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  1. #401
    The Patient KingSapmi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lordrevangr View Post
    Yes, i'm pretty sure you "hate" to say it...
    Personally, I do hate to say it, and the fact that I agree with the OP. I want to see WoW flourish and grow back to how it was. Sadly, it seems to be moving in a different direction than what I personally want.
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  2. #402
    Quote Originally Posted by Blysto View Post
    Why are people always whining about thing like: Oh this expension does worse then WoD!!. For one get proof first, I am not saying that it does better then WoD, but unless you have proof, do not claim it does worse then WoD. And we'll have to see if the expension's really as bad as all you doomsayers claim it to be tbh. I quite like the look of the expension so far.
    The proof is there. Basically everything we know about BfA yet is proof enough.
    MAGA - Make Alliance Great Again

  3. #403
    I was talking about proof of legion doing worse then WoD

  4. #404
    Quote Originally Posted by Blysto View Post
    I was talking about proof of legion doing worse then WoD
    Ah, sorry.

    I think Legion is doing better than WoD though, just because it has a lot more to offer.
    MAGA - Make Alliance Great Again

  5. #405
    Quote Originally Posted by Mafic View Post
    So the entire crutch of this expansion relies on a trickle release of allied races to be leveled throughout the expansion by the remaining players.
    Makes you wonder when they will drop the tactical nuke with the Furry Vulpera label on it.
    Last edited by Cosmic Janitor; 2018-05-12 at 02:32 PM.

  6. #406
    This game is so dead ROFL what is blizzard doing

  7. #407
    Quote Originally Posted by Haidaes View Post
    Makes you wonder when they will drop the tactical nuke with the Furry Vulpera label on it.
    High Elves and Vulpera are definitely their aces up their sleeve haha.

  8. #408
    Deleted
    120 was a perfect opportunity to add a new powerful talent row, given how much we are losing with our artifacts and legendaries

    Idk abou everyone else but i love my boomkin sometimes shooting the spirit of goldrin, i love my mage stacks giving me a free avalanche (comet storm?), i love bloodlusting twice, i like my druid sometimes briefly becoming a tree when wild growthing, i love how prayer of healing is boosted after sanctify, how holy wording and casting a mending just before maximizes your hymn, i love how in the world i can aometimes get 4 infernals, how liadrins fury allows me to go even more mental during crusade ...

    And some things being baked into talents just means we have to choose it over somwthing else, like instant blizzard, that felt so damn good, but as a talent u either choose it and lose another talen or the other way around

    There are so many little interactions and small procs we are losing, unless most of it is replaced its gonna feel ao dull in comparison to legion
    Last edited by mmoc4b988bc479; 2018-05-12 at 02:56 PM.

  9. #409
    We all just want the same feeling we got when we started back in classic or BC. As the years has gone by it becomes harder and harder to relive up to those nostalgic memories we all have from back then.

  10. #410
    By focusing on things like allied races they're going to kill the game. You simply can't center an entire expansion around merely cosmetic features that most people just don't care about.

    It seems that they're aiming at padding their time-played metrics by making people spend lots of time leveling new characters, but I don't think they can get away with it this time.

  11. #411
    Quote Originally Posted by crusadernero View Post
    We all just want the same feeling we got when we started back in classic or BC. As the years has gone by it becomes harder and harder to relive up to those nostalgic memories we all have from back then.
    Living up to memories (In their "Forgotten the bad bits"-induced perfection) is impossible, but there's massive outcry about class changes (Yet more pruning, loss of artifact weapon), at least that should be addressed, if playing your character isn't fun, how can the game be fun?

  12. #412
    Quote Originally Posted by mysticx View Post
    Living up to memories (In their "Forgotten the bad bits"-induced perfection) is impossible, but there's massive outcry about class changes (Yet more pruning, loss of artifact weapon), at least that should be addressed, if playing your character isn't fun, how can the game be fun?
    We get to keep apperance from artifact weps. Whats so different this xpac from previous ones? Each xpac everything we have of gear becomes useless when new one ships out. Its not something new. It has always been like that.

    That people grind until theyre eyes bleed, yet knowing it will be "all for nothing" in next xpac, is theyre own damn fault.

  13. #413
    Quote Originally Posted by crusadernero View Post
    We all just want the same feeling we got when we started back in classic or BC. As the years has gone by it becomes harder and harder to relive up to those nostalgic memories we all have from back then.
    this had nothing to do with it at all.

