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  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Hey There Guys its Metro View Post
    That already happens on private servers. No one would take a resto druid to a dungeon because they have no rez.
    People reserve gear and expect to simply over gear the situations instead of handle then normally.

    The way people play classic today is not how it was played 14 years ago. Gonna be a lot of disappointed people.
    This is probably going to be too true and sad.

    The problem is that the game is go go go and has been for a long time. People aren't going to revert to 14 years prior when most of the people A- never played or B- have been playing and don't have the time to mess around.

    I'm going to just be flexible and enjoy the leveling and dungeon content. No need to speed through anything when it probably won't be going anywhere anytime soon.

    As for the OP, just play what you want and if you and have dedication to your class, I believe you'll be able to find a raid spot.

  2. #22
    Most viable race in a PVE raid setting in parenthesis, if any.

    3 protection warriors (human,dwarf,night elf / tauren, undead)
    DPS:
    6 Fury warriors (orc/human)
    6 Rogues (orc/human)
    7 mages (Gnome)
    3 warlocks (gnome)
    3 hunters (night elf/orc,troll)

    Healers horde:
    8 shamans
    3 priests
    1 druid

    Healers Alliance:
    5 paladins
    5 priests (dwarf)
    1 druid

    This is a decent mindset to have entering guild creation and recruitment. But, do keep some things in mind.
    1. The Alliance only has access to nature resistance aura through hunters, whereas horde has them on Shamans. Further more, Horde hunters suffer greatly from the lack of kings that Alliance hunters have. You could feasibly bring as few as 2 hunters on horde side in favor of more mages and warlocks, whereas the Alliance may want to bring as many as 4 hunters.

    2. The balance of Warlocks and Mages largely depend on faction. Since Mages has lower threat output to damage output, Horde will want to bring only the minimum three warlocks to apply the necessary debuffs, but you can bring as few as 2 warlocks and simply not use the curse of shadows debuff. Alliance can opt to bring 6 warlocks and a shadow priest to increase shadow damage, then tune back the amount of mages. Simply due to blessing of Salvation, which reduce threat output by 30%.

    3. Rogues and Fury warriors deal by far the best damage in Molten Core and Blackwing Lair. In AQ40 and Naxxramas, they continue to deal the most damage, but the difference is not as massive at this point. The main reason you don't bring more is largely due to gearing issues, as you can't really find all these one handed weapons for all your melee.

    4. The power of Dwarf priests cannot be overstated. The spell ''Fear ward'' is the only spell which can be applied on the tank BEFORE fear effects, allowing the Alliance to completely ignore certain raid mechanics.

    5. Alliance has a significant edge on the horde, mainly by use of two spells. Blessing of salvation and the previously mentioned fear ward. Blessing of salvation reduces the threat output by affected party/raid members by 30%. Which is huge in vanilla wow. Paladins also giving the tanks blessing of might which gives some 180-190 attack power and bonus 10% agility, strength and stamina helps allot as well. Further more, Human protection warriors have bonus to sword and mace skill. Boosting the threat output even further when using weapons such as Ironfoe, Quel'serrar and Thunderfury. There are few viable axe tanking weapons which an orc would pick.

    There can be no doubt that the Alliance, has a significant edge on the horde in terms of PVE. Windfury totem is the big Horde buff, but this helps little when using it causes the melee DPS to grab aggro.

    Last note, the game is not particularly difficult. The player is valued far higher than the class.
    Last edited by MMKing; 2018-05-21 at 03:52 PM.
    Patch 1.12, and not one step further!

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by MMKing View Post
    3. Rogues and Fury warriors deal by far the best damage in Molten Core and Blackwing Lair. In AQ40 and Naxxramas, they continue to deal the most damage, but the difference is not as massive at this point. The main reason you don't bring more is largely due to gearing issues, as you can't really find all these one handed weapons for all your melee.
    Fury warriors are best with 2handers and imp slam, and the difference keeps on getting bigger and bigger with gear. In late AQ and into Naxx, they are doing twice the dps of most other specs, even rogues and mages. With the massive buff to shield slam in 1.12, threat isnt going to be much of an issue either if they stick with that patch.

