I'm sorry to say it, but leaving us 6 months in the dark is completely unacceptable..

[Chaelexi]

I have never seen anything saying they did not want to run 2 client software suites. For a company that apparently feels "You think you do but you don't" I cannot imagine them going to the trouble to re-code the entire game from back then.

Instead.. I see them working to integrate the existing code to work with existing infrastructure and doing as little as possible. It makes sense as well when you consider the very few jobs they posted and filled... like 5 or 6... all infrastructure guys/gals.

If you have a source that says otherwise, I shure would appreciate a link... I certainly don't mind becoming more informed.

As for your using the old software and making edits, that is a significantly larger undertaking then editing the current software you have to make calls to a new portion of an updated database. Not to mention the fact they would have to update the old software to current best practices on the security and BNET fronts. And if there is a security issue with the software they will only have to make one update.

Quote from Brack https://www.forbes.com/sites/hnewman.../#ec5c9e951344
Newman: What are some of the other decision-making challenges you’re facing for the classic servers?

Brack: I think we want to make sure that it’s very maintainable. I think the challenge of us being able to resurrect classic WoW in its original form is—it has a certain amount of complexity. But that game was very difficult to manage. It would be effectively like us managing two MMOs, which is not something we want to do.

Here you go, they explicitly say they do not want to manage 2 MMO's.

- - - Updated - - -

We must agree to disagree then. As far as I am concerned... a single database programmer can write code to pull data from one version of a database, and save it to another. It truly is as easy as that. It's done every day when a company switches technologies. I mean, it's not as easy as clicking "Save as"... but it is pretty damn easy.

When switching technologies most of the time the new company is involved and builds(or already has built) a migration tool for you to use. But since this is a 15+ year old Oracle DB. Brack said himself that Oracle is not lining up to help him with his old DB. The other issue is that they already have a current version Built Oracle DB for live WoW that they will have to convert the details from the old DB into. It is a huge under taking.

[Deleted]

You haven't invested in the classic project in anyway, blizzard are not obligated to tell you anything.

You haven't donated, you haven't provided any data, labour or anything thus blizzard don't have to tell you shit.

Just do something else with your time and wait like everyone else.

[Maudib]

This is my issue with his posts, they flip flop and change because he truly doesn't know the architecture of either build of the game... He pretends to know it, and plays it off as if he's educated in the knowledge of both the technology and in the business model, which he is very much neither.

It's sad that he even chants that he's "An Expert" and "can hack into the original game" but literally knows nothing about the process or that even the ability to do that is security vulnerability for the original game... It's just pathetic.

I haven't flip flopped on the database... they will use the original database. People claimed they had to rebuild the database from scratch. They don't and won't. They said they already have, months ago, the old client working on current tech... so I believe they have already converted the database. It's still the same database... just imported into the newer format.

I believe they did this before announcing to make sure it was feasible... and found it was. Everything has a cost associated with it. Blizz doesn't think this will be very popular... so therefore the cost associated with bringing to market has to be pretty low. That can't happen if they are building this from scratch... or rebuilding it in the current client.

I said I have a degree in IT... with a wide variety of coursework including programming in response to someone saying I must not have a clue about programming. I never said I was an expert in anything (although I may very well be... claims on the internet are just that).

I said I dabbled with my own private server as an educational experience... I never said I hacked the game.

And people try and claim that "I" am the one stating falsehoods or trying to troll... lol.

I may very well be wrong... but I believe that the vast majority of Classic will be the reused from Vanilla... and only changes relating to infrastructure will be made. Server calls, battle.net launcher stuff, etc.

If that incites people.. I'm sorry... it's what I believe and I have a right to that opinion. As far as Live? I don't like it at all. Well, I love the artwork and zone designs... but I really don;t care for the mechanisms the game now focuses on. Again... if that hurts anyone's feeling... I really don't care.

[Queen of Hamsters]

You must not be old enough to remember Starcraft Ghost

32 years old. Nice try though.

[Akka]

What do you want, "we're working on it"

like...what is there to announce?

