MDI 2 Discussion

[Emerald Archer]

is the race basically done since none can improve?

Definitely not over, heaps of places improvement can be made. Upper can go down to 14:10, less even. Not sure about MoS, but only 2 big dog teams have hit MoS hard so far.

And that nelth is 25seconds less with no healer, could definitely lower that time with some good rng and practice. It's very likely they had deaths they could prevent.

You might be overestimating the amount of time people have put in so far, or how much they put into 1 dungeon before moving to the next.

Like where's Methods MoS time? Where's that chinese groups Upper time? Wheres Asmons groups Nelths/Fully farmed MoS time? And others.

They aren't there because there's only so much time available. We're 4 days in. It's not 1 dungeon a day for 8hrs and you're done. They can easily drop 2-3 8hr+ days into a single dungeon, and keep improving the time.

Also, A lot of these guys still work. There's only so much time they can put in during the weekdays. Should see more changes than just that Nelth over the weekend.

[hulkgor]

DK, 4 WW Monk setups, sigh.

[Saiyoran]

It's been going on for what.. Almost 2 weeks now? People have figured out the best strats at this point and are just trying to push the last bit of performance. I wouldn't expect a massive amount of change in the leaderboards from what we have now

If you followed CM times the last 2 xpac, people were finding new tricks and changing up their pulls months and months into the xpac, in WoD even to the last few weeks (shadowmoon under-map glider for example, or iron star soul capping).

In a week, people are likely to find a pretty fast strategy and decent team comp, but all the little tricks and cheesy borderline exploit use of game mechanics that a speed run entails aren’t going to come out in such a small window.

[klaps_05]

Letting monks completely reign over every aspect of the game just shows blizzard is hands off this expansion. couldve done at least 1 more proper balancing patch post antorus instead of making literally everyone roll monks.

[Frolk]

Seeing this makes me feel even more sad that BDKs wont have leech aura in BFA.

Also, WW monk is balanced af

[shyguybman]

Letting monks completely reign over every aspect of the game just shows blizzard is hands off this expansion. couldve done at least 1 more proper balancing patch post antorus instead of making literally everyone roll monks.

And warlocks, and blood dk....

[Emerald Archer]

Letting monks completely reign over every aspect of the game just shows blizzard is hands off this expansion. couldve done at least 1 more proper balancing patch post antorus instead of making literally everyone roll monks.

I mean, it's really not as bad as this shows it to be. With weapon ilvl at 970, and a lot of specific pieces unavailable, Monks kick ass. They aren't dependant on wep ilvl nearly as much as other specs are. MM and some melee specs as an example, were gutted a bit (in comparison) to monk, with no arcano/cof and only with a 970 weapon. Monks don't care about those things being gone, whereas it really hurts other specs.

And even with that, the only dungeon where it's just pure monks, is Upper. And even then, other specs sneak in time to time.

Monks are 100% very strong, but the raid tier is pretty much over, there's no point of a nerf. And when it wasn't over, it was already a while into the tier before people realised monks were actually really busted. So it wasn't worth rerolling for many.

Also "this expansion" you mean this raid tier. It wasn't "making everyone roll monks" on live, not even close. You still want other melee specs, and there's only so many melee you can bring to raids.

I think you mean making everyone roll monks on the tournament realm, which isn't anything like live, because of 970 weapons barely effecting monks, and trucking other dps.

I'm not saying monks aren't very strong atm, but it's not nearly as "unbelievably op and ahead of the rest" as you seem to make it out to be.

[FareweII]

Except they don't have 970 weapons on TR, it's 995, which i assume is x3 970 relics. Monks are just stupidly strong on both aoe and st, have great burst on 20 second cd and insane one one a minute-long cd. They're the stongest dps in the game and it's not even close, no need to make excuses.

[Temp name]

Kinda surprised they're still running a healer in MoS when they get away without a healer in Upper and NL..
I suppose it's because of Helya?

[amaze123]

Kinda surprised they're still running a healer in MoS when they get away without a healer in Upper and NL..
I suppose it's because of Helya?

Probably because of bursting. Maybe we will see a no healer team with enough immunities to survive big pulls but other than that the time gain because of no dmg stop needed is probably bigger than a 4th dps.

[Emerald Archer]

Except they don't have 970 weapons on TR, it's 995

Nope According to the email they sent me, they're 970, there was a bug, so they're 970 for the rest of the time trials. So people don't have to re-do their times.

So that helps monks a lot. Otherwise you'd see comps like that on live, when you don't.

I'm not saying monks don't have insane AoE and ST. They clearly do. But it isn't AS insane as the TR makes it seem. Which is blatantly obvious when you look at the gear they're given the options of using. It's clearly not a big hit to monks, and clearly a huge hit to other specs. So therefore the difference in strength is amplified to seem worse than it is.

When in reality, you're not running more than 1 monk when doing keys on live, and on high keys often not even running 1 (usually because of survivability reasons)

On live, they're definitely not a "must have" spec in your m+ (The only real must have is pretty much a bdk and warlock but even then, there's options). It's like Warlock>Hunters=Monk with Rogue+Boomkin close behind.

You make it sound like you HAVE to have a monk or you're behind. When that's not the case on live.

