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  1. #261
    Quote Originally Posted by Kaleredar View Post
    In the 90s the NRA campaigned to prevent the CDC, a government agency with the most accurate and complete access to researchers and federal and criminal records spanning decades, whose job it is to research casualties in the US ranging from disease to crime to vehicular, from putting any funding towards researching gun crime or its causes.

    Now why would the NRA do that?


    As for "why does this need to be researched," it's so the US as a country can formulate a plan forward based on scientific facts and data, rather than relying on random lucky breaks. In short, so people don't look at one example and tout that as their savior.

    You might as well be arguing that playing slot machines is a good use of money because you played one once and won 20 dollars, and are vehemently refusing to believe otherwise.
    You forgot to mention, the reason why they weren't allowed to use funding, is because the head of the CDC was a known anti-gun, and there was something about them seeing guns as nothing but a useless virus if I remember correctly. It was clear that at the time, any study would not be considered as had been with no bias, so it would have be useless.

  2. #262
    Void Lord Elegiac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Findlyn View Post
    You forgot to mention, the reason why they weren't allowed to use funding, is because the head of the CDC was a known anti-gun, and there was something about them seeing guns as nothing but a useless virus if I remember correctly.
    You remember incorrectly, then.
    Quote Originally Posted by Marjane Satrapi
    The world is not divided between East and West. You are American, I am Iranian, we don't know each other, but we talk and understand each other perfectly. The difference between you and your government is much bigger than the difference between you and me. And the difference between me and my government is much bigger than the difference between me and you. And our governments are very much the same.

  3. #263
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowpunkz View Post

    Please, dont try to change my view on guns in a "brainwashy" kind of way.
    I will NEVER see guns as toys and objects to have fun.
    My culture teaches me guns are bad. They are serious. Its not a laughing matter.
    Never will i see a gun as an object for "fun".
    I'm staying neutral overall but I wanted to point out this statement here actually sounds brainwashed in of itself, you are not even wiling to entertain the idea of going to a range and see people using guns in non threatening manner.

    Guns are dangerous yes and they absolutely need stronger restrictions here in the US, and they certainly aren't toys, but they are still just an object and can be used in a recreational setting (hunting or competition), as long as the users are also exercising caution, just as number of other dangerous things can be.

  4. #264
    Quote Originally Posted by Didactic View Post
    You remember incorrectly, then.
    My bad, it was just the head of a cdc-funded organization and the head of the cdc agreed(referencing guns akin to AIDS); https://www.forbes.com/sites/larrybe.../#2cd04316282d

  5. #265
    Non nobis Domine, non nobis, sed nomini tuo da gloriam

  6. #266
    Banned Orlong's Avatar
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    This new term "Resource Officer" really grates my nerves. Why not call them what they actually are. A police officer. What resources are they providing? Its another PC term they came up with so as not to make it sound like a scary man walking through the school with a gun

  7. #267
    Quote Originally Posted by Aggrophobic View Post
    No guns at all and you won't need "heroes with guns".
    No guns at all,

    -Criminals have less fear to break into your home and commit robbery and rape.
    -This removes a barrier for ground invasion by an enemy force. Are you going to send in your troops to an area where armed civilians will probably end up taking out much of them even before they have had a chance to face the enemy army?
    -People with guns and a sinister agenda, kill as many innocent people as possible because there is no one else to oppose them.[/QUOTE]

    Remember that jerk in Texas that shot up the church? He was believed to be on his way to kill even more people, lucky for them, that old fella stopped him. The two recent occurrences are nothing new, there have been many other times that an armed civilian has stopped a gunman. That being said, I still want tighter gun control to keep them out of the hands of would be murderers, but I don't want to infringe on the average law abiding citizen's right to own firearms.

    -Mandatory license to be able to own a firearm
    -Outside of BB, paintball and airsoft guns, raise the minimum age to purchase a firearm to 21.
    -Comprehensive database of anyone that has ever committed a violent act or has been treated by a psychologist for violent behavior.
    -FBI taking threats more seriosly
    -NRA severely handicapped, as they should not be allowed to lobby members of Congress.

  8. #268
    Quote Originally Posted by Laerrus View Post
    No guns at all,

    -Criminals have less fear to break into your home and commit robbery and rape.
    -This removes a barrier for ground invasion by an enemy force. Are you going to send in your troops to an area where armed civilians will probably end up taking out much of them even before they have had a chance to face the enemy army?
    -People with guns and a sinister agenda, kill as many innocent people as possible because there is no one else to oppose them.
    Remember that jerk in Texas that shot up the church? He was believed to be on his way to kill even more people, lucky for them, that old fella stopped him. The two recent occurrences are nothing new, there have been many other times that an armed civilian has stopped a gunman. That being said, I still want tighter gun control to keep them out of the hands of would be murderers, but I don't want to infringe on the average law abiding citizen's right to own firearms.

