414-as.html

They are also still being advertised on the ASUS website.

[Remilia]

And btw, I don't know why you expect this to change overnight in an instant, inventory is still out there with the old boxes, not like they can or should recall a couple cent cardboard box.

[Zenny]

And btw, I don't know why you expect this to change overnight in an instant, inventory is still out there with the old boxes, not like they can or should recall a couple cent cardboard box.

I'm just pointing out that RoG AMD cards are still available and that the non-RoG cards that have been linked so far have never had RoG branding.

[Remilia]

I'm just pointing out that RoG AMD cards are still available and that the non-RoG cards that have been linked so far have never had RoG branding.

Go reread gray matter's post. Especially the part with the title.
And it's not just an Asus thing. Look at Gigabyte being the most obvious right now. Their new external GPU box has Aorus brand only on Nvidia ones.

[Deleted]

You may all hate AMD and wish them to go out of business but need i remind you without AMD you wouldn't have had the Coffee Lake Processors so soon and so cheaply.

AMD is the ONLY thing stopping Intel/Nvidia from selling at an even higher margin.

Ryzen processors aren't even that bad look at the 1700 for example 8 cores 16 threads, 3.0 baseclock 3.7 Boost (Overclock to 4.0Ghz on air), 16MB Cache sure the 8600k/8700k has better single core speeds etc. but at £100+ less then i7 its ideal for new content creators or people who just can't afford Intel.

There is no AMD is better or Intel is better. Both do the job well for their different target audiences and we need both to keep innervation coming quick and 'cheaper'.

[Life-Binder]

Gigabyte has removed Auros branding from AMD cards and Newegg shows Asus RX 580s without the RoG brand.

and the world didnt end ??

heresy !

[Evildeffy]

and the world didnt end ??

heresy !

You fail to see the possible consequences of this, you usually do, not to mention the fact of length of time passing by.
Same as the guy who was disappointed and called AMD shit for not drastically changing market %-ages in 10 days when they first launched in time for the quarter closing ... it doesn't happen overnight.

Let's see if it is as it was reported by Kyle Bennet from HardOCP... meaning:
All gaming brands will belong to nVidia from Manufacturers ... meaning that manufacturers can no longer advertize any other GPU brand as a gaming product.
To dumb this down further ... if GigaByte is in the programme it means that any AMD cards they sell can only be advertized as f.ex. a compute or block-chain card.
To advertise it as a gaming card would mean they've violated the nVidia GPP and would receive no benefits of said programme.

Or that the terms have changed and that 1 single line of gaming brands is fixed per brand to nVidia.
Meaning that GigaByte can use AORUS for nVidia and SUROA for AMD (made up name, do not take it literally), in which case there's less of an issue.
It would simply mean a segregation between brands and this doesn't have to be terrible PROVIDED they can interchange components etc. and not relegate equivalent competitor cards to "lesser" brands within the company.

It's still relatively a dick move because nVidia is grabbing the company's own gaming line which they spent up building for years and a lot of money as their own for basically completely free, GigaByte's AORUS branding being a relatively never and lesser known one.

But f.ex. it'd mean that ASUS' Republic of Gamers line would belong exclusively to nVidia which is an extremely well known and liked branding and is now usurped by nVidia because they can...

That said there's always the possibility of sub branding within the brand if nVidia hasn't locked that down, this would mean the following as an example:
GigaByte AORUS BASILISK could belong to nVidia and GigaByte AORUS PHOENIX could belong to AMD.
ASUS Republic of Gamers STRIX could be nVidia and ASUS Republic of Gamers CERBERUS could belong to AMD.
Though I doubt nVidia will allow this as the branding will still be too similar.

[therealbowser]

I don't use AMD, but I am disgusted by this practice none the less. And it's not because I feel it's a terrible wrong to AMD, but because technology like this needs competition to thrive. Sincerely hope this shit doesn't fly.

[prwraith]

Customer choice is already fucked with the gsycn and freesync bullshit.

[Denpepe]

You fail to see the possible consequences of this, you usually do, not to mention the fact of length of time passing by.
Same as the guy who was disappointed and called AMD shit for not drastically changing market %-ages in 10 days when they first launched in time for the quarter closing ... it doesn't happen overnight.

Let's see if it is as it was reported by Kyle Bennet from HardOCP... meaning:
All gaming brands will belong to nVidia from Manufacturers ... meaning that manufacturers can no longer advertize any other GPU brand as a gaming product.
To dumb this down further ... if GigaByte is in the programme it means that any AMD cards they sell can only be advertized as f.ex. a compute or block-chain card.
To advertise it as a gaming card would mean they've violated the nVidia GPP and would receive no benefits of said programme.

