Why are trolls, tauren, orcs and pandaren following Sylvanas?

[Omians]

a lot of the Shamanism ways dont like the undead. but as long as she doesn't start alienating the races of the horde like Garry did it should be fine for a lil while until somone new comes along to replace her

[Techno-Druid]

And they banished Thrall's grandparents to the outskirts, because his mother was sickly as a child and she was only allowed back in after she had proven to be healthy. Or take the lord of war cinematic the only one who wouldn't abandon his mother due to her sickness was durotan.

I think I misread what you were saying. I think you said that the Frostwolves sent their elderly into exile for being elderly. They definitely won't carry around dead weight though.

[Nerovar]

Because the writers said so and splitting/rebalancing factions would be a PR nightmare. What kind of a question is this even? Lore is not real. WoW races are not real. They don't need "reasons" to do anything. They are digitally rendered fantasies whose logic and placement are entirely dictated by corporate interests and shareholder demands which get filtered by a team of overworked writers.

Infracted.

Good man getting infracted for dropping truth bombs.

it's no longer possible to blame the orc's genocide of the draenei on the legion when they did the same thing without the legion's influence in wod. in fact in wod they began their draenei genocide while preparing to go to azeroth to genocide everyone there as well, using the genocided draenei souls as fuel for their dark portal

there's no coming back from that. you can't say "well that garrosh guy was kind of convincing" because if that's all it takes for the uncorrupted orcs to orchestrate a massacre of literally everyone else on that scale, they are a people who are completely beyond reason

only the frostwolves have any hope of being redeemed in the story as it stands. i'm talking about an actual redemption of course and not the blizzard redemption where we are told that we are all fine with them again for vague reasons.

Draenor is free.

[Combatbutler]

I think I misread what you were saying. I think you said that the Frostwolves sent their elderly into exile for being elderly. They definitely won't carry around dead weight though.

At one point the elderly become just that and they are ashamed because of it, regretting not having died on the battlefield. While the younger ones keep them around for as long as possible depending on their status within the clan.

[Thalassian Bob]

it's no longer possible to blame the orc's genocide of the draenei on the legion when they did the same thing without the legion's influence in wod. in fact in wod they began their draenei genocide while preparing to go to azeroth to genocide everyone there as well, using the genocided draenei souls as fuel for their dark portal

there's no coming back from that. you can't say "well that garrosh guy was kind of convincing" because if that's all it takes for the uncorrupted orcs to orchestrate a massacre of literally everyone else on that scale, they are a people who are completely beyond reason

only the frostwolves have any hope of being redeemed in the story as it stands. i'm talking about an actual redemption of course and not the blizzard redemption where we are told that we are all fine with them again for vague reasons.

Different timeline, different material conditions. The upper echelons of the clans were provided with huge advances in war technology and the methods by which to create and maintain it (Garrosh and his mercenary goblins), they saw an opportunity that was too tempting to pass up and took it.
Wealth and having it or not can change a people. I'm not excusing the actions of the clan chiefs, but I am highlighting the difference in material conditions between the two worlds. We know that the chiefs were slathering over what the "Iron Horde" could do for them, but we don't know how all those below them felt about what their chiefs demanded of them.

We do know that Orgrim Doomhammer in the Iron Horde timeline refused orders to kill non-combatants and it cost him his life. He is proof that, as I said earlier, the orcs, even non-Frostwolves, are not a genocidal cultural monolith. There could have been many more like him who did not feel happy to be involved in what the Iron Horde was doing, but a sense of duty, honour or fear may have kept them in line.

I'd say, to unfortunately go Godwin, the potential for orcish redemption is the same as that of Germany in the wake of the Second World War, a nation for a variety of reasons was whipped up into a war of aggression, but many either resisted at the time or deeply lamented what had happened (often with complete ignorance of the worst elements) after the fact.

A people should not be completely morally written off because of the motivations of its leadership and what those leaders convinced them to do either through manipulation, threat of violence or other factors.

