Battle for Azeroth Alpha/Beta General Discussion

[tristannarutofan]

She was infected by the PC/SJW trend happening in society. Back then the wave wasn't really a prevalent and cancerous movement if any, would explain why she's gone from awesome book lore to watered down PC/SJW crap.

oh man when you become an adult comments like these are going to be really embarrassing!

[Venziir]

she was infected by the pc/sjw trend happening in society. Back then the wave wasn't really a prevalent and cancerous movement if any, would explain why she's gone from awesome book lore to watered down pc/sjw crap.

................................ "Back in muh day!"

[tristannarutofan]

By the way, from another thread: there is a piece on wowhead about the new missions table and it looks like followers are now shared between classes. Ie, a paladin is going to have the same followers as a priest and the same followers as a hunter. I agree that this is a minor detail, but I find it characteristic of BFA. It's never more, it's always less.

And as another by the way, I have already been seeing the sentiment that "ok, launch will perhaps be a bit bad, but they will fix it in patches". The cycle of "it's not even alpha" - "it's just alpha" - "it's just beta" - "it's just launch" (you are here) - "it's just the first patch" - "it's just the second patch" - "it's just the end of an expansion, it's going to be great in the next expansion" is unbreakable.

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One last thing, I have been seeing this theme that WoW expansions seemingly go in cycles: one good - one bad - one good - one bad, and so it is time for BFA to be bad and the expansion after it is going to be good. I will submit that these cycles are predominantly perception, they are claimed to exist in many other places (like with Windows versions) and on a closer look they mostly break, they miscount and mischaracterize by putting uneven demands onto what they are comparing. In the case of WoW there are no two different teams. It's not like with Halo or other games where version X is developed by team 1, version X+1 by a separate team 2, etc. WoW is developed by a single team with only a small part of the devs periodically being sent forward / left back. So, even on those grounds, the perceived cycle of bad - good - bad - good has little reason to exist in WoW. And the most important corollary is: don't expect things to become much better after BFA. They might feel a bit better if BFA is especially terrible on contrast, but that's about it. There's no miracle super-team hammering out "the good expansion" that will arrive right after BFA.

the problem is ...you cant do that.

You bring up that the followers involved are different than another expansion and then make up some weird reason why its bad?

"always less"? no? the reason the followers are the same npcs is because its a faction wide thing. Warlords it was an army so they were random adventurers with a few known people. in Legion they were...members of the classes. now they are members of the army. Your priest and rogue having the same 'followers" in BFA is no different than your Priest and your shadow priest having the same followers.

the STORY is different, so the story is different

thats why when some twit says something like "oh this is bad" i just say "No its not" because just saying something is bad without justifying it with a Reason is pointless, stupid and non sensicle.

If someone tells me not to eat oranges because they taste bad, it would be silly to take their word for it. Now ideally they'd tell me They personally dont like oranges because they are sweet and a bit sour. and they dont like sweet and sour fruit, especially ones that need to be pealed.

So if i a person, who likes sweet and tangy fruit and dont mind peeling it then Its good for me.

Your opinion is worthless if your opinion is based on lies or nothing at all.

and THOSE reasons still have to make sense.

"i hate it cus its small" "well what if its suppose to be small"

"i hate it cus its campy" "well of course its SUPPOSE to be campy"

"I hate it cus its overly complicated " "well its the ENTIRE lore of the story its suppose to be complicated"

One person thinks more followers is better, another prefers less. Neither opinion means its good or bad.

Some people like campy acting some like realistic acting, neither are good or bad

[tristannarutofan]

You mean like in BfA how almost zero resources were spent on Class Design and now they're scrambling 2 months out from release and making sweeping changes to every single spec? Yet some will inevitably be missed and be dumpster tier until patches?

I thought they were all different teams?

Why is BfA primarily a cosmetic expansion with little to no *NEW* gameplay. Just iteration?

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Early?

Pre-patch needs to launch in a month.

PTR for it is right on time if testing lasts 4 weeks?

So they are spending time on class design but they havent spent any time on class design?

[tristannarutofan]

The cycle never ends.

It's actually so sad to see the addicts and fanboys accept that gameplay is going to be dogshit for most specs at launch. They're okay waiting for it to be fixed it in a patch.

It's not like any of this was reported 5 months ago when Alpha launched and they've left it until 2 months out to start making sweeping changes to specs.

again with the blatantly insulting people thing.

