Ret pally is broken on beta

[Jester Joe]

The FACT is that Paladins are the most played class in the game and thus have the largest whinefest cryfroce whenever they get balanced down. That is FACT. They are the most played and will continue to be the most played even if they get nerfed.

Most played means nothing. Why you're even bringing that up is beyond me. And nothing about paladin being the most played means RET is the most played spec of them. So...irrelevant.

Paladins and Druids make up like half of the playerbase and always get catered attention from Blizz because of it. They are the 2 favorite kids of Blizz and I welcome any adjustment down they get. Paladins already have best tank healers and top 3 tank in game, including going into BfA. You guys will do more than fine.

Okay, so here's an idea, let's just gut half of WW, give it to Brewmaster/Mistweaver, and call it a day. You're fine with that, right? Having a gimped melee spec that won't get you a spot in a raid because people would rather have a MW and bring a rogue for that melee spot, right?

Oh, and let's ignore the fact that there's been barely any druid feedback, and all the paladin feedback has been two short posts about prot, and a single about ret.

Meanwhile, Mistweaver got a pretty indepth explanation and feedback to a revamp. But yes, totally Blizzard caters to paladins.

I'm playing the world's smallest violin for your woes.

All you're doing is proving you literally have no idea what you're talking about, and you're trying to just screw over others because you want YOUR class to be the best (Which, mind you, Windwalker is in a far better spot currently than Ret is, but okay!)

The actual facts are as I listed.

Ret has never been brought for "utility" that you claim is so great, not once throughout all of Legion.
Your "but just one is enough!" is irrelevant, because if the utility is good enough to warrant one, then usually multiple will be stacked to take advantage of that (ex- Rogues and their feint).

Holy paladins have all the utility that ret has, PLUS a raid wide CD and Hand of Sacrifice. So anything a ret can do, holy can do better.

[Deleted]

But what is your point @Jester Joe ?

Is it that because Ret Paladin brings no utility they need "tons of damage" to compensate?
So the state of retri is acceptable now in Beta?

Im talking exclusively about the PvP point of view...but you seem to be talking about PvE.

In PvP they are gods with the only rival being Frost Mage.
Its a mixture of extreme survival, heals, insane damage.

Im just gonna post the video of @Clearcut again

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nbj8...youtu.be&t=405

You can watch until the end of the first Arena match...Paladins are insane in PvP.

[Jester Joe]

But what is your point @Jester Joe ?

Is it that because Ret Paladin brings no utility they need "tons of damage" to compensate?
So the state of retri is acceptable now in Beta?

Im talking exclusively about the PvP point of view...but you seem to be talking about PvE.

Yet again, 1v1 is not a good measure. And that's the other poster trying to bring up "BUT YOUR UTILITY", not me.

In PvP they are gods with the only rival being Frost Mage.
Its a mixture of extreme survival, heals, insane damage.

Im just gonna post the video of @Clearcut again

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nbj8...youtu.be&t=405

You can watch until the end of the first Arena match...Paladins are insane in PvP.

It sounds like you haven't seen a Frost DK on live then.

That instant full HP is what they when they use their defensive.

And the 1v1 you linked at the start, like...what

The priest is in the corner healing himself up at random times, and then complains "SO MUCH HEALING" when the paladin got off two self heals with specific talents?

I mean, did you not watch when the paladin actually HARD casts flash of light, how little it heals for? It's less than Shadow Mend, that's for sure.

There's nothing insane about that. And for the 2s, Shadow priest misplayed several times too. Kept fishing for mind control to walk the paladin off the edge instead of just mass dispeling and finishing him off. Didn't try to interrupt the heal even.
They went for a gimmick win instead of trying to just blow him up, tried toying with him, let him self heal several times over, and THAT'S your example of OP?

I mean, come on. I've done that on live before even. People do stupid things and think "it's only one person, they can't win" and then they lose. Literally what the hell, why are you even using this as an example?

I'm legit baffled. This is a video of two people trying to screw with a ret paladin, toying around, and you're shocked?

This is absolutely nothing "insane" in that video. they let him hard cast heal himself several times. He still couldn't manage to finish one person off at low HP.

For christ's sake, LOOK AT THE SCOREBOARD AT THE END.

The DH that died almost instantly STILL did 1/8th of the total damage, the druid and the SHADOW priest healed almost as much as the paladin.

What more do you want? Honestly this is frustrating me more than it should.

