Thread: Any 120 BrMs?

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  1. #41
    Brewmaster is definitely a safe bet for raiding, even if mid tier in first raid will probably be good to really strong as xpac go's on as usual.

    They will probably continue to be meh for M+.

    Brewmaster and Blood are always safe tank picks though, I can't thing of a single expansion either has existed in where they haven't been really, really good at something at some point.

  2. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by Marrilaife View Post
    No one, because Blizzard drew their "no king rules forever" nerfbat for them, same as aff locks. So yeah, BFA druids will have to suffer for Legion druids.

    Yeah, this is a looming threat, I have a friend who plays all tank classes and can play them all well, and he seems reluctant to pick dh for BFA because he picked warrior at start of Legion and then had to reroll. Monk is probably a fairly safe bet, because dk / druid were too good at end of Legion so will be knee-jerk nerfed, VDH might get same treatment if it's too good at start of BFA, and Warrior / Paladin suffer from the fact Blizzard can never balance shield tanks because block in practice is rarely as good as on paper.
    dh will get nerfed, dk will get better over time, and monks will get buffs during 2nd raid. i can feel it

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tech614 View Post
    Brewmaster is definitely a safe bet for raiding, even if mid tier in first raid will probably be good to really strong as xpac go's on as usual.

    They will probably continue to be meh for M+.

    Brewmaster and Blood are always safe tank picks though, I can't thing of a single expansion either has existed in where they haven't been really, really good at something at some point.
    im never gonna be a push high keys kind of person. i do 17-20s now on live and will stay at that kind of pace as BfA goes on. so monk will be fine. all it would take to feel a bit better is a little more love with guard.

  3. #43
    right now on beta based on youtube vids of m+6. Brewmaster doesnt seem that bad, obviously dh is king by far, but all other tanks are getting rekt, too. And with a druid/palading healer i'd place bm second followed by all other tanks. We just can't solo easy content like other tanks can, but that's fine as long as we are viable in difficult content.

    not to mention we are still king in raids.

  4. #44
    I just can't feel safe with BrM after several bad changes were proposed during Legion (that fortunately never made live). Feels like Blizzard doesn't know how to handle stagger and its merely a matter of time until they fuck something up trying to stop Monks from cheesing mechanics.
    It ignores such insignificant forces as time, entropy, and death

  5. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by Gorsameth View Post
    I just can't feel safe with BrM after several bad changes were proposed during Legion (that fortunately never made live). Feels like Blizzard doesn't know how to handle stagger and its merely a matter of time until they fuck something up trying to stop Monks from cheesing mechanics.
    well, it would take a major rework. and thats something they arent doing right now.

    id be more scared to play something like DH which will definately get knocked down a few pegs.

  6. #46
    Quote Originally Posted by dcc626 View Post
    well, it would take a major rework. and thats something they arent doing right now.

    id be more scared to play something like DH which will definately get knocked down a few pegs.
    I'm considering DK, I didn't enjoy DH during Legion.
    It ignores such insignificant forces as time, entropy, and death

  7. #47
    Over 9000! Saverem's Avatar
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    I think I may just main Monk for BfA. Not because BrMs are good, but because DHs are TOO good. If I played my DH or DK tanks I'm going to definitely get annoyed by guildies to tank their M+s for them and I'm not about that life.

    I'll stick with BrM and do my 1 +15 a week for the chest and be done with it. Saving the tanking for the raids...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gorsameth View Post
    It ignores such insignificant forces as time, entropy, and death
    I don't get your sig, is it a quote from someone? Don't think any of those are considered forces.

    Time is a dimension, entropy is a state, and death is pretty much the opposite of force since it removes energy.
    "It's not what we don't know that gets us into trouble; it's what we know for sure that just ain't so." ~ Mark Twain
    "The time you enjoy wasting is not wasted time" ~ Jesus of Nazareth
    "把它放在我的屁股,爸爸" ~ Dalai Lama

  8. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by Saverem View Post
    I think I may just main Monk for BfA. Not because BrMs are good, but because DHs are TOO good. If I played my DH or DK tanks I'm going to definitely get annoyed by guildies to tank their M+s for them and I'm not about that life.

    I'll stick with BrM and do my 1 +15 a week for the chest and be done with it. Saving the tanking for the raids...

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    I don't get your sig, is it a quote from someone? Don't think any of those are considered forces.

    Time is a dimension, entropy is a state, and death is pretty much the opposite of force since it removes energy.
    http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Ca...verseid=215092
    It ignores such insignificant forces as time, entropy, and death

  9. #49
    Herald of the Titans Will's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saverem View Post
    I think I may just main Monk for BfA. Not because BrMs are good, but because DHs are TOO good.
    Again, basing a decision around stuff that's subject to change isn't wise. DH's could get nerfed hard in 8.1 for all we know.

  10. #50
    Over 9000! Saverem's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Will View Post
    Again, basing a decision around stuff that's subject to change isn't wise. DH's could get nerfed hard in 8.1 for all we know.
    I'm basing it off of their core mechanics. DHs/BDKs tanking mechanic is just objectively superior to the BrMs in M+. They have some mitigation CDs as well as healing based on damage taken (which works on spell damage). A BrM will stagger more and more the more damage they take, VDHs/BDKs will HEAL for more and more the more damage they take.
    "It's not what we don't know that gets us into trouble; it's what we know for sure that just ain't so." ~ Mark Twain
    "The time you enjoy wasting is not wasted time" ~ Jesus of Nazareth
    "把它放在我的屁股,爸爸" ~ Dalai Lama

  11. #51
    The more damage you stagger, the more damage you purify. BrMs scale with damage intake too.