"5 months ago" you know video game design takes weeks, months and years right?

show me one spec that plays like Dog shit, explain how its dogshit

There are classes who a FEW people say their class fantasy doesnt suit their spec, an debatable thing with no right answer

there are many i'm sure that arent tuned right and need faster attacks, or more rage regeneration which they are tuning weekly.

there are some that are in the right place but some veterans who dont like change will never be happy about.

you sound like one of those people who say one spec having 5% less dps makes it 'unplayable"

hyperbole isnt Good feedback

[rda]

"i hate it cus its small" "well what if its suppose to be small"

I completely agree that BFA is supposed to be small. I hate it. You might like it. Let's see what the general opinion is going to be, it's not a lot of time to wait.

[NatePsy]

oh man when you become an adult comments like these are going to be really embarrassing!

I'm against PC/SJW in my literature, therefore I must be a child. Makes sense.

/s

[rda]

I mean . . . gameplay was dogshit for quite a few specs at Legion launch as well. have we ever had an expansion were some of the specs were not crap at release?

It's the general level of specs. Is guardian crap? It isn't considered crap, right? I don't think there are any changes for it coming (if there will be, I will happily take this back). But it is worse than before, notably. And it's the same with everything.

I mean, just a day or two ago we were talking about changes to PVP talents. Is it a disaster? Well, the sky is not falling, no. But is it things getting better or worse? For now, absolutely worse and frankly, I don't believe in them getting better in any type of future. Right now, the changes are just one more mini-prune with a highly theoretical "potential" to be maybe more interesting than before in some unknown later if the stars align and nobody gets drunk, and something tells me that the moment this "potential" will start becoming ripe and close to maybe realizing, they will do another mini-prune making things smaller again, but with one more, different "potential". Ion will explain why they needed to change / prune again elaborately dissing the system that they moved to now and promising miracles from the new system, as usual.

It's just apathetic with little hope for the future. Too many things gone wrong / have been pointlessly removed or changed (mostly reduced). The best hopes for BFA specs is that they suck less in release than they sucked on beta. You wait for a new expansion and your spec plays notably worse than before, and it's fundamental, not something that can be corrected with a minute fix. It is hard to be enthusiastic about that.

[Tartys]

By the way, from another thread: there is a piece on wowhead about the new missions table and it looks like followers are now shared between classes. Ie, a paladin is going to have the same followers as a priest and the same followers as a hunter. I agree that this is a minor detail, but I find it characteristic of BFA. It's never more, it's always less.

O_o what?? Where is no reason why we must have follower based on our class in BfA...

In Legion was logic, we was into our Class Hall, so our interaction was only with our "class related" NPC and you send your buddy into messions.
In BfA, the table is related to the War Campaing story, and we interact with NPC that rappresent our faction, that lead us build our outpost into opposit faction territories.

In BfA you are not anymore the "champion" of your class but is supposed you are the "champion" of your faction.


Lissen, I dont like BfA plot, the reason why we pass from Legion to the war is extremely pretentious and I am not convinced at all by the Azerite's armor system...

But this criticism, as if to prove that BfA is "less" is ridiculous, because instead it has its own logic.



If you have already decided that BfA will suck, there is nothing that will change your mind... but dont use this "brick" to prove it!

[rda]

If you have already decided that BfA will suck, there is nothing that will change your mind... but dont use this "brick" to prove it!

I am not using "this brick" to prove anything, I just find it characteristic of BFA. I accept that in this particular place maybe it is logical not to have separate followers and I said it is a minor detail anyway. This was just a small remark on how most of the news regarding BFA seem to be "mostly same as in Legion but 'improved by being reduced'".

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I honestly think that they had this peculiar idea that they could add a few things in each expansion, take them back and give new things, all using a max-level progression system.

I stopped understanding what they are doing.

I cannot help but think that most of the devs who were actually key drivers and implementors of ideas left to greener pastures in other, more promising projects, and instead we have some noobs who are on the one hand happy to take on a big project (because even though it is going down, this is a step forward for them personally) and on the other hand don't know what to do and are repeating childish mistakes which the former devs wouldn't have committed.

[Oblider]

> Open thread
> Sees rda post
> Grabs pop corn

[Seramore]

lol no.

More than likely we'll get PTR with the dev qa tomorrow.

Ion will be like "and as we speak the PTR is coming up right now, so go ahead and log on and test the darnassus thingy and world quests we have etc etc squish etc, and leave your feedback on the forums" at the start or end of the broadcast.

lol

...That's exactly what I just said.


8.0 is pretty obviously coming either tomorrow or next week considering their history of tending to have Q&As during the day of/days before an important patch going on their servers

[Steampunkette]

Yes, 10 people/families were scared shitless by the zombified remains of their former loved ones and just couldn't bare to talk to them. It's a pretty reasonable reaction. Certainly heartbreaking for those Forsaken of course. Heck the fact there were 12 families that did manage to handle this experience is amazing.
There is a reason Anduin did not interrupt Genn when he was graphically describing how most Forsaken look. I mean a lot of people can barely handle interacting with the dead remains of loved ones, let alone the undead ones.

