What are we paying $50 + $15 for?

[gaymer77]

No class balance at launch
No raids at launch
No allied races at launch
No mythic+ at launch
No PvP seasons at launch
No flying at launch

And they're asking us to fork out an additional month's of subscription fees while these features are still locked until 8.1 and beyond? This expansion has cash grab written all over it. At this rate, patch 8.1 should be the official launch date of the expansion.

Raids haven't been released with the game EVER. Even vanilla WoW didn't have raids at launch.
Allied races are out NOW so your point is bullshit.
Mythic+ also was not released at launch since they were added to the game.
PvP seasons have NEVER been at launch EVER since they've started them. There's always been a hiatus between the last season of an expansion and the start of the next one.
Flying at launch has not been a thing for 3 expansions. When they started gating flying behind achievements, this became the norm.

What you're paying for is the extra levels, new zones, new dungeons, normal heroics that will gear you up for the mythic+ and raids once they are released, and the FOUR allied races you can unlock NOW and play NOW.

[Mellrod]

We've been sorely overpaying for WoW for a while now. Feels great to fund garbage like HotS or Overwatch, eh?

HotS is debatable, but Overwatch however is certainly not garbage. It's wildly successful, even.

[kamuimac]

Pay $60 for a new game that you can play for as long as you want and never have to pay another dime.

Pay $60 for a new game, but also pay $15 a month so you can log in once a week.

Logic. It makes none.

So dont do it and go Play other games what's your problem ? If you cant afford to throw away 15 $ a month then you have bigger problems then playing wow

[MrLachyG]

oi @styil you don't get to just start a thread like this and then piss off. you've had people reply to you, now get back in here and reply to them. unless you're some kind of troll, in which case shove off

[Corroc]

Ah yes, the old "you hate WoW" argument. When all else fails dust that off. Because clearly someone who has played a game for 10 years and has invested passion and time into its storylines must hate it as a matter of course. How else could they possibly disagree with you or criticize it in any way?

Also, M+ was definitely in by month 2 of Legion which is when I picked up the expac. That's close enough to launch for me, especially as it was advertised beforehand and was therefore a known feature at launch. As for the artifact appearances, by your own admission those files were in the game at launch and it was their very presence that encouraged people to look for them and continue engaging with the open world.

Well you know, raids are going to be in bfa within 3 weeks and so is m+. You know those sweet allied races, well they are actually part of bfa not legion. Since you need BfA to play them. Pretty sure you know whats up with pvp season too. Just saying that the op of this thread wrote alot of things that are not going to be at launch that actually are going to be in the game within the first month. And you know my message that you quoted was pointed at that post.

Maybe hate was the wrong word to use. But you seem to think most of the content that every expansion brings is just filler. Like no one cares about new continents, new quests (you know there is war campaign also that is similar to class hall campaign) or island expeditions. We actually didn't know hidden artifacts were even hidden artifacts. We knew there was some skins in the game but no one had any idea what skins they were. Even the mage tower skins were there but no one knew where you could obtain them. We didn't know there was going to be hidden things either that the community could solve together. You are basically praising Legion for alot of things that were unknown 2 months before legion and trashing BfA just because you personally dont like what there is to offer.

[Xenonn]

new continent + class destruction

[Dahij]

Raids haven't been released with the game EVER. Even vanilla WoW didn't have raids at launch.
Allied races are out NOW so your point is bullshit.
Mythic+ also was not released at launch since they were added to the game.
PvP seasons have NEVER been at launch EVER since they've started them. There's always been a hiatus between the last season of an expansion and the start of the next one.
Flying at launch has not been a thing for 3 expansions. When they started gating flying behind achievements, this became the norm.

What you're paying for is the extra levels, new zones, new dungeons, normal heroics that will gear you up for the mythic+ and raids once they are released, and the FOUR allied races you can unlock NOW and play NOW.

Don't be stupid. Raids has been available at launch until they started delaying them in MoP.