  12. #52
    Over 9000! Saverem's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PinDrop View Post
    The more damage you stagger, the more damage you purify. BrMs scale with damage intake too.
    The more damage you take, the less charges of ISB/Purify you have to play with. You'll either have to sacrifice ISB uptime or wait longer to Purify.
    "It's not what we don't know that gets us into trouble; it's what we know for sure that just ain't so." ~ Mark Twain
    "The time you enjoy wasting is not wasted time" ~ Jesus of Nazareth
    "把它放在我的屁股,爸爸" ~ Dalai Lama

  13. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by Saverem View Post
    The more damage you take, the less charges of ISB/Purify you have to play with. You'll either have to sacrifice ISB uptime or wait longer to Purify.
    No, damage intake does not affect your brew recharge. Assuming you keep up ISB 100%, your remaining brews will be used to purify, and the higher your stagger, the more they remove.

  14. #54
    Quote Originally Posted by PinDrop View Post
    No, damage intake does not affect your brew recharge. Assuming you keep up ISB 100%, your remaining brews will be used to purify, and the higher your stagger, the more they remove.
    Purify is flat DR when used. It's the same % of DR no matter what your current stagger amount is. It does not scale with damage taken. Your entire argument is like saying your characters flat DR scaled with damage taken, because as you take more it will reduce more when in reality it's still the same % of flat DR. VDH and BDK also has flat mitigation abilities, and on top of that they have self healing that directly scales with damage taken. It's not like they only have the healing lmao...

    Monk healing on the other hand KIND OF scales with damage taken, as in you will spawn more for taking more damage but the actual heal amount on them does not scale. That's the difference.

  15. #55
    Over 9000! Saverem's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PinDrop View Post
    No, damage intake does not affect your brew recharge. Assuming you keep up ISB 100%, your remaining brews will be used to purify, and the higher your stagger, the more they remove.
    Yep, brew recharge doesn't scale with damage intake... The more damage you take, the quicker your stagger will hit red and the more often you'll need to Purify. It becomes a balancing act between having enough charges to Purify and having the ISB buff up. Take enough damage and you'll have to sacrifice one. Take hard hitting bosses like Agg/Argus for instance. You'll have to eventually just let the high stagger tick so you can keep ISB up, or sacrifice a few seconds of ISB to use that charge on Purify.

    DH/DK don't have that issue. Their heals directly scale with the incoming damage they take. It's a flat % (8% per soul frag for DHs and 25% + blood shield % for DKs of ALL THE DAMAGE they've taken in the last 5s effected by Vers). Closest thing BrMs have to that is their shitty Ox orbs which scale extremely shitty with AP and do laughable amounts of heals by comparison.
    "It's not what we don't know that gets us into trouble; it's what we know for sure that just ain't so." ~ Mark Twain
    "The time you enjoy wasting is not wasted time" ~ Jesus of Nazareth
    "把它放在我的屁股,爸爸" ~ Dalai Lama

  16. #56
    At a certain point though, VDH and BDK's self heal will just bring them to 100% from wherever they're at, no matter how much they have taken. Overhealing is typically just wasted mitigation. BrM's damage smoothing does not have a cap, it works on any level of damage taken, up to a point where a mechanic is just not designed to be survived, and they can still halve it even then. I just don't think it's fair to say they are objectively worse tanks, is all. They tank differently.

    If you compare their healing yes they are worse. If you compare their smoothing, which in my experience healers love, they are the best, in my opinion. A good VDH or BDK won't stress their healers because the healers know they will bring themselves up after their health spikes low. A good BrM does the same in that the healers know their health wont EVER spike low, and if it does, a good BRM will have a pile of orbs handy, which will bring them to 100% just as easy as a VDH or BDK.

  17. #57
    Quote Originally Posted by PinDrop View Post
    BrM's damage smoothing does not have a cap
    Boy, do I have some bad news for you...

    That and your other paragraph makes me think you haven't actually played brewmaster in legion or beyond, you seem to be describing some OP as fuck brewmaster from WoD or MoP times. "pile of orbs to bring me back to 100%" L O L, yea maybe 2 expansions ago.

    The reality is a brewmaster needs to be baby sat by constant healing, it works well in a mythic raid with 4+ healers and a beacon+HoTs rolling on you. Not so much in M+. The same will be true in BFA as it is in Legion.
    Last edited by Tech614; 2018-06-23 at 06:07 AM.

  18. #58
    Quote Originally Posted by Saverem View Post
    Yep, brew recharge doesn't scale with damage intake... The more damage you take, the quicker your stagger will hit red and the more often you'll need to Purify. It becomes a balancing act between having enough charges to Purify and having the ISB buff up. Take enough damage and you'll have to sacrifice one. Take hard hitting bosses like Agg/Argus for instance. You'll have to eventually just let the high stagger tick so you can keep ISB up, or sacrifice a few seconds of ISB to use that charge on Purify.

    DH/DK don't have that issue. Their heals directly scale with the incoming damage they take. It's a flat % (8% per soul frag for DHs and 25% + blood shield % for DKs of ALL THE DAMAGE they've taken in the last 5s effected by Vers). Closest thing BrMs have to that is their shitty Ox orbs which scale extremely shitty with AP and do laughable amounts of heals by comparison.
    Stagger reduces magical damage by a percentage and elusive brawler functionally reduces all physical damage taken by a percentage.

    Of course, healing and avoiding are not the same and are beneficial in different circumstances, but in a purely on paper comparison they do the same.

  19. #59
    Sorry, I missed that the discussion was about M+, I agree BrMs are subpar in there, carry on

  20. #60
    Brewmaster Julmara's Avatar
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    hope we get some good changes in 8.1 :/

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