anyone else tired of alliance / horde characters becoming pacifist / neutral?

[muffinss]

so i just finished the silithus zone and its sad to see khadgar turn against the alliance and magni scold both the alliance and horde for their "fighting" and not getting along. both of these characters were great leaders and heroes of the alliance and see them turn their back, especially khadgar and become neutral is quite sad as an alliance player. seeing khadgar hurts the most. walking into stormwind and seeing the great statue of him and seeing him not willing to fight along the alliance is like a punch in the gut.

now don't mistake me. i understand the old gods and things to come. i 100% agree, but what i'm arguing about is just seeing once beloved heroes, leaders, go neutral against their faction is just a bummer. like thrall. seeing him go from a great leader of the horde to green jesus, the savior of the world was like a sour taste in my mouth. it really hurt faction pride.

i don't mind some characters doing it. like jaina and the arc they did with her was interesting. in a way i was kinda sad to see her turn away from her pacifist views with the horde and alliance. but its been so many great characters. like varian was heartbreaking how he went from a strong leader against the horde to "aww, we must love the horde!." and then die because the horde left (which was 100% understandable as they were losing too and vol'jin randomly died but i mean at least could you make it that the horde let him die on purpose? same with alliance vs killing a horde. alliance could have killed vol'jin instead of a random demon) it be nice if it was new, interesting characters developed rather than taking preexisting, beloved characters and see them just go all neutral / evil / pacifist. its fun and interesting when its some times, but not all the time.

don't go crazy with the neutral stuff.

[Villager720]

Khadgar makes the most sense of anyone to be neutral. He's been working alongside a (half)orc since the First War. He's also spent the last two expansions and BC building relationships with Horde characters. Malfurion/Thrall going neutral at the drop of a hat in Cata was odd.
Meanwhile, Khadgar has built relationships up over many years, and he's not willing to discard them just for petty fighting.

[muffinss]

Khadgar makes the most sense of anyone to be neutral. He's been working alongside a (half)orc since the First War. He's also spent the last two expansions and BC building relationships with Horde characters. Malfurion/Thrall going neutral at the drop of a hat in Cata was odd.
Khadgar has built relationships he's not willing to discard for petty fighting.

its just hard knowing how loyal he was during the second war. he help create the alliance after all with unifying the human kingdoms, dwarves, gnomes, extra. and led the alliance through the dark portal to end the horde threat. then comes back all neutral. there can be two separate factions with their own culture and beliefs. not everyone has to be the same. he could still hold allegiance to the very alliance he helped create.

[Ielenia]

so i just finished the silithus zone and its sad to see khadgar turn against the alliance and magni scold both the alliance and horde for their "fighting" and not getting along.

Khadgar, as @Villager720 mentioned, Khadgar has been fighting alongside other races for a long time, and Magni is now the spokesperson for the Titan that is growing within Azeroth. He's above the Horde and Alliance's squabbles, plus the fact that the two factions are harvesting the blood of the planet instead of helping it heal.

[muffinss]

Khadgar, as @Villager720 mentioned, Khadgar has been fighting alongside other races for a long time, and Magni is now the spokesperson for the Titan that is growing within Azeroth. He's above the Horde and Alliance's squabbles, plus the fact that the two factions are harvesting the blood of the planet instead of helping it heal.

he helped create the alliance. he led the alliance forces against the horde. he could still hold allegiance to the very alliance he helped create. he doesn't have the be a savior to both sides. he doesn't have to like the current horde. i mean, they can have their differences. i guess he can too but it just sucks seeing the man who helped create the alliance turn his back against it. that statue should be torn down.

[Ellixen]

The alliance was created to fight the horde that was sent by the burning legion. This horde is not the same and Khadgar knows that.

[Bathory]

Times change. Khadgar is far too intelligent to see that this faction war is anything but pointless in the bigger picture.

[Pebrocks The Warlock]

I think focusing on saving Azeroth takes priority over petty faction wars.

[muffinss]

I think focusing on saving Azeroth takes priority over petty faction wars.