You literally have hard numbers right there of a druid and shadow priest pulling just as much, and you're still focusing on ret.
You have a DH somehow doing 1/8th of the total damage on his team despite the ret paladin outlasting him by FAR, it shouldn't be that close at all.
Yet you're still focusing on the ret.

[Deleted]

Yet again, 1v1 is not a good measure. And that's the other poster trying to bring up "BUT YOUR UTILITY", not me.



It sounds like you haven't seen a Frost DK on live then.

That instant full HP is what they when they use their defensive.

And the 1v1 you linked at the start, like...what

The priest is in the corner healing himself up at random times, and then complains "SO MUCH HEALING" when the paladin got off two self heals with specific talents?

I mean, did you not watch when the paladin actually HARD casts flash of light, how little it heals for? It's less than Shadow Mend, that's for sure.

There's nothing insane about that. And for the 2s, Shadow priest misplayed several times too. Kept fishing for mind control to walk the paladin off the edge instead of just mass dispeling and finishing him off. Didn't try to interrupt the heal even.
They went for a gimmick win instead of trying to just blow him up, tried toying with him, let him self heal several times over, and THAT'S your example of OP?

I mean, come on. I've done that on live before even. People do stupid things and think "it's only one person, they can't win" and then they lose. Literally what the hell, why are you even using this as an example?

I'm legit baffled. This is a video of two people trying to screw with a ret paladin, toying around, and you're shocked?

This is absolutely nothing "insane" in that video. they let him hard cast heal himself several times. He still couldn't manage to finish one person off at low HP.

For christ's sake, LOOK AT THE SCOREBOARD AT THE END.

The DH that died almost instantly STILL did 1/8th of the total damage, the druid and the SHADOW priest healed almost as much as the paladin.

What more do you want?

This, this right here is why no one takes paladins seriously oh my god. Even the chat in the video is filled with paladins being your typical paladins.

The shadow mend is healing more than pala heals holy shit the delusions. I mean his auto attacks are hitting for more than swp and vt combined yet you still cannot see any issues at all?. At the end of the duel, spriest completely OOM because both shadow mend, shield which is our ONLY movement option plus breaks on 1 auto attack and mass dispel are all on the same tiny mana bar, shadow mend barely even makes a scratch on the healing, the only visible healing you actually see is from the vampiric embrace cd, yet at the end the pala is full hp and full mana. "balanced".
Yeah exactly look at the scoreboard at the end, the retardin who was thrown off the ramp about 5 times, even jumping off the ramp himself like a typical retardin, stunning his target then running AWAY from it like a typical retardin still does similar damage SOLO to a boomkin and spriest COMBINED and heals for more than either one of them while he spent most of his time running back up the ramps to catch them as they abuse the 11/10 best ever designed arena.

Assassination rogue is overwhelmingly accepted as being completely busted op damage wise at the moment in bfa yet ret still beats them with ease. "balanced".

[Jester Joe]

This, this right here is why no one takes paladins seriously oh my god.

Because you all are just watching a video of someone toying with a ret paladin, flabbergasted that the ret survived for so long when they kept letting him break LoS and hard cast his self heal, and then you'll complain that Ret's self healing is ridiculous, while the two others healed for nearly as much?

Yeah, it's a bit ridiculous and frustrating that you have hard numbers right there to show you Ret is basically in line for self healing with shadow priest, yet you're taking a team who LET the ret run around nonstop as a sign that they're "OP".

I mean hell, even in that video, guy is all shocked about "SO MUCH DAMAGE".

misses that it was the lightforged draenei nuke that hit him, not a paladin thing.

[Armourboy]

This, this right here is why no one takes paladins seriously oh my god.

No one takes Paladins seriously because anytime they get to the top of anything other than healing Blizzard hands them a quick kick in the nuts. It's the reason I'm not entirely sure why people are going crazy over Ret, Blizzard has shown time and time again, even before Vanilla was released, that they don't mind taking them down a notch or two, or 3, or 4.

If it's too strong the nerf will come.

[Jester Joe]

This, this right here is why no one takes paladins seriously oh my god. Even the chat in the video is filled with paladins being your typical paladins.

The shadow mend is healing more than pala heals holy shit the delusions.

Look at the hard casts amount. It does, because shadow mend also ticks some damage off. You're confusing that with the new talented flash of light, which is instant and a stronger heal, but requires a build up.