  4. #24
    Old God Soon-TM's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hansol333 View Post
    Which classes will have it easier to find a raid spot. OP classes with high competition or not so op classes with lower competition?
    Roll (prot) warr or any healer -preferrably priest-, and you will have a guaranteed raid slot. However, if all you want is to DPS, roll an actual DPS class (rogue, mage, hunter or warlock). I'd advise against fury warr since there will be 2309274591546432 of those.

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Soon-TM View Post
    Roll (prot) warr or any healer -preferrably priest-, and you will have a guaranteed raid slot. However, if all you want is to DPS, roll an actual DPS class (rogue, mage, hunter or warlock). I'd advise against fury warr since there will be 2309274591546432 of those.
    Roll a 2hand fury warrior with imp demo shout and Nightfall, most wanted dps'er in the raid :P

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Soon-TM View Post
    Roll (prot) warr or any healer -preferrably priest-, and you will have a guaranteed raid slot. However, if all you want is to DPS, roll an actual DPS class (rogue, mage, hunter or warlock). I'd advise against fury warr since there will be 2309274591546432 of those.
    Pretty Much this!! Though I'd advise against rogue, it's population seems to start heavy, then gets trimmed back.

  7. #27
    Bloodsail Admiral Kanariya's Avatar
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    Warlocks are generally one of the least played classes in game and thus will be in constant demand for both their damage and utility. Their DPS is quite overlooked because a lot of them spec'd very poorly (read: not DS/Ruin or SM/Ruin) for threat issues, due to most people playing tanks back then were completely clueless about generating threat (you can see this by how many dumbass Prot Warriors used Crusader as their enchant). Warlocks deal quite a lot of DPS though when they spec right and have competent tanks, which Classic will have. And of course their utility is entirely unique.

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by MMKing View Post
    Most viable race in a PVE raid setting in parenthesis, if any.

    3 protection warriors (human,dwarf,night elf / tauren, undead)
    DPS:
    6 Fury warriors (orc/human)
    6 Rogues (orc/human)
    7 mages (Gnome)
    3 warlocks (gnome)
    3 hunters (night elf/orc,troll)

    Healers horde:
    8 shamans
    3 priests
    1 druid

    Healers Alliance:
    5 paladins
    5 priests (dwarf)
    1 druid
    Might want to check your math again. Seem to be one short on the alliance side

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Kanariya View Post
    Warlocks are generally one of the least played classes in game and thus will be in constant demand for both their damage and utility. Their DPS is quite overlooked because a lot of them spec'd very poorly (read: not DS/Ruin or SM/Ruin) for threat issues, due to most people playing tanks back then were completely clueless about generating threat (you can see this by how many dumbass Prot Warriors used Crusader as their enchant). Warlocks deal quite a lot of DPS though when they spec right and have competent tanks, which Classic will have. And of course their utility is entirely unique.
    You just have to negotiate with healers on making sure you got actual heals and didn't have to drain back to full, as was the intended rotation for locks back in vanilla. If you have to drain to full your dps starts to drop heavily, as the healing from drain life was pretty piss poor, and the mana you got from life tap was 1:1 unless you got improved life tap.

    I really, really hope they don't do just actual vanilla for "classic". I'm desperately hoping that raid buff spells are trainable and not world drops, and I hope that mage tables, soul wells and summoning rituals exist at level 60. Those were huge quality of life improvements added in BC because they were such huge time sinks that existed because no one thought of the idea when vanilla was in development. I remember locks in our raids through vanilla had bank alts that held anything that wasn't soul bound for their characters because all bags except the backpack were soul bags, and nearly all bank bags were soul bags, so they could start a raid with a few hundred soul shards. I remember mages did the same thing, but with mage food, they'd log in a half hour sooner than they'd need to for any other kind of raid prep, and just sit there with a brick down on the conjure water (rank 6 I think) button.