    -Mandatory license to be able to own a firearm
    -Outside of BB, paintball and airsoft guns, raise the minimum age to purchase a firearm to 21.
    -Comprehensive database of anyone that has ever committed a violent act or has been treated by a psychologist for violent behavior.
    -FBI taking threats more seriosly
    -NRA severely handicapped, as they should not be allowed to lobby members of Congress.[/QUOTE]

    IMO, the NRA is a borderline terrorist organization that no longer serves its purpose. It now seeks to enforce laws and lawmakers to make a profit for the companys that produce the guns and ammo. I think that is a large issue with this at the moment, to much money invested in keeping things to easy to purchase firearms.

    Thing is, most of the gun owners would be fine with some of the gun laws people are proposing. The issue is that it becomes muddied by the anti-gun fanatics that are like the one person earlier in this thread, that think people who don't want to give up their guns and 2nd amendment should be executed by the military/police. To many far extremes, when the answer is dead in the middle.

  9. #269
    Quote Originally Posted by Orlong View Post
    This new term "Resource Officer" really grates my nerves. Why not call them what they actually are. A police officer. What resources are they providing? Its another PC term they came up with so as not to make it sound like a scary man walking through the school with a gun
    Should be called "Psycho-kid Exterminator" just to emphasize of how crazy that society is.
    Mother pus bucket!

  10. #270
    Quote Originally Posted by tankbug View Post
    Should be called "Psycho-kid Exterminator" just to emphasize of how crazy that society is.
    I suppose you would have said the same thing of the deputy at the Stoneland Douglas High School had he the stones to do what this Maryland officer done and killed Nikolas Cruz before he killed 17 students and staff.

  11. #271
    The Unstoppable Force Ghostpanther's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Findlyn View Post
    Remember that jerk in Texas that shot up the church? He was believed to be on his way to kill even more people, lucky for them, that old fella stopped him. The two recent occurrences are nothing new, there have been many other times that an armed civilian has stopped a gunman. That being said, I still want tighter gun control to keep them out of the hands of would be murderers, but I don't want to infringe on the average law abiding citizen's right to own firearms.

    -Mandatory license to be able to own a firearm
    -Outside of BB, paintball and airsoft guns, raise the minimum age to purchase a firearm to 21.
    -Comprehensive database of anyone that has ever committed a violent act or has been treated by a psychologist for violent behavior.
    -FBI taking threats more seriosly
    -NRA severely handicapped, as they should not be allowed to lobby members of Congress.

    IMO, the NRA is a borderline terrorist organization that no longer serves its purpose. It now seeks to enforce laws and lawmakers to make a profit for the companys that produce the guns and ammo. I think that is a large issue with this at the moment, to much money invested in keeping things to easy to purchase firearms.

    Thing is, most of the gun owners would be fine with some of the gun laws people are proposing. The issue is that it becomes muddied by the anti-gun fanatics that are like the one person earlier in this thread, that think people who don't want to give up their guns and 2nd amendment should be executed by the military/police. To many far extremes, when the answer is dead in the middle.
    Who is a NRA member.

    How you going to insure all 300+ million firearms become licensed? House to house searches?

    The issue with 21 to purchase a firearm is, you stopping some adults from exercising a Constitutional right. You are ether a adult at 18 or not. Congress needs to make up their minds. :P

    Rest of your proposals are good.

    Opinions are like noses. If we want to make a law no rich person or any organization can not donate millions or contact their representatives to express a opinion, then fine.
    The NRA has over 5 million members and most, if not all, join for the purpose of knowing the NRA will fight for their rights to exercise the Second Amendment. Same as millions join the AARP to fight for their retirement rights. There are lot more associations and groups which could be mentioned, who do the same thing the NRA is accused of.
    Last edited by Ghostpanther; 2018-03-20 at 10:59 PM.
    " If destruction be our lot, we must ourselves be its author and finisher.." - Abraham Lincoln
    The Constitution be never construed to authorize Congress to - prevent the people of the United States, who are peaceable citizens, from keeping their own arms..” - Samuel Adams

  12. #272
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowferal View Post
    I suppose you would have said the same thing of the deputy at the Stoneland Douglas High School had he the stones to do what this Maryland officer done and killed Nikolas Cruz before he killed 17 students and staff.
    Was he hired by the school to kill psychotic kids ?
    Mother pus bucket!

  13. #273
    The Unstoppable Force Ghostpanther's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tankbug View Post
    Was he hired by the school to kill psychotic kids ?
    He was assigned to the school as a security guard. He was paid by tax payers, the same way the school is. :P
    " If destruction be our lot, we must ourselves be its author and finisher.." - Abraham Lincoln
    The Constitution be never construed to authorize Congress to - prevent the people of the United States, who are peaceable citizens, from keeping their own arms..” - Samuel Adams

  14. #274
    Merely a Setback Kaleredar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by petej0 View Post
    Who is guessing? We have the data, we know the style of guns used. We know who the individuals who conducted the crimes are, we know how they acquired the firearms, we know the death count. What are we guessing at?
    What causes it and what can be done to lessen it.

