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  1. #1
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    Lightbulb Why Socialism ? By Albert Einstein

    "I honor Lenin as a man who completely sacrificed himself and devoted all his energy to the realization of social justice. I do not consider his methods practical, but one thing is certain: men of his type are the guardians and restorers of humanity." A. Einstein
    Private capital tends to become concentrated in few hands, partly because of competition among the capitalists, and partly because technological development and the increasing division of labor encourage the formation of larger units of production at the expense of smaller ones. The result of these developments is an oligarchy of private capital the enormous power of which cannot be effectively checked even by a democratically organized political society. This is true since the members of legislative bodies are selected by political parties, largely financed or otherwise influenced by private capitalists who, for all practical purposes, separate the electorate from the legislature. The consequence is that the representatives of the people do not in fact sufficiently protect the interests of the underprivileged sections of the population. Moreover, under existing conditions, private capitalists inevitably control, directly or indirectly, the main sources of information (press, radio, education). It is thus extremely difficult, and indeed in most cases quite impossible, for the individual citizen to come to objective conclusions and to make intelligent use of his political rights.
    That text was published in 1949.

    https://monthlyreview.org/2009/05/01/why-socialism/

    Whether you've developed class-consciousness or not, you have to admit that this is a beautiful text that to this day still resounds as a beacon of shining truth amidst the darkness of the modern capitalist age.

    I've never been surprised that our most brilliants minds all shared red sympathies.


    Sharing the essay (which i've only recently heard about myself) for everyone to enjoy
    Last edited by mmocab05265050; 2018-03-21 at 01:39 PM.

  2. #2
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    Asking Albert Einstein about economic theories is like asking Stephen Hawking about the best running shoes.

  3. #3
    Because socialist countries never controlled their media?

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deruyter View Post
    Asking Albert Einstein about economic theories is like asking Stephen Hawking about the best running shoes.
    Thank you for your witty contribution deruyter

    You are a person of great intelligence

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Deruyter View Post
    Asking Albert Einstein about economic theories is like asking Stephen Hawking about the best running shoes.
    Pretty sure that Stephen Hawking is still better informed on running shoes than the average moron

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kurata View Post
    Thank you for your witty contribution deruyter

    You are a person of great intelligence
    Thank you, comrade

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Kurata View Post
    I do not consider his methods practical
    It's like you're not even trying.

  8. #8
    You cannot have a successful government if humans are in control period.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Deruyter View Post
    Asking Albert Einstein about economic theories is like asking Stephen Hawking about the best running shoes.
    Considering the intellectual a capacity of both those people, even if they aren't experts in the field their opinions are still valuable.

    Also... there's a reason why we still study Marx in both economics and sociology.

  10. #10
    Why Capitalism?

    https://www.cato.org/events/why-capitalism

    (Oxford University Press, 2012)
    Share
    Book Forum
    April 24, 2012
    12:00PM to 1:00PM EDT
    Hayek Auditorium
    Featuring the author Allan H. Meltzer, University Professor of Political Economy at Carnegie Mellon University; with comments by John Mueller, Senior Fellow, Cato Institute; moderated by David Boaz, Executive Vice President, Cato Institute.


    The only economic system that maximizes both growth and individual liberty is capitalism, explains Allan H. Meltzer in his new book. Capitalism succeeds because it is adaptive, not rigid, whereas so much regulation often fails despite good intentions. The author will explain why European welfare states lag behind the United States, the causes of postwar progress and current enormous budget deficits, and why inflation will return. Join us to hear Professor Meltzer’s passionate defense of the free market at a time when U.S. citizens seem to lack a shared vision of the way to maintain domestic or world growth. John Mueller will comment on the role of capitalism in human progress.
    .

    "This will be a fight against overwhelming odds from which survival cannot be expected. We will do what damage we can."

    -- Capt. Copeland

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hubcap View Post
    Capitalism succeeds
    its just the summary and there's already a mistake

  12. #12
    Dreadlord Noah37's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Unholyground View Post
    You cannot have a successful government if humans are in control period.
    This. People are generally self-motivated and will do things that will benefit themselves. There's an old saying I remember that a truly great man is the one who plants a tree knowing that he will never enjoy its shade. It rarely seems like those in charge are making decisions that benefit society as a whole, as opposed to benefiting their benefactors.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moon Blade View Post
    There's nothing for casuals to do, beyond pretend they are raiders in LFR.

  13. #13
    We should definitively give Socialism its due credit. It's highly underrated.

    Most countries have Socialist governments improving the country and "governments" heavy on capitalism taking power years later only to ruin the economy and force feed the pigs that support them.

    Then Socialism comes back and gets the country back on its feet. We should really start pondering the notion of a world wide Socialism government that provides everyone with all the benefits it creates locally.

  14. #14
    Titan Grimbold21's Avatar
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    He couldn't have been for social justice while advocating that the way to his goals went through mass imprisonment and killings.

    Gulag Archipelago anyone?

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grimbold21 View Post
    He couldn't have been for social justice while advocating that the way to his goals went through mass imprisonment and killings.