=>

there IS a number of news which are pretty relevant to the project and could be shared, and which have precisely been the subject of much "debates" around here. Specifically, the form that Classic will take :

- Customized modern client, modernized old client, a brand new client ?
- Which changes are planned (or if none are) ?
- Which version will Classic be based upon ? Will it progress through historical patches or start and stay at a defined "final" one ?
- Which parts of the restricted design/bugs will be fixed/modified and which ones are considered to be integral part to the game ?
- Is there an answer about the subscription method ?

And so on. There is LOTS of potential news that can be given, and some are about the core concepts of development, so things which kind of need to be known by now (like which kind of client they will use).

You're welcome.

- - - Updated - - -

I believe you'd see much less "anger" around if people like you weren't making such blatantly inflammatory posts with the obvious intention of baiting others to get 'angry'. And before you say anything, by "people like you", I mean people on both sides of the fence that like to that, often "for funsies".

Considering how you spent half your time on MMOC shitting on Vanilla, I find it funny you try to give lessons that should first and foremost be applied to yourself, and in a forum you have absolutely no reason to read and all reasons to avoid on top of that.
Irony, irony, irony.

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You call it hate i call it people that use their brain and speak logicly while staying neutral.

As above : if you spend your time on a forum dedicated to a game which you despise, you're probably ill-placed to try to give lessons about being logical and neutral

[Vestig3]

As above : if you spend your time on a forum dedicated to a game which you despise, you're probably ill-placed to try to give lessons about being logical and neutral

But where did you ever see me write that i despise WoW in any forms? still doesnt stop me from injecting people with some logic.

[Ielenia]

Considering how you spent half your time on MMOC shitting on Vanilla, I find it funny you try to give lessons that should first and foremost be applied to yourself, and in a forum you have absolutely no reason to read and all reasons to avoid on top of that.
Irony, irony, irony.

I don't think I ever openly insulted people who want classic wow, like calling them "addicts who just can't quit". Nor have I ever made such wild statements like "classic will be dead in the water", or "max active accounts number on classic won't ever get past two digits".

[Maudib]

Here you go, they explicitly say they do not want to manage 2 MMO's.

I have read that article several times... including again just now and I guess we interpret this differently.

Brack: It was internal discussions, and it was kind of a thought about how we can move forward technically in a way that is not us managing two MMOs. And so—the thing that we’re going to try to do is to run the classic WoW on what we think of as the modern WoW infrastructure. That’s completely transparent to the user. The user doesn’t see how the server’s organized. The user doesn’t see how the database works. But that’s a huge part of the—of how we think we can actually do this now.

The important part of this comment is this: "the thing that we’re going to try to do is to run the classic WoW on what we think of as the modern WoW infrastructure."

Managing two MMOs means setting up entirely different infrastructure for both versions. They want to run the classic WOW on existing technology. In fact in a video interview (I believe it was) it is stated that they actually had an initial implementation running... working... so that let them knew it was possible.

The thing to remember is, Classic data does not have room for future development... it's future dev is already known. A constant. It's already been done for many years. They simply have to get it to run on current tech... and yes perhaps make certain changes to allow for modern security practices.. but that is modular... If Classic was written in a non-object oriented language from way back when I would say otherwise... but taking the procedures and classes that are related to server calls and updating them are essentially global changes.

Think about it. If Classic required more of a development team... they would have posted more positions than the handful they did.

I truly think Classic is farther along than anyone thinks... and people will be surprised when it's announced. If not... then noone will be surprised... or hurt in any way by my theory.

[Chaelexi]

I have read that article several times... including again just now and I guess we interpret this differently.



The important part of this comment is this: "the thing that we’re going to try to do is to run the classic WoW on what we think of as the modern WoW infrastructure."

Managing two MMOs means setting up entirely different infrastructure for both versions. They want to run the classic WOW on existing technology. In fact in a video interview (I believe it was) it is stated that they actually had an initial implementation running... working... so that let them knew it was possible.

