Classic update. It will be on 1.12 and it will be on battle.net :)

[Hitei]

Building vanilla inside the current client raises some interesting questions outside of what content is available on release.

Will it be with the API we have today?
Will it be with 14 years of mob pathing improvements?
Will advanced combat logging be a thing? And if so will we be competing for vanilla ranks on WCL?
Will abilities like charge/blink have their fixed versions that we use now, or are they going to break the abilities so they can be jumped/can't charge uphill without falling through the ground/blinking into hills or buildings has a chance to make you stuck?

Many gameplay interactions has been improved upon quite dramatically over the years, are they going to break all that?

The API will almost certainly be the modern one, because the old one was highly exploitable and allowed pseudo-botting. Will probably have the same access/limitations to information for that API, which should mean modern combat logging. I think you can probably assume things like blink will be fixed by modern infrastructure.

The more interesting question would be stuff like say, Vanish, which was highly unreliable In Vanilla and BC, and then changed to work more reliably in Wrath by actually altering how the spell worked. So do you leave it broken and unreliable or do you implement a version of the spell from several years later so that it works as intended?

[khalltusk]

heres the problem with staging it ? whats the point . just 1 thing like allwoing 18 or 20 debuffs on boss will break early raids

people wont need months to clear them - people will do it in 1 max 2 resets

and then complain - so whats next.

farming gear from early raids ? mostly pointless bcause they will faceroll harder raids in the same gear.

I mentioned this months ago and what solutions or paths they can take with the development.

They can either take no action and let the raids get done with the buffs of 1.12 patch and see how the player base reacts. I don't think this is the best solution.

They can tune some of the dungeon/raid content to make sure it does not fall over super easily with the increase damage that would come in with the buffs. This requires some more work and simming but can be done rather easily.

The second option makes more sense if they are going to allow debuffs slots to go up as an example. Blizzard either way will communicate their intentions later on so we will see. Right now we don't have enough information.

For me I don't care so much if the debuff slots are changed to a higher amount on earlier bosses. That is just me however.

[Vash The Stampede]

1: If they make it the same sub for both Classic and Live, I’m pretty sure they won’t care which you play more since you’re giving them the same $15/mo regardless.

If it were just the $15 a month, then we wouldn't have the in game store or the other services they offer like character transfers and instant level whatever. Plus, they can't sell you a $50 expansion. It's just not in their interest to keep you playing Vanilla. The only reason they did so was cause there exists a lot of private servers and this can work against their copyright. Plus a lot of players left official WoW for private servers as well which is just lost revenue for them.

2: I’m pretty sure they are aware tha a majority of people who are interested in Classic could care less about BfA. Meaning they could figure that releasing it as soon as it is ready would work just as well (or, imo, better) than delaying a release until a content drought. Although if they want to hit some kind of milestone (i.e. major Live patch, anniversary) for the release date and it is within a few weeks to a month... I could see that being plausible. But no way they’ll sit on it for longer just to fill some gap in BfA content that most people playing Classic wouldn’t have issues with.

Patch 7.3 was the last major release for Legion and it was released in August 29, 2017. Battle for Azeroth is expected to be released by August 14, 2018. That's one year of nothing and a lot of lost monthly subscriptions. People who are truly interested in Classic won't care, but those who have a passing interest may jump on it for a while to experience it until the next major expansion.

3: I do agree they will likely not gate content, but I’m pretty sure it won’t cost them any more resources than if it were a live server. It’s not gonna be that bad in terms of additional manpower/money. (Otherwise we would likely still not be getting Classic.)

For Blizzard to put any amount of money into a game that makes less money than Legion and works against their bottom line is still a waste of money. It is a drop in the bucket compared to how much Blizzard could make, but Blizzard doesn't want you to enjoy Classic for too long and doesn't want to make a habit out of this.

[barrsftw]

How can you cry already that there is not enough content or it been farmed too fast? Of course everyone will clear out the raids anybody know the raids. But you will need at least some days to get at level 60 and if you rush through everything ... really thats your problem. How about enjoying the game while playing without think about raiding, achieving until then?

Exactly. This isn't Live. People won't complain that there is nothing to do because A) it's optional, and B) We already know what the game is. It's for fun and you know what comes next already. If you rush through it and get bored that's on you.

[Gungnir]

Holy fuck I am laughing.
1st: Why do you even play if race is so important? I mean.. oke, that might be some strange fetish.
2nd: You literally can put one tick on and use old character models. Like... gratz on wasting 200 bucks mate I just hope that you are salty and lying, otherwise... sadness, if only you could read...