  14. #414
    Quote Originally Posted by crusadernero View Post
    We get to keep apperance from artifact weps. Whats so different this xpac from previous ones? Each xpac everything we have of gear becomes useless when new one ships out. Its not something new. It has always been like that.

    That people grind until theyre eyes bleed, yet knowing it will be "all for nothing" in next xpac, is theyre own damn fault.
    They remove almost every kind of class progression you made in Legion. THAT'S the problem. Not that we lose the artifact weapons.
    MAGA - Make Alliance Great Again

  15. #415
    Quote Originally Posted by Accendor View Post
    this had nothing to do with it at all.
    Then what is it? Blizzard cant make a brand new game, its a xpac.

    wow was pretty shite during classic & BC but people relish that time now. People just hate change and love to look back on how it was before.

  16. #416
    My only issue with BFA is, they should allow one free race change per BFA account, to account for the fact that we are receiving 6 if not more new ally races to play with, beyond that I don't see any issues with the changes they're making, They have a lot of faith with the azerite system, so I'll withhold further judgement until we see those flushed out more than the little bits of leveling gear we've already seen.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nyel View Post
    They remove almost every kind of class progression you made in Legion. THAT'S the problem. Not that we lose the artifact weapons.
    They always remove previous progression you've made when a new expansion hits.
    Never underestimate the unknown, or some shit. *shrugs i unno*

  17. #417
    Quote Originally Posted by Nyel View Post
    They remove almost every kind of class progression you made in Legion. THAT'S the problem. Not that we lose the artifact weapons.
    I honestly feel Legion was suppose to be WoWs last expansion, but WOD was so bad that they had to fast track it and rewrite the story so that it didn't end WoW.

    I feel like Legion was probably always gonna be an expac, but not as soon as we saw it. I mean they could have done BfA and multiple others before Legion, and then officially ended WoW whenever that would be, but the game was such in a bad state they had to get people hyped for the next xpac, so they released Legion.
    Last edited by Azzurri; 2018-05-12 at 03:20 PM.

  18. #418
    Quote Originally Posted by Nyel View Post
    Yes, many of them are flat and passive buffs. Exactly what Azerite Armour is. Except the Azerite traits are even worse than what traits and Legendaries in Legion were adding to classes.
    I'm sorry, but a percentage increase is boring across the board. Neither set up is worse or better than another, and it doesn't matter which setup you use, they're the same. Doesn't matter if the 5% damage increase to Raptor Strike is from a trait, a leggo, or an Azerite trait, it's the same thing.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nyel View Post
    Just look at the passives we've already seen from the Azerite stuff. 9/10 are absolutely awful passives like "skill x increases haste by amount y". That's the worst kind of passives and one of the reasons why they removed talent trees years ago because they thought passives like that are adding nothing to the game. And now they're basing an entire system on those passives.
    Everything you just said here above is also equally true for our Artifact weapons. There is no point you make here that can't be easily applied to artifact weapons. Matter of fact, everything you just listed is why everyone was ragging on Legion before it was out of the beta.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nyel View Post
    My point is, they are taking away 3 major things (T-Sets, Legendaries, Artifacts) and give us 1 (Azerite). That's no fun. On top of that most classes / specs and their talent rows are almost unchanged (except some talents changed places). So you're not just going to play your already "worn out" Legion spec gameplay for two more years, no, you get ultra boring passives to compensate the loss of most of your class progression to "compensate" that. Who had this horrible idea? I mean seriously.
    You're hitting on three different subjects with this statement. The first one being the loss of artifacts, tier sets, and legendaries. We are meant to feel the loss of the artifacts. That was the whole point of them and of Legion. The whole theme of Legion was, Sargeras has returned and with him the Legion crashes upon our shores seeking to destroy us and everything we hold dear. In order to have any hope to repel the Legion we have to seek out fabled weapons of power to further empower us and give us the edge to push back against the Legion. We're suppose to feel weaker with the loss of the weapons, it's part of the narrative of the game going into BfA, and we've known from day 1 that we would only hold onto to them for Legion. Artifact weapons would be pointless if when we put them down we don't feel their loss, wielding them for this expansion is meant to be a memorable time for our characters and us the players. I'm never going to forget my Paladin wielding THE Ashbringer.