Yeah exactly look at the scoreboard at the end, the retardin who was thrown off the ramp about 5 times, even jumping off the ramp himself like a typical retardin,

Totally not bias. If you're here to just hate, move on.

stunning his target then running AWAY from it like a typical retardin

Stun healer, nuke dps is a bad idea.

waitaminute.

still does similar damage SOLO to a boomkin and spriest COMBINED and heals

because both of them literally STOPPED doing damage for a while just to screw with him.

Shocking, you don't do damage if you don't attack. And they let him sit there and heal up.

for more than either one of them while he spent most of his time running back up the ramps to catch them as they abuse the 11/10 best ever designed arena.

Screwing around with a ret, that's totally how we should balance the game.

Facts are, if they didn't screw around with him, he would have been dead as soon as his bubble wore off.

There is literally NOTHING there that was him being OP, it was them being clowns and toying around with him.

Assassination rogue is overwhelmingly accepted as being completely busted op damage wise at the moment in bfa yet ret still beats them with ease. "balanced".

It's almost like ret beats assassination pretty easily on live even, where assassin also nukes through people pretty quickly.

Almost as if, dispelling poisons neuters the damage from them, and when you have an aoe dispel on a 4 second CD, it works wonders against assassination.

I mean, by your logic, and this is strictly YOUR logic.

Ret is OP! They beat this other OP class!
Ergo, Frost mage must be OP too, since they beat ret!

[Cucultlan]

They’re iconic Paladin abilities. It’d be like removing double jump from demon hunters, charge from Warriors or death grip from Death Knights.

Y’all just need to git gud.

they already did it removing the stun from charge and giving us a not useful slow and while i like that the palas still have many iconic abilities but i want my things back that made me deals with them (im looking at shattering throw)

[Deleted]

Because you all are just watching a video of someone toying with a ret paladin, flabbergasted that the ret survived for so long when they kept letting him break LoS and hard cast his self heal, and then you'll complain that Ret's self healing is ridiculous, while the two others healed for nearly as much?

Yeah, it's a bit ridiculous and frustrating that you have hard numbers right there to show you Ret is basically in line for self healing with shadow priest, yet you're taking a team who LET the ret run around nonstop as a sign that they're "OP".

I mean hell, even in that video, guy is all shocked about "SO MUCH DAMAGE".

misses that it was the lightforged draenei nuke that hit him, not a paladin thing.

I dont know what else to tell you...

Fine let Paladins be the strongest melee in the entire game.
Lets create eccentrics and egotistical kids spamming chat about how good they are and that they never lost a duel in their life.

If thats what you want....ok. Have fun with your Paladin alt/main in BfA.

I've already seen plenty of egotistical Paladins in Beta spamming chat...thats the consequence of giving nuclear bombs to kids.

[Jester Joe]

I dont know what else to tell you...

Fine let Paladins be the strongest melee in the entire game.
Lets create eccentrics and egotistical kids spamming chat about how good they are and that they never lost a duel in their life.

If thats what you want....ok. Have fun with your Paladin alt/main in BfA.

I've already seen plenty of egotistical Paladins in Beta spamming chat...thats the consequence of giving nuclear bombs to kids.

And this is what's getting more frustrating.

I'm literally explaining to you why that LOOKS OP to you.

Why it isn't really. How the one team screwed up several times to let the guy survive longer and inflate his numbers. And nothing is actually being argued otherwise, no facts, just "Nope, you're OP, deal with it".

Honestly, it sounds more like you're just mad about PvPers being normal PvPers. That has nothing to do with paladins, and you're going to see that regardless of what's FotM.

[Deleted]

And this is what's getting more frustrating.

I'm literally explaining to you why that LOOKS OP to you.

Why it isn't really. How the one team screwed up several times to let the guy survive longer and inflate his numbers. And nothing is actually being argued otherwise, no facts, just "Nope, you're OP, deal with it".

Honestly, it sounds more like you're just mad about PvPers being normal PvPers. That has nothing to do with paladins, and you're going to see that regardless of what's FotM.

Its ok, im biased because i play the game for 1v1's.
Duels
World PvP encounters

Paladins are the strongest 1v1'er in the entire game (rival by Frost Mages) i will just have to learn to run away from them...

There will always be the strongest 1v1'er.
Paladins are the strongest right now...fine.

[Jester Joe]

Its ok, im biased because i play the game for 1v1's.
Duels
World PvP encounters

Paladins are the strongest 1v1'er in the entire game (rival by Frost Mages) i will just have to learn to run away from them...