Did... did you know about the 'Use Old Models' button...?

You do realize you can turn the new models off with a checkbox?

Clearly none of you even bothered to make a comparison between the old models and the new "old models". They're not using the same skeleton rig, which means that it has NONE of the original animations and it looks like utter shit.
It also means that none of the armors fit properly since it has the same issue with shoulders being essentially floating on the side of your shoulders, almost on your back that the new models have.

I swear to god, atleast fucking research before dropping a comment next time.

[Dudas]

Considering that's what has happened on every single private server I've played on

Sry to inform but a Classic server made by blizzard will have a BIGGER (MILLION+ BIGGER) audience than private servers have. The people from private servers will play on Classic no matter what changes or no changes they make. They are the same people that have played vanilla in the last 12 years because they had no official support.

So yes your 100k tops server doesn't have the same audience as a blizzard game nowadays. The biggest delusion is that you people seem to think they are making this server ONLY for private server players. It started from them but if the company wants classic to be a success and not a dead private server they will make it as they see fit.

IMO they will make it as a remastered version that anyone can enjoy at their pace when they want and how they want and that's it. Rather than have them work gating content and making half of the raids not accessible I'd rather have the same team start working on a Burning Crusade server with character transfer from those that played classic. As they said they want to have the FEELING. So many mechanics will still be there. You will still play vanilla even if all the raids are available from the start. Min maxers that want only naxx will skip some.

The others, which seem to be the majority of #brainDeadNoChanges, will visit every single zone and every single dungeon for muh melancholy so I can drop a tear when that blue item with 10 agility will drop after farming it for two hours. If that is what you like, you will be able to do it. If i like to go raid t2 and t3 that's what I do. Making me farm dungeons and one raid for 6 months won't keep me ingame don't worry. So with this gating content blizzard will lose more than it will gain.

For Classic the audience is more than just you "purists" that play on private servers. A few months ago some of you said that if they do battle.net integration it won't be vanilla LUL. So take a hike and adapt.

It's a REMASTERED museum visit with many sections and everyone is free to visit what part they want. We will not play the game the way you want it or the way I want it. We will play what blizzard delivers. Some changes will upset your toxic self-centered "vanilla community LOL" but c'est la vie.

Elitist raiders like me will ask for warcraftlogs(which will happen don't you worry) before you join my raiding guild cause I'm not going to bother with your inferior level "but back in vanilla I didn't have to play the optimal spec and perform in the raid and people would invite me even if I was feral ". Everybody is looking for something. You'll find people similar to your to play with. I will find people similar to me to play with.

And those like me won't stay subbed for 6months+ for something we finish in 2 months tops.

[Projectmars]

If it were just the $15 a month, then we wouldn't have the in game store or the other services they offer like character transfers and instant level whatever. Plus, they can't sell you a $50 expansion. It's just not in their interest to keep you playing Vanilla. The only reason they did so was cause there exists a lot of private servers and this can work against their copyright. Plus a lot of players left official WoW for private servers as well which is just lost revenue for them.

They didn't need to put out Classic WoW in order to go after the Private Servers, the IP infringement and illegal use of assets was always enough. They would not be doing this if they expected it to be hemorrhaging money in the long run.

Patch 7.3 was the last major release for Legion and it was released in August 29, 2017. Battle for Azeroth is expected to be released by August 14, 2018. That's one year of nothing and a lot of lost monthly subscriptions. People who are truly interested in Classic won't care, but those who have a passing interest may jump on it for a while to experience it until the next major expansion.

But the game will still be there, which is the entire point. They could release it alongside a major patch, have all the people interested in just Classic flood the servers while all the people who are interested in Live play that content and then when they run out of things to do there Classic will still be there for them to try. Not only that, but the kinds of people who would likely be turned off between a combination of crowded starting zones and Classic's mechanics will be missing that initial crowding and may be more willing to give it more of a chance, increasing the likeliness they will stay subbed during periods where they usually wouldn't.

For Blizzard to put any amount of money into a game that makes less money than Legion and works against their bottom line is still a waste of money. It is a drop in the bucket compared to how much Blizzard could make, but Blizzard doesn't want you to enjoy Classic for too long and doesn't want to make a habit out of this.

In the initial interviews after the announcement, Blizzard had stated outright that they are expecting Classic to have a small population, are planning for that, AND gave assurances that they won't just simply abandon the servers and shut them off due to low population. I'm pretty sure they've planned it out financially as well and likely won't be losing money on this.