    On topic though, most on demand classes in vanilla will be what they were in the past, warriors and priests. Specifically holy priests and prot warriors. Both of which will have some of the most boring game play in just about every situation. Priests will spam rank 4 heal once every 7 seconds and prot warriors will spam sunder armor. Vanilla had some very interesting ideas, but pve was very broken, and just barely held together.
    What are you willing to sacrifice?

  10. #30
    Most will be saying 'play a healer or tank'. And there is certainly some credit to that, and they are not "wrong". Some will pick certain 'op' classes/specs and say 'play them, always in demand'.

    Truth is, it doesn't matter, at all. But rather than being Mr negative, i will try and put a positive spin on things instead. So what WILL be valued?
    note - these values havnt changed at all really, if you are still raiding high lvl content, M+, or PvP.

    - Relevant skill level required for the content - whether thats cutting edge world firsts, or farm content 6 months later, its still important that you match the guilds overall skill level. Most read this as "oh you mean am i good enough?", but in my experience, it just as often means "am i too good for the rest of you?". For some, they are fine with carrying the dps, but for many, this becomes very boring very fast, and the relationship sours and ends. I have actually asked a raider to find another guild purely because he made the rest of the team feel uncomfortable and awkward. He was one of the better players for sure, and his ability was never in question, but he just didn't.....fit.....always talking others down.

    - Do i show initiative and keep up to date with my classes upcoming changes? Time for some specific examples here. Explaining to a warlock that SoulStone doesn't work the same anymore 7 months after the changes would not be acceptable in a cutting edge raid group, but for the more casual of us, it was a real world situation that was encountered time and time again. All the way up to the END of the NEXT expansion. "lock, brez that tank please" - Cant bro - its on the healer

    - Reliability - not just ME, but also my computer, and internet connection. Shit happens. it happens to the best of us - progression boss, best attempt all night, 5%, 20/20 alive and BOOM. Tank DC's. It happens. But it shouldn't happen to the same person night after night, time after time. Raid leaders put up with a fair bit of shit from all angles, and put a fair bit of energy into forming a successful raid group. The least raiders can do is be reliable, turn up, and play on a machine that is suitable

    - Do i fit in? - This one is far less of an issue in 40man raiding. You blend in much easier, but it still can be an issue. If you are a 18yo male who is edgy as fuck and likes to impress everyone with you're ability to use the term 'Cuck' in any situation, you may find yourself a little unwanted in a guild full of 36yo adults with husbands and wives and jobs and lives. Im not saying every 18yo is a little twerp, and im not saying every 36yo is a mature model member of society, but its a fair call most of the time.

    In my experience, if you tick most of those boxes, can play at the right skill level, learn and understand the fights and your class, come prepared with consumables etc, are reliable, and generally fit in with the group, youll always be welcome in any guild group, regardless of the class you play.

  11. #31
    The Lightbringer Lollis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by K8Healer View Post
    PS at -Kueson

    LMAO, Rogues?!!?
    You want to bring a Rogue no one can take aggro from?
    When it was new, some people didn't know better, but now...
    Um, what?

    Thunderfury yes, it is a tank weapon 100%, but we still had Vanish & Feint as rogues plus Alliance had blessing of salvation. If your rogues were overaggroing lots either they were bad, or your tank was.

    OT.

    If you roll a Dwarf Priest, you will get a guild.
    Last edited by Lollis; 2018-05-22 at 04:26 AM.
    Speciation Is Gradual

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Sastank View Post
    Prot warrior
    and the vending machine.
    Disarm now correctly removes the targets’ arms.

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Lollis View Post
    Um, what?