There will always be the strongest 1v1'er.
Paladins are the strongest right now...fine.

Have I not said from the start, Ret has always been one of the strongest, if not THE strongest 1v1 class?

What I could do in a duel on live makes that video look like a joke.
Especially with tier and legendaries, judgement alone will hit you for half your health.

But that isn't what PvP is balanced around. Nor will it ever be.

And if Ret isn't OP on live last I checked.

[Lumineus]

The FACT is that Paladins are the most played class in the game

Druids, Hunters

and thus have the largest whinefest cryfroce whenever they get balanced down.

Mages, Warriors

That is FACT. They are the most played and will continue to be the most played even if they get nerfed.

Fake news. Sad!

[Deleted]

@Jester Joe Delusional just doesn't cut it, live in denial if you want.

I can't even be bothered debating this with you because of it so here's a summary

1. Spriest ends duel with 0 mana 0 hp after a huge upward struggle of trying to heal while paladin just mashes his way through healing back to full hp multiple times then ends duel at full mana, balanced.

2. No bias, calling him a retardin because he is a retardin, the exact same way anyone instantly jumps to call a hunter a huntard if he makes the slightest of mistakes, get over it, people use the term for a reason and that paladin blatantly wears the badge proud.

3. Not exactly contradicting point 2 when you're calling a boomkin and spriest healers.

4. They are both dot classes, they kinda do their dmg via dots, they stopped to HEAL through retardins dmg....

5. Screwing around with a retardin because it's 2v1, savouring the extremely rare chances a spriest can actually do ANYTHING vs this spec for YEARS plus purposely continuing to abuse the ramp for a good yt clip, even then had the possibility of losing because of his ridiculous dmg and healing.

6. His total damage done was close to the total damage done of 2 dps classes combined, whilst he had 40-50% uptime at best due to exploiting the 11/10 balanced ramp arena, yet you still say its balanced.

7. Ofcourse ret beasts something easily, it's kinda hard not to beat stuff easily on that spec.

8. No that is not my logic at all, you're so quick to instantly attack anyone who dare says your beloved class is over tuned that you overlook key details. I said rogue damage is completely busted, it's not due to poisons so i have no clue where you're getting this ridiculous notion from, it is from envenom crits that can and quite often do completely 1 shot someone by doing over 120k dmg in a single armor bypassing crit. Except for rets, they just stun them and burst them down before it even happens whilst outhealing the damage. There is a massive difference, and yes when a class can literally one shot people but still cannot win vs a certain spec then it is pretty safe to say that class is probably overtuned as well no matter how much that butthurts you to hear.

Again though, due to the shear delusion and denial this is the last time i am going to respond, i do not see why it is so hard to accept that classes can be over tuned in a beta, it's kinda the point of having a beta, to iron out that stuff.

But you do you and keep on fighting the good and completely balanced fight.

[Saverem]

Okay, so here's an idea, let's just gut half of WW, give it to Brewmaster/Mistweaver, and call it a day. You're fine with that, right? Having a gimped melee spec that won't get you a spot in a raid because people would rather have a MW and bring a rogue for that melee spot, right?

Considering I'm a BrM main, that would make me pretty happy actually.

But for the sake of argument if I was WW and they gut half of my abilities or change it in some way, I'd first hold off to see if I like the new mechanic. The new WW would be loved and hated depending on the person because there is no 1 perfect spec, we all have different tastes. I may not like it, but Tom Dick and Harry Jones could love it. (In fact, I DO not like WW's playstyle, so I don't play it. I go to my Havoc if I want to melee DPS)

It's same with Rets. You can't cry over their rotation and say Rets suck now because that is your opinion, some other people may LOVE the new Ret. So the only thing I can base the argument on is what they bring to the group. And Rets bring some more than decent utility. Everything else is just personal taste and numbers tuning from Blizz.

- - - Updated - - -

Druids, Hunters


Mages, Warriors


Fake news. Sad!

It's amazing how everything you just said is wrong.

[Jester Joe]

@Jester Joe Delusional just doesn't cut it, live in denial if you want.

I can't even be bothered debating this with you because of it so here's a summary

1. Spriest ends duel with 0 mana 0 hp after a huge upward struggle of trying to heal while paladin just mashes his way through healing back to full hp multiple times then ends duel at full mana, balanced.

There's nothing mashing there.