[kamuimac]

I mentioned this months ago and what solutions or paths they can take with the development.

They can either take no action and let the raids get done with the buffs of 1.12 patch and see how the player base reacts. I don't think this is the best solution.

They can tune some of the dungeon/raid content to make sure it does not fall over super easily with the increase damage that would come in with the buffs. This requires some more work and simming but can be done rather easily.

The second option makes more sense if they are going to allow debuffs slots to go up as an example. Blizzard either way will communicate their intentions later on so we will see. Right now we don't have enough information.

For me I don't care so much if the debuff slots are changed to a higher amount on earlier bosses. That is just me however.

i personally think they should go all the way - retune classes and redesign fight - aka allow all possible debuffs but tune the bosses much higher and harder.

i thing this way people would be much much happeir overall instead having radi filled with warriors/rogues/mages/priests only .

[Kralljin]

But the game will still be there, which is the entire point. They could release it alongside a major patch, have all the people interested in just Classic flood the servers while all the people who are interested in Live play that content and then when they run out of things to do there Classic will still be there for them to try.

They will most certainly try to avoid this.

After all, some sort of payment will be there to access those servers and Blizzard most certainly wants to make cash there, shutting out a part of your loyal customers until the "hype" is over is bad business.

Blizzard always tried to stagger their releases, even across franchises.

Diablo 3 was released during a massive content drought of Cata. 12.5.12 (MoP came out on 25.9.12)
Hearthstone was released during a massive content drought of MoP. 11.3.14 (WoD came out on 13.11.14)
Overwatch was released during a massive content drought of WoD. 24.5.16 (Legion came out on 30.8.16)

The number of WoW subs has diminished, but they know they're loyal Blizzard customers and most certainly won't force them to make any "hard" decisions.


I'd even go as far to say they would hold back a product like Vanilla Servers for 3 months or so if the completion of the project aligns with the completion of another content patch, video games live off the hype.

[Mosotti]

If I want to reroll on a new server a few years from now I don't want a lesser experience just because the game was supposed to be played from november 2019 to january 2022 for example and the game is now in a constant broken 1.12 state.

Well, boo hoo, then please invent a time machine. Life is full of things you've missed that you won't ever experience. 1.12 was not broken, what kind of mushrooms are you taking?

[ephaen]

Exactly. This isn't Live. People won't complain that there is nothing to do because A) it's optional, and B) We already know what the game is. It's for fun and you know what comes next already. If you rush through it and get bored that's on you.

Yea I absolutely agree. I feel like taking your time would be more fun anyway, and more authentic.

[Deleted]

LoL "Naxx is the hardes raid in game ever" "1.12 is so faceroll!" So ideally people will start with 1.0 zero with all the broken stuff and basically unfinished game? well then you might ask for bugs like falling trough the floor to be left too, because it had to be kept in mind back in a day and was sort of a mechanic.

[Tonkaden]

Because...

#1 They don't want you playing Vanilla WoW for years while ignoring Battle For Azeroth. It doesn't make financial sense.
#2 They only want you to play Vanilla long enough to release the next expansion cause there are lulls at the end of expansions.
#3 It's simply easier and less costly to just release everything all at once. Running a Vanilla server exactly as private servers do is going to take a lot of man power and therefore more money.


If you're going to accuse someone of trolling at least create a rebuttal. Your comment though is very troll like.

- - - Updated - - -



As someone who's played Vanilla WoW on private servers I can tell you what exactly people will do.

Step #1 Level to 60 within a month.
Step #2 Farm reputation with Argent Dawn by doing dungeons. This will probably take another month.
Step #2.5 Also do ZG like crazy cause you need the world buff and matts for helm and shoulder enchants.
Step #3 Enter Naxx with like 5-10 people and farm trash for random loot and matts. You'd be surprised how often great loot drops off the trash in Naxx.
Step #4 Get everyone to craft all the frost resist gear from Naxx.
Step #5 Enter AQ40 and clear that for 2 months.
Step #6 Enter Naxx and profit.

Doing this you would have cleared Naxx within 6 months. You'll probably do MC and BWL quickly for enchants and more gear, but with access to Naxx gear you'll eat through that quickly.