Times change. Khadgar is far too intelligent to see that this faction war is anything but pointless in the bigger picture.

there can be two separate factions with their own culture and beliefs. not everyone has to be the same. the horde shouldn't have to aid the alliance and vice versa. i really like the way things were done with wrath. maybe my memory doesn't serve me as well as it use to but during wrath there was tension and was more like a cold war. it was more like a race to who was going to be the better faction while having skirmish with each other. they ended up "working" together without really having to "work" with each other.

if we're gonna keep getting told how we need to get along and unify and seeing our heroes switch to neutral or some how the villain (garrosh) might as well get rid of the factions. just be one faction.

[Ielenia]

he helped create the alliance.

And Thrall created the 'new' Horde. As for Khadgar 'helping' create the Alliance, according to Wowpedia, all he did was... be there. Nothing else.

he led the alliance forces against the horde.

Yeah, the bloodlust-crazed, demon-blood-addled Horde. Not against tauren and forsaken and trolls and goblins...

he could still hold allegiance to the very alliance he helped create.

The current Alliance is not the same he "helped" create, mind you. Also, people change. Throughout his years fighting, especially during Legion, he made many friends on both sides.

he doesn't have the be a savior to both sides. he doesn't have to like the current horde. i mean, they can have their differences.

Who said anything about being a savior? If two of your best friends start fighting, do you feel the need to support one of them against the other? Or do you either: a) stay away from their conflict, or b) try to patch things up between them?

i guess he can too but it just sucks seeing the man who helped create the alliance turn his back against it. that statue should be torn down.

Khadgar knows that a fight between the Alliance and the Horde, boosted up by the power of Azerite, is only going to spell doom to the already wounded planet of Azeroth. That healing the planet is more important than this never-ending war between the two factions. He's doing what any sensible person would do in this situation.

[muffinss]

And Thrall created the 'new' Horde. As for Khadgar 'helping' create the Alliance, according to Wowpedia, all he did was... be there. Nothing else.


Yeah, the bloodlust-crazed, demon-blood-addled Horde. Not against tauren and forsaken and trolls and goblins...


The current Alliance is not the same he "helped" create, mind you. Also, people change. Throughout his years fighting, especially during Legion, he made many friends on both sides.


Who said anything about being a savior? If two of your best friends start fighting, do you feel the need to support one of them against the other? Or do you either: a) stay away from their conflict, or b) try to patch things up between them?


Khadgar knows that a fight between the Alliance and the Horde, boosted up by the power of Azerite, is only going to spell doom to the already wounded planet of Azeroth. That healing the planet is more important than this never-ending war between the two factions. He's doing what any sensible person would do in this situation.

they could have made another new character to be the neutral savior of the universe. it didn't have to be khadgar. they could have kept him a hero of the alliance like that great statue in stormwind portrays him as. rather than making him yet another neutral character who turned his back against his faction in the name of helping to save the world! he could have help saved the world by being a hero of the alliance. not a hero of both. let another new, interesting character do that.

[Kyphael]

Not every character needs to be a warmonger to fit Blizzard's yo-yo writing, especially not the few that have been developed well (Khadgar and Magni.) Horde and alliance were just fighting in Pandaria, learned a valuable lesson from them, overthrew Garrosh, then defeated the Legion only to go back at each other's throats because reasons. It reminds me of the episode of Boy Meets World when Ben Savage broke the fourth wall.

"This story again!? How many times do I need to make the same mistake??? Tell me writers, how can I learn so much, and yet stay so stupid!?"

[gaymer77]

and led the alliance through the dark portal to end the horde threat.

It was the fel worshiping savage orcs not the Horde or the orcs of the Horde. If you want to throw shit out there, get it right.

[muffinss]

Not every character needs to be a warmonger to fit Blizzard's yo-yo writing, especially not the few that have been developed well (Khadgar and Magni.) Horde and alliance were just fighting in Pandaria, learned a valuable lesson from them, overthrew Garrosh, then defeated the Legion only to go back at each other's throats because reasons. It reminds me of the episode of Boy Meets World when Ben Savage broke the fourth wall.