    Thunderfury yes, it is a tank weapon 100%, but we still had Vanish & Feint as rogues. If your rogues were overaggroing lots either they were bad, or your tank was.
    False assumption, both options are wrong. Our rogues never had aggro problems....

    b/c we weren't insane enough to give one a Thunderfury!!

    But, your Dwarf Priest assumption, is spot on =)
    Last edited by K8Healer; 2018-05-22 at 05:05 AM. Reason: spelling

  14. #34
    Honestly the best answer is going to be "depends on the server community and population." I play on a vanilla server that surprised me when I started to get into it... DPS was in high demand. I likened it to my friend, who I got to play as well, that the community itself was too knowledgeable, and everyone rolled a class that was in high demand, namely Warrior Tank or Priest. So quality DPS was hard to come by and pretty much any and all DPS was desired, even classes that were generally limited in raids like Warlock.

    Remember there are 40 spots in the raid, and only ~10 of them are going to be tank/healer. DPS will be in demand as long as you aren't awful or you are playing a class/build that brings absolutely no decent damage or utility into the raid.

    Unfortunately, unless Blizz alters something, Warrior tank will likely be the only cutting edge raid tank. But cases are easily made for more than priest heals.

  15. #35
    warriors, rogues, priest shamans and mages. those were indispensable raiding.
    can't wait for the newwarlocksfags finding out how rough were things back then

  16. #36
    Mechagnome Storfan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grimreaper View Post
    Roll a 2hand fury warrior with imp demo shout and Nightfall, most wanted dps'er in the raid :P
    Nightfall on a fury warrior LOL. That's a waste of a good DPSer. You should have Nightfall+annihilator axe on offtanks.

    Quote Originally Posted by McFuu View Post
    Honestly the best answer is going to be "depends on the server community and population." I play on a vanilla server that surprised me when I started to get into it... DPS was in high demand. I likened it to my friend, who I got to play as well, that the community itself was too knowledgeable, and everyone rolled a class that was in high demand, namely Warrior Tank or Priest. So quality DPS was hard to come by and pretty much any and all DPS was desired, even classes that were generally limited in raids like Warlock.

    Remember there are 40 spots in the raid, and only ~10 of them are going to be tank/healer. DPS will be in demand as long as you aren't awful or you are playing a class/build that brings absolutely no decent damage or utility into the raid.

    Unfortunately, unless Blizz alters something, Warrior tank will likely be the only cutting edge raid tank. But cases are easily made for more than priest heals.
    Make that 3-4 tanks and 10-15 healers depending on content. That leaves 20-25 dps.
    “Listen... Strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government. Supreme executive power derives from a mandate from the masses, not from some farcical aquatic ceremony.” – Dennis

  17. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Storfan View Post
    Nightfall on a fury warrior LOL. That's a waste of a good DPSer. You should have Nightfall+annihilator axe on offtanks.

    Make that 3-4 tanks and 10-15 healers depending on content. That leaves 20-25 dps.
    Lmao, Nightfall. Thanks for bringing that up. I had totally forgotten about that thing. Interesting and strange items like that are what made classic so cool.

  18. #38
    While warrior tanks are always in high demand, unless you already have a group/guild ready I wouldnt roll one. A lot of guilds put emphasis on who the MT/OTs are as if they leave or stop playing at any point progress is massively halted.

    Just roll "flavor of the vanilla" classes like rogues, mages, dwarf priests, shamans and you will have a great experience. I was part of 2 raid groups on my main and alt, and dont recall running under 5 mages and 5 rogues in any group. The target of most progression groups will be aq40/naxx which means you need to have your mages, rogues and warriors ready.

  19. #39
    Number one are healers by a huge margin. Especially Dwarf Priests on alliance side.

    Locks wont be in demand past the 1-2 minimum u need for curses/summons until they actually get some hit gear in ZG. Lock dps is dogshit with low spell damage/hit.

  20. #40
    all of them because none of you are going to be playing this crap after a month
    No sense crying over spilt beer, unless you're drunk...

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