I'm not arguing that none of the orcs beyond the leadership wanted war on Draenor in either timeline, thousands seemingly slathered at the thought of it. But, some didn't and some, after they had time to reflect on what they had done, saw that they had chosen or been lead down the wrong path and hoped to change.

PS. Wasn't the draenei souls as fuel for the Dark Portal just a movie thing?

[Shadowater]

How is she allaince in any way? She’s the queen of lorderon which is horde.

Are you trolling? Horde had control over Lordaeron, that doesn't mean the queen/princess of lordaeron is horde. Because by that logic the lich king is horde because Arthas was the prince and he was gonna be king of lordaeron.

[Combatbutler]

Are you trolling? Horde had control over Lordaeron, that doesn't mean the queen/princess of lordaeron is horde. Because by that logic the lich king is horde because Arthas was the prince and he was gonna be king of lordaeron.

Well Calia herself says she isn't Alliance, which might be some crappy foreshadowing of her ascending the throne of the forsaken as a horde leader.

[Oneirophobia]

From beta it feels a lot like there's something missing. Either removed or never implemented.

The impression I get from the Horde is that the Alliance did something that made them fear for their lives. I don't know why Blizzard removed whatever it was, but they definitely did not change character reactions after it was removed.

I don't know, maybe I'm wrong, but it definitely feels like something major is missing. Something that would explain why the Horde still follows Sylvanas and why characters like Garona and Liadrin are so die hard Horde all of a sudden.

The Alliance attacked and destroyed a horde fleet in Stormheim during a truce against the Legion, then proceeded to hunt the warchief through stormheim. The only alliance character that goes to stormheim and continues the actual mission to save the world is our player character. Even though Greymane disobeyed a direct order from the king and got the Skybreaker destroyed for petty vengeance, Anduin did nothing disciplinary. What message does this send to the Horde? Anduin has no control over the other races and doesn’t seem to care if important military assets are lost in the face of an apocalyptic event the likes of which require every available asset.

The Alliance sent a message to the Horde that day, and it was “nothing is more important than your end and you will never be safe.”

There is also the events of the book in which Calia declares she wants the throne of Undercity and the Alliance pledges support of that goal, sooo.

[Shadowater]

Well Calia herself says she isn't Alliance, which might be some crappy foreshadowing of her ascending the throne of the forsaken as a horde leader.

Well that is because she see herself as a priest of the Netherlight temple. But considering that she hangs out with Anduin pretty much all the time in the book and act sort of an aunt to him tells me that she would go with the alliance over the horde any day.

[Combatbutler]

Well that is because she see herself as a priest of the Netherlight temple. But considering that she hangs out with Anduin pretty much all the time in the book and act sort of an aunt to him tells me that she would go with the alliance over the horde any day.

Unless her people don't want to and lets be reasonable here, most of the forsaken have no interest in that and the one thing Calia made very clear is that her people are the most important thing her.

[Shadowater]

Unless her people don't want to and lets be reasonable here, most of the forsaken have no interest in that and the one thing Calia made very clear is that her people are the most important thing her.

If she became the leader of the Forsaken and they stayed in the horde, that would make pretty much every horde racial leader alliance friendly. Since she would not fight the alliance.

[Combatbutler]

If she became the leader of the Forsaken and they stayed in the horde, that would make pretty much every horde racial leader alliance friendly. Since she would not fight the alliance.

She would not like it, much like baine yet would still march on them. What she wants the moment she becomes leader matters very little if her subjects want something else altogether and lets be real most forsaken hate the Alliance with a passion.

[sillag]

Different timeline, different material conditions. The upper echelons of the clans were provided with huge advances in war technology and the methods by which to create and maintain it (Garrosh and his mercenary goblins), they saw an opportunity that was too tempting to pass up and took it.
Wealth and having it or not can change a people. I'm not excusing the actions of the clan chiefs, but I am highlighting the difference in material conditions between the two worlds. We know that the chiefs were slathering over what the "Iron Horde" could do for them, but we don't know how all those below them felt about what their chiefs demanded of them.