Yet again, irrelevant also because 1v1, Ret has always been a monster. Nothing is balanced around that, so...

2. No bias, calling him a retardin because he is a retardin, the exact same way anyone instantly jumps to call a hunter a huntard if he makes the slightest of mistakes, get over it, people use the term for a reason and that paladin blatantly wears the badge proud.

I would like to see your statistics then to make sure you've never died from fall damage or drowned underwater

3. Not exactly contradicting point 2 when you're calling a boomkin and spriest healers.

Ah yes, I totally called them healers.

No, wait, I said they have heals. And they did similar healing output to the ret, while toying with him.

4. They are both dot classes, they kinda do their dmg via dots, they stopped to HEAL through retardins dmg....

Odd, I didn't see a single SW: D despite the paladin being within range until they finally finished him off.

And no, they literally stopped to let him heal up, and wasted time. There was quite a few times even they weren't healing themselves up despite having the safe time to, they were just sitting there laughing as they kept screwing around with the guy. Yet again, this is a horrible example.

5. Screwing around with a retardin because it's 2v1, savouring the extremely rare chances a spriest can actually do ANYTHING vs this spec for YEARS. Even then had the possibility of losing because of his ridiculous dmg and healing.

...years. Sounds like you've never touched a paladin if you think that.

6. His total damage done was close to the total damage done of 2 dps classes combined, whilst he had 40-50% uptime at best due to exploiting the 11/10 balanced ramp arena, yet you still say its balanced.

Ret has two ranged moves in their rotation, and yet again, they stopped to let him fully heal up.

Also, you can't go "Well he did more TOTAL damage!" as an example, he also had two targets to beat on that refused to finish him off.

Meanwhile, they both were just widdling away at him. If either of them did actual damage, he would have been dead. Instead, they were dicking around and refused to, so yeah, congratz, their damage was just a bit lower.

7. Ofcourse ret beasts something easily, it's kinda hard not to beat stuff easily on that spec.

An irrelevant point that didn't even deserve a number because it's just you going "They're OP" again.

8. No that is not my logic at all, you're so quick to instantly attack anyone who dare says your beloved class is over tuned that you overlook key details. I said rogue damage is completely busted, it's not due to poisons so i have no clue where you're getting this ridiculous notion from, it is from envenom crits that can and quite often do completely 1 shot someone by doing over 120k dmg in a single armor bypassing crit. Except for rets, they just stun them and burst them down before it even happens whilst outhealing the damage. There is a massive difference, and yes when a class can literally one shot people but still cannot win vs a certain spec then it is pretty safe to say that class is probably overtuned as well no matter how much that butthurts you to hear.

I'm not attacking anyone, I'm pointing out flaws.

Also almost like, a bubble would save someone from massive amounts of damage. That has nothing to do with "ridiculous OP!", that's something paladins have always had.

Again though, due to the shear delusion and denial this is the last time i am going to respond, i do not see why it is so hard to accept that classes can be over tuned in a beta, it's kinda the point of having a beta, to iron out that stuff.

Because when you have people coming in and claiming "ret has always been OP in all situations!", it's ridiculous. Ret has always been among bottom of the pack for all melee, in all situations. PvP, PvE, anything.

And then here comes this "video proof" of ret being OP, and....

It's one person in a 1v1 situation, the only time Ret is good at PvP.
And a 2v2 where they decided to screw with the ret for a good several minutes.

I mean, like I said, I don't see that ret paladin doing anything that can't be done on live, yet I don't see anyone claiming ret is OP on live.

- - - Updated - - -

Considering I'm a BrM main, that would make me pretty happy actually.

But for the sake of argument if I was WW and they gut half of my abilities or change it in some way, I'd first hold off to see if I like the new mechanic. The new WW would be loved and hated depending on the person because there is no 1 perfect spec, we all have different tastes. I may not like it, but Tom Dick and Harry Jones could love it. (In fact, I DO not like WW's playstyle, so I don't play it. I go to my Havoc if I want to melee DPS)

It's same with Rets. You can't cry over their rotation and say Rets suck now because that is your opinion, some other people may LOVE the new Ret. So the only thing I can base the argument on is what they bring to the group. And Rets bring some more than decent utility. Everything else is just personal taste and numbers tuning from Blizz.

...There was LITERALLY nothing said about rotation.
What are you even talking about.