The thing to remember is, Classic data does not have room for future development... it's future dev is already known. A constant. It's already been done for many years. They simply have to get it to run on current tech... and yes perhaps make certain changes to allow for modern security practices.. but that is modular... If Classic was written in a non-object oriented language from way back when I would say otherwise... but taking the procedures and classes that are related to server calls and updating them are essentially global changes.

Think about it. If Classic required more of a development team... they would have posted more positions than the handful they did.

I truly think Classic is farther along than anyone thinks... and people will be surprised when it's announced. If not... then noone will be surprised... or hurt in any way by my theory.

The other big thing you are missing is them moving it into the multicore, 64 bit architecture of modern CPU's to allow for modern application packaging and limiting the access to botting software code injection, better security algorithms and more Ram in general.

[Akka]

But where did you ever see me write that i despise WoW in any forms? still doesnt stop me from injecting people with some logic.

Your very sig is already a pretty nice indicator. The fact you refer to it seriously in a post barely two pages ago means it's not ironic.
Are you suffering from dissociative personality disorder or are you just playing coy ?

I don't think I ever openly insulted people who want classic wow, like calling them "addicts who just can't quit". Nor have I ever made such wild statements like "classic will be dead in the water", or "max active accounts number on classic won't ever get past two digits".

You definitely made "inflamatory" posts by basically telling people they didn't know what they liked and that Vanilla was shit, and yet you come on a forum dedicated to Classic to continue trolling. Even without explicit insults, that's just shitposting and trying to raise a stir. If you just disliked Vanilla without attempting to troll, you would simply not bother coming here and keep to BfA and Legion forums. Yet here you are, trying to teach a wisdom you never had.

[Maudib]

The other big thing you are missing is them moving it into the multicore, 64 bit architecture of modern CPU's to allow for modern application packaging and limiting the access to botting software code injection, better security algorithms and more Ram in general.

I don't think they are concerned very much with those topics. Current hardware runs the client far better now than originally.. and because the old client doesn't have the higher polygon counts, fancy water, effects, etc... it doesn't really need to take advantage of 64bit tech.

I'm willing to bet the botting/anti-cheat software is run outside of WoW completely... what they have in place may very well serve Classic WoW with litttle to no effort.

[Ielenia]

You definitely made "inflamatory" posts by basically telling people they didn't know what they liked and that Vanilla was shit

I have? Care to give an example or two?

and yet you come on a forum dedicated to Classic to continue trolling.

Newsflash: not agreeing with you is not trolling.

Even without explicit insults, that's just shitposting and trying to raise a stir. If you just disliked Vanilla without attempting to troll, you would simply not bother coming here and keep to BfA and Legion forums.

Last I checked, this is a forum for discussions, not an echo-chamber. You're acting as if I'm not allowed to post in threads where I don't agree with the subject of discussion.

Several times you accused me of trolling in this post alone. Why not show up some evidence of me 'trolling' in a Classic WoW thread?

[Chaelexi]

I don't think they are concerned very much with those topics. Current hardware runs the client far better now than originally.. and because the old client doesn't have the higher polygon counts, fancy water, effects, etc... it doesn't really need to take advantage of 64bit tech.

I'm willing to bet the botting/anti-cheat software is run outside of WoW completely... what they have in place may very well serve Classic WoW with litttle to no effort.

You "think", but provide no actual facts why they would not future proof the software in the build phase by developing it to use 64-bit tech from the start. Also if they do build it on the current client it provides them with the frame work to launch an expansion version of WoW if they wish to. Do you understand how they are packaging the software currently, the current wrapper they are using and how it is encrypted and it limits botting and if there is botting it is very easily caught now. Why would you not incorporate this into a new development release? They have already put it in Diablo, HoTS and WoW(not sure about Overwatch but would not doubt it is there as well).

[Predicting]

Yeah hopefully they post something soon. I cannot wait to play classic!

[Vestig3]

Your very sig is already a pretty nice indicator. The fact you refer to it seriously in a post barely two pages ago means it's not ironic.
Are you suffering from dissociative personality disorder or are you just playing coy ?