Or that the terms have changed and that 1 single line of gaming brands is fixed per brand to nVidia.
Meaning that GigaByte can use AORUS for nVidia and SUROA for AMD (made up name, do not take it literally), in which case there's less of an issue.
It would simply mean a segregation between brands and this doesn't have to be terrible PROVIDED they can interchange components etc. and not relegate equivalent competitor cards to "lesser" brands within the company.

It's still relatively a dick move because nVidia is grabbing the company's own gaming line which they spent up building for years and a lot of money as their own for basically completely free, GigaByte's AORUS branding being a relatively never and lesser known one.

But f.ex. it'd mean that ASUS' Republic of Gamers line would belong exclusively to nVidia which is an extremely well known and liked branding and is now usurped by nVidia because they can...

That said there's always the possibility of sub branding within the brand if nVidia hasn't locked that down, this would mean the following as an example:
GigaByte AORUS BASILISK could belong to nVidia and GigaByte AORUS PHOENIX could belong to AMD.
ASUS Republic of Gamers STRIX could be nVidia and ASUS Republic of Gamers CERBERUS could belong to AMD.
Though I doubt nVidia will allow this as the branding will still be too similar.

Companies should just use their old gaming brands for AMD and intel stuff and use Nvidia's money and resources to create a new one for Nvidia only, though I doubt very much this will happen.

[Blackmist]

Kind of a dick move, but all it means is that third party card makers will set up a secondary brand for their AMD cards.

Be honest, how many of us know which brand of card they have right now, without looking it up on the order form? I know I can't. All I know it it wasn't Palit.

[Evildeffy]

Companies should just use their old gaming brands for AMD and intel stuff and use Nvidia's money and resources to create a new one for Nvidia only, though I doubt very much this will happen.

Of course not... nVidia wants to ride the free wave of already built up reputations, such as Republic of Gamers.

- - - Updated - - -

Kind of a dick move, but all it means is that third party card makers will set up a secondary brand for their AMD cards.

Be honest, how many of us know which brand of card they have right now, without looking it up on the order form? I know I can't. All I know it it wasn't Palit.

Point 1: That's the point... as of yet we don't know what this entails, it can be either/or and that's what's terrifying.

Point 2: MSI Radeon R9 390X Gaming 8G in my current rig that I've yet to assemble, GigaByte GeForce GTX 1080 G1 Gaming in my off-site build, ASUS GeForce GTX 670 DCII Mini... most people on this forum that post regularly are very well aware of what they have as they aren't consumers that buy random OEMs.

[Shakadam]

I'm fairly certain that what Nvidia is doing here is actually an illegal business practice.
Usurping a built up brand name for their products only from a partner, under threat of the partner being disadvantaged if they don't sign up, can't possibly be legal.


It'll be very interesting to hear what the EU have to say about this. If there's one thing the EU is very good at, it's protecting consumer choice and smacking down anti-competitive business practices.

Meanwhile.... XFX, Sapphire and some other AMD exclusive AIB partners are probably quite thrilled about this, they'll be picking up a lot more sales.

[Evildeffy]

I'm fairly certain that what Nvidia is doing here is actually an illegal business practice.
Usurping a built up brand name for their products only from a partner, under threat of the partner being disadvantaged if they don't sign up, can't possibly be legal.

It's not legal as it's the same shit as Intel did to AMD and the EU fined Intel badly for it.

It'll be very interesting to hear what the EU have to say about this. If there's one thing the EU is very good at, it's protecting consumer choice and smacking down anti-competitive business practices.

Meanwhile.... XFX, Sapphire and some other AMD exclusive AIB partners are probably quite thrilled about this, they'll be picking up a lot more sales.

The problem here is speed ... it takes too long for the turds to come into action with legal stuff.
Because they're "busy with other things" of which most is useless discussing of shite.

At that point in time the damage may have already been done.

That fine I mentioned above from Intel to AMD? To this day it's not paid yet.

[mrgreenthump]

And with MSI removing their Gaming brand from AMD cards, all 3 big players are now confirmed, though because they have gazillion different brands, they seem to be able to keep the Armor brand with the Radeon cards.. At least for now.

- - - Updated - - -

Meanwhile.... XFX, Sapphire and some other AMD exclusive AIB partners are probably quite thrilled about this, they'll be picking up a lot more sales.

Also ASRock with them entering the market with their own AMD card soon.

[Remilia]

https://www.forbes.com/sites/jasonev.../#b1f58124c6a1

Since publishing the story, all of Bennett's contacts have gone silent including Nvidia. My own follow-up to his investigation is stalled. I'd secured a commitment from a few companies to speak off the record, but they have also gone dark. Prior to that happening I had two brief conversations that made it obvious the program was troublesome, to put it mildly.

https://www.computerbase.de/2018-03/...x-580/#update1

UPDATE: Gigabyte tells ComputerBase.de that this product does not have AORUS branding because it is "not gamer focused." That's interesting because this is their product page:

[Vash The Stampede]

Kind of a dick move, but all it means is that third party card makers will set up a secondary brand for their AMD cards.