[Solonar]

No class balance at launch
No raids at launch
No allied races at launch
No mythic+ at launch
No PvP seasons at launch
No flying at launch

Class changes are there but there are always going to be some things that won't get worked out right away.
Really? No raids? Then what's Uldir? It's in during launch, you just can't rush your way to 120 and already go into the raid.
Allied races are in during launch. That's what Void Elves, Lightforged Draenei, Highmountain Tauren and Nightborne are. Yeah, you can play them already but everybody playing them now pre-purchased BfA. You unlock the other four while playing the game when the expansion goes live.
Mythic+ wasn't immediately available during Legion either. Mythic+ became available around the same time Emerald Nightmare opened up. A month after the expansion release.
PvP seasons never started instantly when a new expansion began.
We didn't have flying at launch with WoD and Legion either.

All I'm really getting from this is that you're someone who feels he should be entitled to having things that he's had for the majority of the expansion. What's next "No artifact traits"?

[Verazh]

Everyone is right to be critical of any new expansion. Worrying signs should be mentioned, especially considering the price of the expansion and the monthly fee.

...but! All new expansions have these kinda threads. Its all doom and gloom everytime. What is not mentioned is that we have Island Expeditions and Warfronts from launch, something we've not had before.

Personally my biggest critique is the class design. That we are shipping with some specs being fucked up is just not okay. Especially considering that we've just been stripped of many traits/talents/spells from our artifacts. It seems like change for the sake of change and thats just not cool man.

[Dartz1979]

We've been sorely overpaying for WoW for a while now. Feels great to fund garbage like HotS or Overwatch, eh?

heynow i like heroes of the storm.. i can have all my sexy female waifus on there.. well almost Ysera is still not there yet

[Corroc]

The Allied races are cheap reskins designed to sell race changes. I never mentioned raids since raids are included in every expansion and are expected to be there as a matter of course. And M plus being there has nothing to do with this expansion, as it is merely a carry over feature from the previous expansion. This expansion literally adds nothing new or innovative other than re skinned ideas from older parts of the game.

Also, the majority of the community did know about the hidden skins and cooperated to find them. The fact that skins were going to be hidden and require cooperative gameplay to solve was something that was advertised at SDCC and Gamescon months before the expansion itself came out.

So you think blizzard has turned wow in to money milking machine just because there isn't something new revolutionizing feature in the game like m+ was? You know during this 14 years there has been multiple expansions that didn't have any special features in them. People dont pay for wow and the new expansions for new features. They pay for the boring continents, boring raids and those boring 10 levels.

Edit. Tbh I haven't paid for wow in 4 years, even bought bfa with gold. So it doesn't actually bother if blizzard does content for the game for money. I guess thats why I'm not as angry as you are.

[Donovan4893]

Raids haven't been released with the game EVER. Even vanilla WoW didn't have raids at launch.
Allied races are out NOW so your point is bullshit.
Mythic+ also was not released at launch since they were added to the game.
PvP seasons have NEVER been at launch EVER since they've started them. There's always been a hiatus between the last season of an expansion and the start of the next one.
Flying at launch has not been a thing for 3 expansions. When they started gating flying behind achievements, this became the norm.

What you're paying for is the extra levels, new zones, new dungeons, normal heroics that will gear you up for the mythic+ and raids once they are released, and the FOUR allied races you can unlock NOW and play NOW.

Not Agreeing with him but I do want to state that first point isn't 100% true TBC, WOTLK, and Cata all had their release raids available day 1 of the expansion (with Cata's heroic mode coming the second week), It wasn't until Mop that they decided to have a grace period before launching the first raid.

[Mellrod]

No class balance at launch

Not sure when this has ever really come at launch

No raids at launch

Raids have always been gated content except for maybe 1 or 2 expansions with some minor raid tiers at launch.

No allied races at launch

This is flat out wrong. Not only are there 4 allied races available to play right. fucking. now. Months before launch, but there are 2 more (Dark Irons and Mag'har Orcs) that'll be available at launch and then TWO MORE AFTER THAT (Kul'tirans and Zandalari) which will be available after a patch or two.

No mythic+ at launch

Mythic plus is a thing that was introduced in legion, and again, it was gated content. Why would it be different here?

No PvP seasons at launch

Again, this was never a thing. PvP seasons have had their own schedules since season 1 in fucking BC. They each last around 10-30 odd weeks and do not sync up with the release cycle of expansions at all.

No flying at launch

This hasn't been a thing since at least WoD, and even before then you still did not get flying right away. You had to level to max and then get over the paywalls (which were relatively large at the time).