All Ret brings that's "unique" to Ret as buffs is-

Greater Blessings, which are nearly useless, hence why no one brings a Ret for healers even.
And Hand of Hindrance, which does nothing on raid bosses, and can be dispelled in PvP.

Everything else is on Holy/Prot also as abilities, along with more.

So that's why I'm saying you're misinformed, because you're talking about Ret while you seem to know little to nothing about Ret's history.

[Saverem]

All Ret brings that's "unique" to Ret as buffs is-

Greater Blessings, which are nearly useless, hence why no one brings a Ret for healers even.
And Hand of Hindrance, which does nothing on raid bosses, and can be dispelled in PvP.

Everything else is on Holy/Prot also as abilities, along with more.

So that's why I'm saying you're misinformed, because you're talking about Ret while you seem to know little to nothing about Ret's history.

LOL!

Let's go back to Monks. What is something unique that WWs bring that BrMs and MWs don't?

LITERALLY NOTHING IN BfA. At least in Legion they had Windwalking for the 10% run speed boost, in BfA they bring NOTHING that a MW and BrM doesn't. Yet you are crying over only bringing in TWO UNIQUE UTILITIES.

Your Pally entitlement is showing. But I don't blame you, I blame Blizz for pampering you guys since Vanilla. Hopefully Ion's mistress who played Paladin left him so he can finally balance you guys back down with the rest of us.

Edit: Actually, just checked and they still do bring WWing. nm. Still only 1 thing. And most classes have their utility shared among all their specs.

[Gungnir]

As a Ret main since forever, don't worry, we're going to get crushed through the earth.

Also, whoever is trying to smash on the spriest during that 1v1 vid against the ret paladin, you do realize that Anboni is one of the best spriests we have?
Like, actually one of the most skilled spriests around, while the Retadin seemed like your average faceroller.

[Jester Joe]

LOL!

Let's go back to Monks. What is something unique that WWs bring that BrMs and MWs don't?

LITERALLY NOTHING IN BfA. At least in Legion they had Windwalking for the 10% run speed boost, in BfA they bring NOTHING that a MW and BrM doesn't. Yet you are crying over only bringing in TWO UNIQUE UTILITIES.

Your Pally entitlement is showing. But I don't blame you, I blame Blizz for pampering you guys since Vanilla. Hopefully Ion's mistress who played Paladin left him so he can finally balance you guys back down with the rest of us.

Edit: Actually, just checked and they still do bring WWing. nm. Still only 1 thing. And most classes have their utility shared among all their specs.

Jesus dude.

You are literally ignoring that the utility is USELESS is the point.
Slowing a mob does nothing in 99% of the situations in PvE, and can be dispelled in PvP, while Greater Blessings amount to nothing.

So yes, your 10% movement buff while putting out more damage is more useful than a ret.

Also, for PvP, you have an AoE stun, far more mobile, a teleport, a CC that has no cast timer at all.

Ret has a dispellable stun, a stealable/dispellable freedom, a dispellable bubble, and a horse on a 45 second CD that only lasts 3 seconds.

You HAVE to notice something is wrong when there is literally no one but you claiming that ret was good until this beta test.
That's the issue here, you make it clear you

1) never played a paladin
2) never followed the history of Ret
3) are here just to claim you're right while handwaving anything that proves otherwise.

As a Ret main since forever, don't worry, we're going to get crushed through the earth.

Also, whoever is trying to smash on the spriest during that 1v1 vid against the ret paladin, you do realize that Anboni is one of the best spriests we have?
Like, actually one of the most skilled spriests around, while the Retadin seemed like your average faceroller.

Never heard of him, but does that change that he was screwing around during the 2s?

Because yet again, that's what I was talking about him clowning around and screwing up.

1v1 is never balanced around, so its irrelevant.

[Deleted]

LOL!

Let's go back to Monks. What is something unique that WWs bring that BrMs and MWs don't?

LITERALLY NOTHING IN BfA. At least in Legion they had Windwalking for the 10% run speed boost, in BfA they bring NOTHING that a MW and BrM doesn't. Yet you are crying over only bringing in TWO UNIQUE UTILITIES.

Your Pally entitlement is showing. But I don't blame you, I blame Blizz for pampering you guys since Vanilla. Hopefully Ion's mistress who played Paladin left him so he can finally balance you guys back down with the rest of us.

Edit: Actually, just checked and they still do bring WWing. nm. Still only 1 thing. And most classes have their utility shared among all their specs.

AoE stun, RoP, already more useful compared to a ret.