We do know that Orgrim Doomhammer in the Iron Horde timeline refused orders to kill non-combatants and it cost him his life. He is proof that, as I said earlier, the orcs, even non-Frostwolves, are not a genocidal cultural monolith. There could have been many more like him who did not feel happy to be involved in what the Iron Horde was doing, but a sense of duty, honour or fear may have kept them in line.

I'd say, to unfortunately go Godwin, the potential for orcish redemption is the same as that of Germany in the wake of the Second World War, a nation for a variety of reasons was whipped up into a war of aggression, but many either resisted at the time or deeply lamented what had happened (often with complete ignorance of the worst elements) after the fact.

A people should not be completely morally written off because of the motivations of its leadership and what those leaders convinced them to do either through manipulation, threat of violence or other factors.

I'm not arguing that none of the orcs beyond the leadership wanted war on Draenor in either timeline, thousands seemingly slathered at the thought of it. But, some didn't and some, after they had time to reflect on what they had done, saw that they had chosen or been lead down the wrong path and hoped to change.

PS. Wasn't the draenei souls as fuel for the Dark Portal just a movie thing?

it was the same orc culture, same irredeemable orcs. these are the same exact people that the orc culture idolizes as its founding father shamans."technology made me do it" is not actually any kind of excuse that can be taken seriously in a universe where people with far greater technology were able to not create a war machine dedicated to killing all non-orc occupants of 2 planets

trying to say the majority of orcs were just bystanders isn't going to work for you. orc culture has no concept of civilians, you are an active part of the war machine or you are an exile or a rebel with the azeroth horde. when you're talking about orcs who resisted you are only talking about the frostwolves and maybe the laughing skull, which are the only orcs who have hope of narrative redemption for that reason.

now if we want to continue with your ww2 comparison, what we have shown to us in bfa is that after the war, they placed hitler back in a leadership position and allowed him to rule the orcs for years with no repercussions for his wars of genocide and no faction of orcs rising to oppose him. even the frostwolves and laughing skull went back to serving grom. this is actually so stupid of a story it makes my head spin. there's no hope for the orcs after these events, the best you can do is try to wave it off as an alternate timeline, but blizzard have done all in their power to de-emphasize that draenor involved any timetravel, and we're getting those same orcs back on our side in bfa, again without anyone questioning the wisdom of all of this.

draenei souls as fuel for the dark portal is absolutely in game and can be seen in the draenor dark portal opening questline.

[Super Dickmann]

We've reached the highest levels of self-parody, where people will unironically say that orcs were peaceful and would be against war solely so they can fuel their hate-on for Sylvanas.

[Techno-Druid]

We've reached the highest levels of self-parody, where people will unironically say that orcs were peaceful and would be against war solely so they can fuel their hate-on for Sylvanas.

Nice strawman there...

[Lupinemancer]

Because they joined the Horde, it's the same as disregarding everything that has to do with honor, decency, and being a good person.

[Zulkhan]

Because they joined the Horde, it's the same as disregarding everything that has to do with honor, decency, and being a good person.

Yeah, the good times when Orcs had yet to join the Horde.

...

[Deleted]

Because all races that live on Azeroth are corrupted. The Old Gods / Void Lords are behind all this madness.

Sargeras was right.

[Life-Binder]

Because they joined the Horde, it's the same as disregarding everything that has to do with being a shitty, boring, human potential suck up faction with a Mary Sue holier than thou teenager King

. .

[Lorgar Aurelian]

Are you trolling? Horde had control over Lordaeron, that doesn't mean the queen/princess of lordaeron is horde. Because by that logic the lich king is horde because Arthas was the prince and he was gonna be king of lordaeron.

Arthas wasn’t actively trying to help the people of lordaeron our Calia is. The people of lorderon have gone horde and Calia sides with her people alive or dead.