There is a difference between saying something is bad and despising something and my signature line is just a fact no matter how you look at it, did i enjoy heck out of vanilla? i damn sure did and besides TBC it was prob my happiest time but gameplay wise looking back and what we have had over the past 13 years yes it realy was bad, the game was slow/buggy and very grindy

Still doesnt stop me from putting some logic in people's heads coz i have experienced vanilla coz i can talk about how it was and what people can expect, there are shitloads of people in this thread that havent got the slightest clue what vanilla was like.

Sorry that it rains on your parade but your one of many in this thread and maybe you did play in vanilla or maybe you didnt but my comments are mainly focused at those that didnt.

Except for a certain person in this thread that keeps talking about vanilla like he has played it while he didnt, you cannot speak about something like you know how it went if you have not experienced it.

[rda]

You "think", but provide no actual facts why they would not future proof the software in the build phase by developing it to use 64-bit tech from the start. Also if they do build it on the current client it provides them with the frame work to launch an expansion version of WoW if they wish to. Do you understand how they are packaging the software currently, the current wrapper they are using and how it is encrypted and it limits botting and if there is botting it is very easily caught now. Why would you not incorporate this into a new development release? They have already put it in Diablo, HoTS and WoW(not sure about Overwatch but would not doubt it is there as well).

They likely will just have a wrapper for the original client and a wrapper for the original server. These wrappers will talk with each other / authenticate / use updates and other bnet services. That's called "adapting to current infrastructure".

Why? Because it's easier than adjusting old code. And because you don't need much knowledge of the old code to do the new one, you only need a general idea of what happens and the specifics for communication. That would explain why the new team can suddenly do it and why the old team is not being taxed seriously.

[adamzz]

November, December, January, February, March, April...and soon May.

Yup that's how long we've been waiting for news concerning vanilla wow, and you know what? It's just not something a company usually does:

-Only a few updates here and there to reassure us concerning the progress? Sure, that's fine
-A few hints from them here and there to tell us that we're not being forgotten? Sure, that's also fine
-Absolutely 0 official news about something that hundreds of thousands, if not milions of people, are waiting for? That's just not fucking acceptable.

You don't announce a video game to let people in the dark for so long guys, I can already see some of you jumping at me :"They don't owe you shit" ,"it'll be ready when it's ready", "be patient", "there's no news that's it", but it's bullshit: after half a year, there's bound to be some progress.

Not to mention that they were supposed to communicate with us, to ask us what we really want when it comes to vanilla.

I'm very disappointed by the complete lack of feedback, and I know that a lot of people are in the same boat: this doesn't sound good at all so far.

So the interview with Brack and Allen about Classic didn't happen? And the Q&A Ion did a couple of months ago where he said that they have finished hiring all the people that will be the Classic team didn't happen either?

Face the facts, Blizzard has given us updates you just choose to ignore them... Stop crying, they are working on it.

[Maudib]

You "think", but provide no actual facts why they would not future proof the software in the build phase by developing it to use 64-bit tech from the start. Also if they do build it on the current client it provides them with the frame work to launch an expansion version of WoW if they wish to. Do you understand how they are packaging the software currently, the current wrapper they are using and how it is encrypted and it limits botting and if there is botting it is very easily caught now. Why would you not incorporate this into a new development release? They have already put it in Diablo, HoTS and WoW(not sure about Overwatch but would not doubt it is there as well).

I think that's the difference between our posts... I am saying that I "think" and I "believe"... I never said "I know"... your posts are the ones seemingly stating things that Blizzard ARE doing without actually knowing that.

Even the few "facts" we know are based on interviews/articles... much of which are up to interpretation. Just like the one you quoted me that clearly stated they are "trying to run the classic wow on modern infrastructure". How can that mean anything but running old code on new infrastructure? even the choice of the word "the" in "the classic WoW" identifies using old code.

If they were redoing WoW completely... that would not be a statement that made sense... essentially... "We are trying to run new code on new infrastruture"???

But I will admit that people can, however far stretched, read other things into what was said.

[Jinbo]

News at blizzcon

[Vestig3]

There will prob be some minor news, people should not expect them to come out big with gunz blazing at the upcoming blizzcon, the first time they will prob come out big is at Gamescom or Blizzcon 2019.