    Gulag Archipelago anyone?
    Lenin isn't Stalin

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Deruyter View Post
    Asking Albert Einstein about economic theories is like asking Stephen Hawking about the best running shoes.
    I really shouldn't have laughed at this as much as I did. I disagree, because I feel everyone can have an opinion on <whatever>, but fuck this was funny.

    On-Topic:
    My utopia would be a place where everyone capable just did their part, and they were equally rewarded for doing their part. Or, currency of any form was abolished and again - everyone capable just does their part - and the necessities of life are provided for.

    Not realistic by any stretch of the imagination, but it's how I'd picture my utopia.
    That all being said, every social/economic theory has one major flaw that will never change: humans. There is nothing that we will be able to do that will be fair or equal for every single person, and we just have to do what is best for the majority and help out those who are struggling.
    Sadly, because humans, that will never happen either.

  17. #17
    I Don't Work Here Endus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hubcap View Post
    Why Capitalism?

    https://www.cato.org/events/why-capitalism

    (Oxford University Press, 2012)
    Share
    Book Forum
    April 24, 2012
    12:00PM to 1:00PM EDT
    Hayek Auditorium
    Featuring the author Allan H. Meltzer, University Professor of Political Economy at Carnegie Mellon University; with comments by John Mueller, Senior Fellow, Cato Institute; moderated by David Boaz, Executive Vice President, Cato Institute.


    The only economic system that maximizes both growth and individual liberty is capitalism, explains Allan H. Meltzer in his new book. Capitalism succeeds because it is adaptive, not rigid, whereas so much regulation often fails despite good intentions. The author will explain why European welfare states lag behind the United States, the causes of postwar progress and current enormous budget deficits, and why inflation will return. Join us to hear Professor Meltzer’s passionate defense of the free market at a time when U.S. citizens seem to lack a shared vision of the way to maintain domestic or world growth. John Mueller will comment on the role of capitalism in human progress.
    Just to make a few points;

    1> Capitalism is not supportive of "individual liberty". It aggressively opposes individual liberty. The entire structure encourages the development of two classes; the consumer class and the owners of the means of production. The system, as Adam Smith perceived it, should be run to the benefit of the consumers, but in practice, this essentially does not happen. Because the owners of the means of production have an increasing share of the wealth of the nation, and thus have the power and influence to protect their interests, at the expense of consumers. This is what led to the poverty and abuses of the Industrial Revolution. It's how early capitalist societies ramped up the slave industry into a major economic platform. The advancement of human liberties has mostly occurred in the latter half of the 20th Century and onward, in an era when capitalist economics was being reined back through the implementation of socialist principles, such as worker protections and welfare programs. Those advancements not only occurred for reasons that had little to do with economics, but worse, worked against capitalist principles. If capitalism encouraged "individual liberty", those measures would never have been required, because that equity would have arrived naturally.

    2> The idea that "European welfare stats lag behind the United States" is basically hokum.

    Growth rates are REALLY similar, and recently, the EU's been doing better than the USA (not shown above, wanted a graph with a longer time period).


  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Deruyter View Post
    Asking Albert Einstein about economic theories is like asking Stephen Hawking about the best running shoes.
    You do know that The Netherlands is a fully functioning socialist republican monarchy with a capitalist mindset right? Or if you do then I apologize as my sarcasm detector is in the shop as I have the flu.
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  19. #19
    Socialism and capitalism are vague, generalizing terms that apply to a whole host of different ideas both in the economic and political sense. People seem to think that countries like Sweden, the Netherlands and Canada are socialist countries and thus socialism works, it's not that simple. I view it like this.

    Capitalism has been the single most effective tool in lifting millions of people all around the world out of poverty and into the middle class, so long as it has restrictions put on it too curb it worst excesses. Child labour sure is efficient, but not something we want as a society. Same goes for pollution, minimum wage, work hours, etc. Capitalism creates wealth and prosperity. When you prevent it all from flowing to just a few people at the detriment of everybody else you have the potential to create the states we see these days.

    Socialism as a political ideology, as in the midpoint of a state in transition between a (mixed) capitalist economy to a true communist one, can go fuck itself. It requires the state to hoard immense amounts of power, necessarily infringes heavily on the rights of it's citizens and is as history shows doomed to fail for various reasons (like human nature).

    However, some things are actually better done by the state, while others should be left to the private sector. Those we would call social(ist) policies that free market capitalist states implement, making them mixed economies. The military should only be controlled by the state, ask medieval Italians what happens when you rely entirely on mercenaries. Healthcare should at the very least be heavily regulated by the state, see America past and still somewhat present. Large corporations should be left to their own devises, that way they can do what is best for themselves and generate lots of wealth. Though ofcourse, they too are regulated. Look at Venezuela's oil sector for an example of socialising such industries.
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    just because the voices in your head tell you things, doesn't mean the world gives a crap.
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    Isn't it great how this thread has dematerialized from the unfair corruption of Ner'zuhl, to whether Kil'Jaeden is a draenei or an Eredar, then to Alien Genetics and now to demon sex...

  20. #20
    Titan Grimbold21's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kurata View Post
    Lenin isn't Stalin
    That didn't start with Stalin.

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