    Tier sets is surprising, but it makes sense. The passives on most of the tier sets have been pretty boring for a while now. The 2-piece and 4-piece bonuses aren't really anything special. These are all things that can easily be baked into Azerite gear without blinking an eye. It's not hard to imagine a heroic raiding geared player picking tier armor-esque bonuses on his gear. The same could be said of legendary bonuses from Legion. Keep in mind, the bonuses on our Azerite armor are suppose to improve and get more enticing as we level the HoA.

    The minor changes to the Legion style of specs was a very intentional decision by Blizzard. Their biggest complaint from returning players who took a leave of absence for any considerable amount of time was that their specs and play styles were radically different from when they left. On top of that, the more regular players were getting really frustrated having to learn a new spec with every expansion. So Blizzard made the massive class over-haul and changes that came with Legion with the express intention of not having to do such broad and sweeping changes again for a significant period of time. Of course, a few specs (demo, survival) fell short of this goal and so they're getting another rework with BfA in another attempt to get it right. With those changes though, they were also really able to hone in on class and spec fantasy. Subsequently, because of those changes and how well they were tidied up we were able to get a whole new class like Demon Hunter and it didn't end up feeling too much like Rogue, DK, or Warlock. Honestly, as someone who has played all the specs (12 alts at cap, 12 more in the 90-110 range) with a considerable amount of time behind a lot of the specs, most of the specs are fine to keep. Wish they'd get BrM right, but whatever, I don't main a Monk anyways.

    The last thing you're hitting on is something Blizzard has been struggling with for a long period of time. How do you make players feel more powerful as they level? Traditionally the answer has been to give the players a new talent point. Vanilla through Wrath we saw the talent trees and got a new tier for our talent trees every expansion. The problem was that class balance was becoming a nightmare and Blizzard couldn't do a proper job of it. With Cata we saw them hack the trees in half and then you still had to hit 31 points(I can't remember if this was the exact number) in a single tree before you could dump your last few points into another tree. MoP came in and we saw them just outright replace the talent system with the one we use today. Problem was, even just one expansion later during WoD, the new talent trees were running into the same problem. They were bloating again. With Legion we saw a real answer to the problem, something disposable, artifacts. The only problem with artifacts is that you can't keep them because they'll bloat horribly like the old talent trees did and on top of that you have to replace them with something new (Heart of Azeroth) the next expansion.

    WoW isn't the only MMO to have this problem though, and not by a long shot. Rift introduced the nightmarish system known as Planar Attunement which has close to 2000 levels for players to earn after they hit level 50 (cap is currently 70 iirc) and the vast majority of the bonuses you gain from their system is just flat buffs to stats. ESO introduced the Champion System which worked relatively well with their class system for different builds. GW2 introduced a proficiency system that basically gives your character the ability to wield new weapons and skills to accompany the weapons.

    Your concerns about the Azerite system aren't unfounded. Done improperly, it can be a huge disappointment and players will feel as if their characters have been robbed of power. However, done properly it will be a good substitute for the three systems you've mentioned. Again, we're just going to have to give it time and give feedback as more of the system is rolled out. Blizzard won't just inject this system into the game and then never touch it again.

    All that to be said, WoW is more than just once very specific mechanic or system. If that's the biggest problem in BfA then the expansion is going to be great.

  19. #419
    Quote Originally Posted by Lawlhero View Post
    They always remove previous progression you've made when a new expansion hits.
    That comes with major class overhauls were previous class progression is baked into the baseline spec. They are doing this in BfA as well with some (not all) specs but at the cost of removing talents and pruning other abilities. So you end up with less stuff overall than you started with in Legion.
    MAGA - Make Alliance Great Again

  20. #420
    Quote Originally Posted by Azzurri View Post
    I honestly feel Legion was suppose to be WoWs last expansion, but WOD was so bad that they had to fast track it and rewrite the story so that it didn't end WoW.
    And your feelings would be wrong.

    No, Legion was not supposed to be the last expansion, nor is BfA, nor the one coming next, or the one after that...
    They've literally said that as long as people keep playing, they'll keep making expansions. The game is more profitable than ever, the team is bigger than ever etc etc.

    And let's be real here, EVERY SINGLE ONE of the loudest Negative Nancies on these forums, are still going to buy and play the expansion. That's the sort of hold that this game manages to have on people, even 14 years later.

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