You misunderstand. 10 Forsaken people leave the battlefield. Not 10 humans. We never get a count of humans who on the field of Arathi turn away from their former loved ones.

With 22 Forsaken and 19 Humans we know that at -least- 3 of the Forsaken have no one show up for them. But there are also those who have 2 people, even 3, show up to meet them. There's also the section where Genn and Anduin talk about people getting rejected, there, and turning back to Thoradin's Wall. So we're probably looking at something closer to 7 Forsaken don't have anyone visit them at all, 4 get rejected on the Highlands before the meeting started, others wound up getting rejected once their human family had been called, and the remaining forsaken to spend a little time with people who can see past their skin and find the love that's within them. I say closer to 7 'cause Elsie didn't have anyone to visit, but still stayed on the field to hang out with Parqual and his daughter.

(It was noted by Velcinda, however, that everyone had been -told- by the Alliance that -someone- would be there to visit them from their list of 5. Which is fucking weird since she acknowledges that she isn't going to see anyone..? More schizophrenic writing from Golden...)

But it's really graphically shown, earlier in the book, that it's almost entirely about prejudice based on religion rather than disgust about the people being gross and visibly undead. When Genn and Turalyon meet Faol in the Church of the Light. You could argue that it's just those two who are hyper-religious, after all one of them is a Paladin. But nah, Genn screams about Blasphemy and the Light in that church and barely mentions the light anywhere else in... well. Ever. But Faol cuts right to the heart of him and points out he's afraid of what Faol represents.

[rda]

With 22 Forsaken and 19 Humans we know that at -least- 3 of the Forsaken have no one show up for them. But there are also those who have 2 people, maybe even 3, show up to meet them.

Why 22 forsaken and 19 humans means that at least 3 forsaken have no matching humans? Why a single human cannot be meeting several forsaken?

I am just passing by, but the logic escapes me.

[Archmage Alodi]

That's not what I am seeing at all. if that was the truth, they would not be able to pull up decent or even great reworks with a little overtime. What I think I am seeing is very poor management that has poorly stated goals yet exercises too much control that stiffles action by individual developers. That would explain why the roster of NPCs used is always so specific, why there seems to be so little flexibility, why it can take so long for them to react to the community in many cases were the community is in full scale panic (it took them nearly a week to respond on BfA pathfinder not requiring both factions' content).
The problem is at the head.

I'm still pretty sure that we were supposed to be doing both factions for pathfinder, they changed it after seeing the backlash.

[rainhard]

the alliance got a new rep mount, wowhead made a page for it so it must be special,right?

[Nevcairiel]

...That's exactly what I just said.


8.0 is pretty obviously coming either tomorrow or next week considering their history of tending to have Q&As during the day of/days before an important patch going on their servers

Maybe you should say "8.0 PTR" if thats what you mean, because if someone says "8.0 is coming", the first interpretation is "to live", because on the beta we've had 8.0 already for months. =p

[rda]

I'm still pretty sure that we were supposed to be doing both factions for pathfinder, they changed it after seeing the backlash.

They are not that fast. When they are apparently driving into a wall, they will continue driving into it and eventually smash into it, then they will sit tight like nothing happened or send Ion to explain what a great victory this was.

[Archmage Alodi]

Well we will never really know, doesn't really matter either as long were not being fucked over by their bad decisions.

[Steampunkette]

Ah I thought that they showed up, saw the Forsaken and just did not reciprocate/told them to get away/run away screaming. Did they not show up at all? I still think this is a success. I do think Anduin should have somehow told the Council about who wouldn't get anyone to show up, but again I think communications back then were probably limited.

And having Genn make it about religion is poor writing indeed, when did Genn care about the Light? Always felt that only Lordaeron and Stormwind were particularly religious.

Yeah. There were a shitload that didn't show up at all (91), at least 4 or 5 who turned around before any names were called (According to Elsie/Velcinda), and then more who left after their names and the names of their loved ones were called, and then there were some who left after spending a few minutes with their family members, too.

All in all, there were very -very- few positive meetings. Osric and Tomas, The Felstone Family (3 Desolate Council members and their Human Mother), a "Pair of Sisters" with no name, and Philia and Parqual are the ones we're actively shown.

Of the 12 who stayed on the fields, at -least- 4 were defecting. Parqual and Jack, Jake, and Jem Felstone.