"This story again!? How many times do I need to make the same mistake??? Tell me writers, how can I learn so much, and yet stay so stupid!?"

its world of warcraft. the factions should be against each other. if anything they have been overdoing the third+ factions and focusing less on the faction war. as i mentioned earlier, i liked how they did wrath in that regard with it being similar to a cold war with it being like a race of who was the better faction with skirmishes with each other while going after the third faction.

[extinction1337]

Its kind of stupid and only hurts how interesting each faction can be.

Honestly I kind of liked the 180 they did with Garrosh and being savage AF, likewise with how Jaina changed and basically wants to dismantle the horde.

These are sentiments me as a player can get behind and be interested.

[Ielenia]

they could have made another new character to be the neutral savior of the universe. it didn't have to be khadgar.

Considering Blizzard's track record in creating new characters? Nah, let it be Khadgar.

Jokes aside, Khadgar has, I believe, been one of the first characters to be neutral in this game. I mean, he's been neutral since TBC when he got re-introduced to us. And again, Khadgar has always been portrayed as intelligent and level-headed, and he knows that if the planet dies, any and all conflicts between the Alliance and the Horde would be, at best, meaningless, without a world to wage war on.

Someone needs to focus on healing the planet, and Khadgar is the best suited for this. There's no room to introduce a character powerful enough and knowledgeable enough and resourceful enough to fix the planet and not feel extremely shoe-horned in.

[muffinss]

It was the fel worshiping savage orcs not the Horde or the orcs of the Horde. If you want to throw shit out there, get it right.

who cares if it was demons or not? why does each faction have to be loved? like the faction you like. let them be different. let the factions be against each other. let them have differences than split them into two unique factions. let those differences collide. it doesn't matter if one was demon fel worshiping orcs and the other is not. it doesn't matter. its two different factions.

- - - Updated - - -

Considering Blizzard's track record in creating new characters? Nah, let it be Khadgar.

Jokes aside, Khadgar has, I believe, been one of the first characters to be neutral in this game. I mean, he's been neutral since TBC when he got re-introduced to us. And again, Khadgar has always been portrayed as intelligent and level-headed, and he knows that if the planet dies, any and all conflicts between the Alliance and the Horde would be, at best, meaningless, without a world to wage war on.

Someone needs to focus on healing the planet, and Khadgar is the best suited for this. There's no room to introduce a character powerful enough and knowledgeable enough and resourceful enough to fix the planet and not feel extremely shoe-horned in.

yeah and making him neutral in tbc was a bummer. i'm arguing he should never been neutral.

[Ielenia]

its world of warcraft. the factions should be against each other.

And they are. Especially in this expansion.

if anything they have been overdoing the third+ factions and focusing less on the faction war.

Kind of ironic considering this is a faction-war-based expansion...

as i mentioned earlier, i liked how they did wrath in that regard with it being similar to a cold war with it being like a race of who was the better faction with skirmishes with each other while going after the third faction.

I like to think (most) of our faction leaders realized that fighting one-another instead of the world-ending big baddie is very counter-productive.

[Kyphael]

its world of warcraft. the factions should be against each other. if anything they have been overdoing the third+ factions and focusing less on the faction war. as i mentioned earlier, i liked how they did wrath in that regard with it being similar to a cold war with it being like a race of who was the better faction with skirmishes with each other while going after the third faction.

One upping one another fighting a common threat is creative, see, but burning down Tendrassil and retaliating to try to get ruins smells of plot device. It's basically a war instigated by an insecure man-child and a greedy bitch, and it makes everyone else fighting it for those reasons look like complete idiots.

[Ielenia]

yeah and making him neutral in tbc was a bummer. i'm arguing he should never been neutral.

Why? Because he's Alliance? By that logic, no character should ever be neutral. And Azeroth would be nothing but a dead wasteland, bereft of all life, with nothing but undead animals and ghouls roaming around.