What we ARE getting at launch:
6/8 Allied races, with heritage armor for those who level from 20-110 (4 of them already available to those who pre-ordered, 2 of them available at launch, and 2 available in later patches).
Two entire continents, Kul'tiras and Zandalar, to explore.
Island expeditions.
Warfronts.
PvP War Mode.
10 new levels with a new cap of 120.
10 new dungeons
Upgraded professions.

However OP forgets what we get at launch isn't entirely what we are paying for:
10 new levels with level cap raised to 120
8 Allied races with heritage armor for those who level from 20 to 110
Two entire continents to explore.
hundreds of new quests and stories to experience.
10 new dungeons
Uldir, the 1st new raid tier of the expansion
New PvP seasons
Mythic Plus
Class changes
Warfronts
Island Expeditions
War mode
New mounts, pets, toys, cosmetics, etc.
All the raid tiers, PvP seasons, quests, stories, dungeons, brand new features, etc. that will come in future patches.

I understand that what we see announced for an xpac is all we know we're getting, but judging an expansion's worth by it's launch content is like giving a review on a book after reading only the first paragraph. You're paying for launch content, sure, but you're also paying for the gated content and investing in future content throughout the lifespan of the expansion. Also, people seem to take for granted all the base features of an expansion. It wouldn't be an expansion without new quests, levels, continents, race/class, and profession changes.

TL;DR - It's fine to be critical of an expansion. If the stuff we're getting for BfA's launch doesn't look good enough to you, then there's a simple solution: don't play or buy at launch. Wait a few months or patches in to see what the verdict is. Some even wait until around the final patch so they know they're getting their money's worth. I'm sure you can do that and then post a thread about how you told us so later.

[haxartus]

Seriously. We are paying $175 per year for this game. I can buy the full Witcher 3 for $17 on Steam. Just think about that.

[Maelmorda]

No class balance at launch
No raids at launch
No allied races at launch
No mythic+ at launch
No PvP seasons at launch
No flying at launch

And they're asking us to fork out an additional month's of subscription fees while these features are still locked until 8.1 and beyond? This expansion has cash grab written all over it. At this rate, patch 8.1 should be the official launch date of the expansion.

Well, technically the allied races we currently have are BfA content, you have to pre-order to get access to them. Also, completing the campaign unlocks and allied race if I understand it right.

[MoanaLisa]

People make their own judgments about what to pay for and what not to. That's how the world works for the most part.

"Cash grab" is so overused. You either get your money's worth or you don't. If you don't, then don't. There's no one standing over you with a stick demanding you pay anything at all.

It's a commercial product. Take it or leave it. Either way is fine. Whining about it isn't going to change anyone's mind.

[deadhorse12]

They added 10 new levels with a cap at 120

I don't know why this is a selling point each expansion, this isn't content, it's an arbitrary number you have to fill by doing quests to get to the end game.

They can add 10 levels, they can add 1000 levels in 1 expansion.
"Wow 1000 levels, that's sooooo much content :O :O"

[Doffen]

I don't know why this is a selling point each expansion, this isn't content, it's an arbitrary number you have to fill by doing quests to get to the end game.

They can add 10 levels, they can add 1000 levels in 1 expansion.
"Wow 1000 levels, that's sooooo much content :O :O"

So leveling in new zones isn't content? And who are you to say it isn't content? They added 111, 112, 113, 114, 115, 116, 117, 118, 119, 120 to the game. Easily worth at least 20 euros

[haxartus]

So leveling in new zones isn't content? And who are you to say it isn't content? They added 111, 112, 113, 114, 115, 116, 117, 118, 119, 120 to the game. Easily worth at least 20 euros

The problem is, all of the quests are exactly like the old quests. Click on this, kill that, collect that. There is nothing different. You are paying $175 an year for copy/pasted content.

[Almiria]

I don't get why some people complain about Mythic+ or raids not being available at launch. Do you want to start doing Mythic+ when you don't even have normal mythic gear ? or do you want to chain wipe at Mythic+4 with 310 ilvl ? do you really want to start raiding as soon as you hit 120 ? no preparation, no gear, just raiding for the sake of raiding ?

If content is gated, it's for a good reason. You got the time to level, to gear with heroics and weekly mythics, few weeks of killing world bosses for a chance of a good item level piece, you got time to do world quest to get to revered / exalted to buy that high ilvl piece from reputation vendors while enjoying the game at the same time.