1. This will be doable
2. This will be doable
2.5. Wont be doable. They will stagger raid releases in the same order they came out during live
3. Won't be entering naxx anywhere close to 1-2 months after release. See 2.5.
4. Won't be getting frost resist gear from naxx. See 2.5
5. Wont be doing AQ40 at release either. See 2.5
6. Even 4 months in, you won't be going into naxx. See step 2.5.

You pretty much proved why they will stagger raids. Thanks for that.

[Perkunas]

Then everything being available from the get go is good with everyone? The number one complaint I hear from purists is how are they going to do content events and this does it.

You don't have to have phasing to do something like this. No******** didn't.

[Lusitan]

I have lost faith in getting a good deal out of Classic. Definitely not paying for 1.12, trivializing all initial raids, for that i have the Free Pirate servers. Thank you very much

[Ellerain]

They will most certainly try to avoid this.

After all, some sort of payment will be there to access those servers and Blizzard most certainly wants to make cash there, shutting out a part of your loyal customers until the "hype" is over is bad business.

Blizzard always tried to stagger their releases, even across franchises.

Diablo 3 was released during a massive content drought of Cata. 12.5.12 (MoP came out on 25.9.12)
Hearthstone was released during a massive content drought of MoP. 11.3.14 (WoD came out on 13.11.14)
Overwatch was released during a massive content drought of WoD. 24.5.16 (Legion came out on 30.8.16)

The number of WoW subs has diminished, but they know they're loyal Blizzard customers and most certainly won't force them to make any "hard" decisions.


I'd even go as far to say they would hold back a product like Vanilla Servers for 3 months or so if the completion of the project aligns with the completion of another content patch, video games live off the hype.

That makes a lot of sense from the business PoV. This gives Spring 2020 as a target release date for Classic.
Also, I laugh every time I see delusional people saying 'servers'. There will likely be one single (PvP) server for Classic because that is the limit of the long-term interest the monotone grindfest with the 2006 state-of-art class, item and encounter design will generate.

[The Stormbringer]

Clearly none of you even bothered to make a comparison between the old models and the new "old models". They're not using the same skeleton rig, which means that it has NONE of the original animations and it looks like utter shit.
It also means that none of the armors fit properly since it has the same issue with shoulders being essentially floating on the side of your shoulders, almost on your back that the new models have.

I swear to god, atleast fucking research before dropping a comment next time.

Alternatively, some of us like the new animations, or didn't notice a particularly large difference, or are maybe just less critical in general. There are these things called 'other opinions' that people can have. If it was bad enough you felt the need to spend $200 to race-change, that is perfectly fine, but it's also fully opinion based. 'Research' doesn't really fit into this.

[anon5123]

So yes your 100k tops server doesn't have the same audience as a blizzard game nowadays. The biggest delusion is that you people seem to think they are making this server ONLY for private server players. It started from them but if the company wants classic to be a success and not a dead private server they will make it as they see fit.

so you're saying they're going to open a vanilla server and then make it not vanilla so it appeals to retail players

and yet I'm the "delusional" one

[Dudas]

so you're saying they're going to open a vanilla server and then make it not vanilla so it appeals to retail players

and yet I'm the "delusional" one

Nope I'm saying that when they open classic A HUGE NUMBER OF PLAYERS will join that HAVEN'T PLAYED private servers. Streamers will flood servers with their armies. First days of launch will be pure cancer without phasing.

Just imagine a streamer with 10k viewers all making human characters. HAVE FUN KILLING THOSE WOLVES AND THOSE KOBOLDS FOR THE FIRST QUESTS!

Classic has a way bigger audience than your private servers ever had in the last 12 years.

And they stated they will KEEP the vanilla FEELING. I'm pretty sure that will include some changes(minor or major we'll have to see) but the experience will be the SAME.

So yes I maintain my claim that they don't do this project ONLY for private server players. They focus on a way bigger audience that you somehow #noChangesFanatics fail to realize it exists.

[Vash The Stampede]

1. This will be doable
2. This will be doable
2.5. Wont be doable. They will stagger raid releases in the same order they came out during live
3. Won't be entering naxx anywhere close to 1-2 months after release. See 2.5.
4. Won't be getting frost resist gear from naxx. See 2.5
5. Wont be doing AQ40 at release either. See 2.5
6. Even 4 months in, you won't be going into naxx. See step 2.5.

You pretty much proved why they will stagger raids. Thanks for that.

You could just say, "they'll be releasing raids in the same order as they did live". But has there been any official response to this? Cause if not.

2.5. Wont be doable. They will stagger raid releases in the same order they came out during live

Then that is entirely your opinion.