Be honest, how many of us know which brand of card they have right now, without looking it up on the order form? I know I can't. All I know it it wasn't Palit.

I honestly don't remember. The problem is that it's advertised for gaming, which we know sells more. As Linus points out, putting "gaming" on a product makes it sell more. You and I won't care, but JoeSixPack walking into BestBuy is going to look for whatever allows him to play PUBG, and a "gaming" card is what he'll go for.

I'm fairly certain that what Nvidia is doing here is actually an illegal business practice.
Usurping a built up brand name for their products only from a partner, under threat of the partner being disadvantaged if they don't sign up, can't possibly be legal.

The way the partners see it, by the time AMD or whomever makes a competitive product against Nvidia, they would have banked. Once a competitive product enters the market, they can call Nvidia out for shenanigans.

Meanwhile.... XFX, Sapphire and some other AMD exclusive AIB partners are probably quite thrilled about this, they'll be picking up a lot more sales.

I haven't thought about that. They can slap gaming on their cards all day long, which might actually backfire on Nvidia. If you see a RX580 from Sapphire and Asus on the shelf and one says gaming, you will automatically assume that a RX580 is for gaming. Assuming those AMD exclusive partners have products on a shelf. This is 2018, how many people walk into a store to buy computer parts?

Laptop makers might have more to be pissed about, since Ryzen APU's can be a legitimate product to offer as gaming. AMD vs Nvidia in laptops makes more sense to stick it to Nvidia and rat them out.

You may all hate AMD and wish them to go out of business but need i remind you without AMD you wouldn't have had the Coffee Lake Processors so soon and so cheaply.

AMD is the ONLY thing stopping Intel/Nvidia from selling at an even higher margin.

Ryzen processors aren't even that bad look at the 1700 for example 8 cores 16 threads, 3.0 baseclock 3.7 Boost (Overclock to 4.0Ghz on air), 16MB Cache sure the 8600k/8700k has better single core speeds etc. but at £100+ less then i7 its ideal for new content creators or people who just can't afford Intel.

There is no AMD is better or Intel is better. Both do the job well for their different target audiences and we need both to keep innervation coming quick and 'cheaper'.

While I'm all for AMD, I also more about competition. The GPU market has two choices. Three if you include Intel, but that's pushing it. Good to see that Intel is planning on making better graphics, but unless they plan to produce discrete GPU's, the discrete GPU market will still only have two choices.

With all the recent hubbub about Ray-Tracing, I would like to remind people that Imagination Technologies is also into Ray-Tracing. People forget there was a time that PowerVR graphic cards were on Desktop PC's and they were amazing. Took Nvidia until Maxwell to get tile-rendering when PowerVR had this technology at least as far back as 1999.

We need a 3rd competitor and we need people to stop being fanboys.

[Sorshen]

I do hope the EU fines the shit out of nvidia for these business practices.

[Deleted]

I think we can come to a few conclusions from what was mentioned in the topic earlier and what the reviews show in general:

1) In the last few years Nvidia always had superior driver support. AMD was doing good, but I think every AMD user experienced glitches here and there. On Linux for example, the greens have total supremacy - AMD even stopped developing their own proprietary driver, Linux gaming right now is pretty much Nvidia-only, simply because of drivers.

2) In the last few years, Nvidia cards always outperformed AMD ones in the same category. Except maybe in the extra-low budget gamer price range, but AMD's strategy was always trying to lower prices, so they can compete with similar Nvidia GPUs. Hence they often went head-to-head in price/performance ratio, but that didn't help Radeon reap high profit margin on their products.

3) In the last few years, Nvidia cards were always more energy-efficient. Not by much per se - but that +10-20% performance/Watt means a lot in the end.

4) In the last few years, Nvidia cards had lower failure rate. Pretty much a consequence of point 3) - if you can make cards with lower power consumption, they need to rely less on cooling and they will last longer.

5) Nvidia's software developments (PhysX, Hairworks, GSync, etc.) worked out in the end and some are still in use. AMD's (Mantle, TrueAudio, FreeSync) had less success.

I ain't a fanboy or anything like that (have 2 Nvidia and 3 AMD GPUs in my household), but the technological advantage pretty much justifies Nvidia's market share and their business policy. I wouldn't be worried for Radeon though - AsRock is just about to announce that they will be a new partner for making AMD cards and you can buy Sapphire cards in every PC shop too. Just don't wait for super-fast and super-cheap Radeon GPUs that will annihilate the competition, because that's hugely unlikely in the near future. If they can build solid low-end cards in the upcoming VGA generations, maybe they can retain their current market share or even increase it by a little, but I doubt there will be big changes in gaming video card popularity. Thus Nvidia will remain "bad" - you gotta deal with it.