    You might as well say "we know what cancer does and where it can form. Why do we have to know anything else about it?"
    “Do not lose time on daily trivialities. Do not dwell on petty detail. For all of these things melt away and drift apart within the obscure traffic of time. Live well and live broadly. You are alive and living now. Now is the envy of all of the dead.” ~ Emily3, World of Tomorrow
    Quote Originally Posted by Wells View Post
    Kaleredar is right...
    Words to live by.

  15. #275
    Scarab Lord Polybius's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Venant View Post
    How do we explain soy boys then?
    Because milk makes you manlier, right?

    /facepalm

    ot: OP forgets to mention the 'hero' was a hired cop. We need people that follow protocols, not self-righteous dumbasses.

  16. #276
    Quote Originally Posted by Ghostpanther View Post
    Who is a NRA member.

    How you going to insure all 300+ million firearms become licensed? House to house searches?

    The issue with 21 to purchase a firearm is, you stopping some adults from exercising a Constitutional right. You are ether a adult at 18 or not. Congress needs to make up their minds. :P


    Rest of your proposals are good.

    Opinions are like noses. If we want to make a law no rich person or any organization can not donate millions or contact their representatives to express a opinion, then fine.
    The NRA has over 5 million members and most, if not all, join for the purpose of knowing the NRA will fight for their rights to exercise the Second Amendment. Same as millions join the AARP to fight for their retirement rights. There are lot more associations and groups which could be mentioned, who do the same thing the NRA is accused of.
    You should probably read the full thing before responding, would realize a lot of what you are talking about is from the quoting function not working appropriately. But I agree, no gun registration, its been proven to not work and just be a money sink. Also agree on the 21 age restriction, no go unless you also raise a lot of things such as requirement to register for draft and shouldn't be legally held as an adult(but as a minor) if you aren't viewed as an adult.

    No one should be able to purchase a firearm, either at a vendor or private sale, without having to go through a background check.

    I would bet a lot of current NRA members, might not have joined as a lifetime member if they knew what the NRA would have become today. NRA only fights for the 2nd amendment right anymore, not for the individual(that is just a by product) but for the corporations that make money from the sales. If the rumors are true about them advocating violence in regards to the Florida shootings against the kids calling for gun reform, they are by definition 100% a terrorist organization and should be treated as such. Also, used to be a NRA member, with a long history of family members there were apart of the NRA BTW.
    Last edited by Findlyn; 2018-03-20 at 11:09 PM. Reason: Just realized, you edited the quote and would have had to manually remove the quote function...

  17. #277
    Quote Originally Posted by tankbug View Post
    Was he hired by the school to kill psychotic kids ?
    It's always a no-win situation. A person takes down the psycho armed to the teeth before he goes on a killing spree, and the person gets shitted on because he killed him. When no one does anything to prevent the massacre...

    And this is why any gun control argument goes nowhere.

  18. #278
    The Unstoppable Force Ghostpanther's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kaleredar View Post
    What causes it and what can be done to lessen it.

    You might as well say "we know what cancer does and where it can form. Why do we have to know anything else about it?"
    It starts in the home. Which is where we need to start looking. Too many kids growing up with ether no good role models to look up to or just irresponsible parents. The patterns are there.
    " If destruction be our lot, we must ourselves be its author and finisher.." - Abraham Lincoln
    The Constitution be never construed to authorize Congress to - prevent the people of the United States, who are peaceable citizens, from keeping their own arms..” - Samuel Adams

  19. #279
    Merely a Setback Kaleredar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Swalload View Post
    I dunno man, maybe some of them left extremist rich hollywood hypocrites could fund these research instead of fake crying on cue in front of a camera. It doesn't need to be government funded.
    But the thing is, hollywood hypocrites are not stupid, they manipulate people for a living, they know if they fund such research they won't get the result they want, so they just don't.
    So instead you cite the pure motives of the gun industry?

    Also, way to blame the Hollywood elite for what the NRA did. The CDC has access to far more resources, data, and, as far as it seems you're concerned, would be an exceptionally impartial source of information given their access to numerous scientists and accountability of method.

    Meaning people wouldn't be able to hand-wave it away with "lol fake news."
    “Do not lose time on daily trivialities. Do not dwell on petty detail. For all of these things melt away and drift apart within the obscure traffic of time. Live well and live broadly. You are alive and living now. Now is the envy of all of the dead.” ~ Emily3, World of Tomorrow
    Quote Originally Posted by Wells View Post
    Kaleredar is right...
    Words to live by.

  20. #280
    Quote Originally Posted by Ghostpanther View Post
    He was assigned to the school as a security guard. He was paid by tax payers, the same way the school is. :P
    The best phrase I read to describe the SRO was a "living promissory note", i.e. that for all the possible inconvenience, locker searches or getting hooked for pot in the bathroom, having a uniformed deputy at that school every day stood as an implicit promise that he would put their lives ahead of his own if he ever had to.

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