[Daan]

20/22 aren't high keys at all, though. You are looking at teams that have full repertoires of 27s/ a few 28s completed in time - 20/22 are utterly trivial in that context.

Nevertheless, the balancing is horrible. Even if 24 isn't high, it shouldn't be possible without a healer. I also hope that Blizzard will rework the Blood DK in BfA. That immortal selfheal massgrip all-in-one tank is simply broken (like some damage specs).

[rogoth]

Nevertheless, the balancing is horrible. Even if 24 isn't high, it shouldn't be possible without a healer. I also hope that Blizzard will rework the Blood DK in BfA. That immortal selfheal massgrip all-in-one tank is simply broken (like some damage specs).

you really don't get it do you, outside of this content blood DK is 'meh' to 'good'. and even in this environment it's not an easy spec to play in these scenarios, this is the same sort of niche that is perfectly fine, decent raid tank, great dungeon tank and only used now because so many people have swapped from playing druid due to the utility of a blood DK.

[Deja Thoris]

you really don't get it do you, outside of this content blood DK is 'meh' to 'good'. and even in this environment it's not an easy spec to play in these scenarios, this is the same sort of niche that is perfectly fine, decent raid tank, great dungeon tank and only used now because so many people have swapped from playing druid due to the utility of a blood DK.

Ah yea because they are not OP in other places it's fine for them to be completely brokenly OP in other situations.

Great logic!

[rogoth]

Ah yea because they are not OP in other places it's fine for them to be completely brokenly OP in other situations.

Great logic!

i would rather they be 'broken OP' here and shit tier elsewhere than be like warlocks who are just 'broken OP' in every aspect of the game, or monks or any other example you wanna throw at it, the way you are whining it's like you don't want any spec to be very good at one job like it always used to be, no lets have mass homogenisation so everyone can do all the things! great logic!

[Deja Thoris]

i would rather they be 'broken OP' here and shit tier elsewhere than be like warlocks who are just 'broken OP' in every aspect of the game, or monks or any other example you wanna throw at it, the way you are whining it's like you don't want any spec to be very good at one job like it always used to be, no lets have mass homogenisation so everyone can do all the things! great logic!

Yea, fuck balance. Only one class of tank on the MDI leaderboards.

I'm not whining, just pointing out your pov is dumb as fuck.

[Trend]

i would rather they be 'broken OP' here and shit tier elsewhere than be like warlocks who are just 'broken OP' in every aspect of the game, or monks or any other example you wanna throw at it, the way you are whining it's like you don't want any spec to be very good at one job like it always used to be, no lets have mass homogenisation so everyone can do all the things! great logic!

So the fact that every fucking run on the boards for all 3 dungeons has a BDK doesn't strike you? LOL, let me guess, you play a BDK. Personally, given that m+ is supposed to be such a big part of the game, I consider this to be an enormous and incomprehensible balancing fail. It's terrible that you only have 2 classes to choose from to heal, but that's 100% more options than you have as a tank.

[Daffan]

Windwalker is a complete and utterly boring joke.

DK, 4 WW Monk setups, sigh.

Yup. Ridiculous.

[Millyraynge]

DK is currently very strong in M+. Grip, Leech, selfheal-capabilites are very strong. But tbh most groups are playing dk, because everyone is playing dk. I am a little bit disappointed that not a single group in the time trials decided for an another tank. Especially in usual group setups (with healer) DHs would be super strong for time trials. #RIPSHAKIB!!!!

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Windwalker is a complete and utterly boring joke.



Yup. Ridiculous.

For the current tourney stage: yes. For elimination runs: no. for elimination you will decide for max brezz/dps mix again.

After like 1000 of resets during this week, it will be hard for the teams to bring the best performance first try in a single attempt again.

[rogoth]

So the fact that every fucking run on the boards for all 3 dungeons has a BDK doesn't strike you? LOL, let me guess, you play a BDK. Personally, given that m+ is supposed to be such a big part of the game, I consider this to be an enormous and incomprehensible balancing fail. It's terrible that you only have 2 classes to choose from to heal, but that's 100% more options than you have as a tank.

didn't realise 'mage' was short for blood DK, i'll keep that in mind going forward so i don't get confused when talking about things, i suggest in future you check before making an ass of yourself my sig even has a link to my mains profile for gods sake.

as to your comment, druid was the only choice of raid tank in legion, even after they removed an ability mid expansion it still was so strong if you didn't use a druid you were doing it wrong, is that an 'incomprehensible balancing fail' as you put it? because it is in my eyes, blood DK is strong in dungeon content and decent in raid content but not the best, it has very clear weaknesses you strike me as one of those people that floods the forums whining about how OP something is in the area is designed to be strong in.

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DK is currently very strong in M+. Grip, Leech, selfheal-capabilites are very strong. But tbh most groups are playing dk, because everyone is playing dk. I am a little bit disappointed that not a single group in the time trials decided for an another tank. Especially in usual group setups (with healer) DHs would be super strong for time trials. #RIPSHAKIB!!!!

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For the current tourney stage: yes. For elimination runs: no. for elimination you will decide for max brezz/dps mix again.

if it wasn't that DH defensives are so RNG based then they would likely be used instead of DK's since they deal way more damage, and have almost the exact same toolkit available to them.