Void Lords were merely a setback! [A Kael Thread]

[MrSaggins]

Really not sure how you understood it this way. He was the leader of the blood elves when they joined, unless you think Blood Elves only joined the horde after the Netherstorm quest experience. I know Warcraft has some convoluted timelines, but that's going to take some real leaps to make happen.

Silvermoon and the Sin'dorei of the Eastern Kingdoms joined the Horde at the invitation of the Forsaken under Lor'themar. Kael was on another planet, and took no part in this decision. Had the Warchief called the prince to Orgrimmar I doubt he would have answered. The alliance between Silvermoon and Undercity, and eventually inclusion into the Horde, was a necessity made precisely because Kael was preoccupied with serving Illidan.

Once the blood elves who had stayed behind sojourned to Outland, they did not find a monarch welcoming them and happy reuinion, they found Voren'thal and the Scryers who had abandoned their mad Prince for the Light of the Naaru (which, as his vision predicted, would ultimately come to Quel'Danas). Then the Horde Blood Elves fought the Illidari Blood Elves and helped depose Kael.

Kael, as I understand it, never personally joined the Horde. But that confusion is good, this isn't supposed to be cut and dry. It should be murky and encourage thought.

[Aeula]

No, no, no, NO! He's been butchered enough as it is, let the poor bastard rest in the pieces WoW tore him into.

Void Elves are a mistake, resurrecting Kael'thas and having him become one of them would be an abomination even greater than the crimes Blizzard's shite writing team have already committed against his character.

[MrSaggins]

How do you think Alleria would react to Kael'thas becoming a prominent figure (and perhaps even leader) to the Void Elves, should your scenario come to pass? Just to speculate, what do you think she would do?

Alleria's perspective would be particularly unique because she was neither present for the betrayals Quel'Thalas endured in the Third War, nor did she witness the dark deeds the Sin'dorei were driven to as a result. Her vision of her people, I imagine, remains naive and untarnished. The events between the Third War and Kil'jaeden's first invasion of Azeroth would be little more than rumors to her, and she, more than anyone, would be ready to give Kael a chance after all that he's done. She could believe in his redemption in a way that Vereesa and the Alliance High Elves never could. For her, there would be nothing to forgive.

And besides, I'm sure she would relish any opportunity to return to her beloved homeland. The Sunstrider claim presents that.

[Briselody]

Alleria's perspective would be particularly unique because she was neither present for the betrayals Quel'Thalas endured in the Third War, nor did she witness the dark deeds the Sin'dorei were driven to as a result. Her vision of her people, I imagine, remains naive and untarnished. The events between the Third War and Kil'jaeden's first invasion of Azeroth would be little more than rumors to her, and she, more than anyone, would be ready to give Kael a chance after all that he's done. She could believe in his redemption in a way that Vereesa and the Alliance High Elves never could. For her, there would be nothing to forgive.

And besides, I'm sure she would relish any opportunity to return to her beloved homeland. The Sunstrider claim presents that.

Kael'thas ditched his people for Dalaran at the earliest opportunity, and they weren't particularly fond of him because of that. Unless Alleria had some personal dealings with him that haven't been stated elsewhere (which they could always retcon that she was his childhood friend or something if they really wanted to) then she probably shares that mistrust. Which isn't to say that she still wouldn't be happy to use him to push into Quel'thelas.

[Powerogue]

"That setback was merely a setback!" jokes would never cease. Please no.

[MrSaggins]

Kael'thas ditched his people for Dalaran at the earliest opportunity, and they weren't particularly fond of him because of that.

Oh? Was this in Rise of the Lich King or something? It's been a good decade since I touched it.

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"That setback was merely a setback!" jokes would never cease. Please no.

You say that like it's a bad thing.

[Deleted]

Well, in Warcraft 3 he had a quote "I feel... edgy", so I suppose it's a kind of hint.

[matrix123mko]

I am still angry that they didn't resurrect him in Legion. He is propably demon, so he could reincarnate and become Legion ambassador in Suramar. Gul'dan could go to ToS then and Kil'jaeden would get right treatment on Argus. Argus could be mythic-only boss.

[Briselody]

Oh? Was this in Rise of the Lich King or something? It's been a good decade since I touched it.

It was in one of the Chronicles, probably Vol. 3

[Tharivor]

Possibly the dumbest idea I've seen on this forum all month. Cutting out chunks of Blood Elf lore and liberally chucking it at the Void Elves does not equate to meaningful development to either side; the Void Elves need to have meaningful development that isn't "we're blue knockoff blood/high elves" and the Blood Elves deserve better than killing the same guy they already killed twice in their introductory expansion.

This thread basically epitomises what is worst about Ren'dorei atm, which is that they have barely anything that distinguishes them from old school Kael'thas style "embrace dark magics" Blood Elves. To bury them further into that mess in what I can only imagine is some weird Alliance fan service for those who still can't accept the events of TFT is ridiculous.

[Coconut]

I think this is a very interesting idea, although obviously I wouldn't want the Void Elves to ever actually take Silvermoon/Quel'thalas. There could be a story line in which they try and fail, perhaps rekindling Magister's Terrace and the Sunwell as Siege of Boralus-type dungeons with different bosses for each faction (and a few out of control Void entities), upon which they give up and go on to start their own society (but maintain the animosity).

Kael'thas as a leader of the Void Elves, carving a place to call their own in the Twisting Nether, would be very reminiscent of the TFT Blood Elf campaign, but with a different tint, and I'm always up for some Warcraft III nostalgia.

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Kael'thas ditched his people for Dalaran at the earliest opportunity, and they weren't particularly fond of him because of that. Unless Alleria had some personal dealings with him that haven't been stated elsewhere (which they could always retcon that she was his childhood friend or something if they really wanted to) then she probably shares that mistrust. Which isn't to say that she still wouldn't be happy to use him to push into Quel'thelas.

Alleria is very loyal to the Alliance, so I doubt she would have any issue with Kael'thas having close ties to Dalaran. She would be less likely to forgive his dealings with the Legion, but that could be retconed and explained in various ways. Kael was mentally in a very vulnerable position when that deal was made.

[MrSaggins]

He is propably demon, so he could reincarnate and become Legion ambassador in Suramar.

Cool idea. As I understand it, he would need to reconstitute in the Nether and have Argus resurrect him if his soul were bound to it. Yet, maining a(n incidentally Blood Elf) Warlock for 2.3, I can't recall being able to enslave felblood elves, or fel orcs for that matter. They seem to be mortals physically infused with fel, but not to the point that their spirits are above time and dimension. I'm not sure it's clear where their souls ended up.

Possibly the dumbest idea I've seen on this forum all month.

Thanks bud. Did you have any constructive ideas to introdruce and further the narrative, or are you content to criticize others without offering your own vision of what might equate to meaningful development?

[Tharivor]

Thanks bud. Did you have any constructive ideas to introdruce and further the narrative, or are you content to criticize others without offering your own vision of what might equate to meaningful development?

Sorry, I was a bit aggressive- too much surfing internet forums at ungodly hours lol

But I think I laid out my main point well enough- I think giving the Void Elves a raised Kael'thas would keep them stuck in the "alliance blood elf" rut that they've been placed in. Future Void Elf storylines should involve actual void elves and their place in the current world rather than trying to "voidify" existing Blood Elf figures.

The possibilities of what this would entail are practically endless- you could have a storyline focusing on how they're dealing with suspicion from the more light-aligned races of the Alliance, a more introspective storyline explaining what they actual intend to change about Blood Elf society should they take Silvermoon, a void based storyline exploring their potential usefulness in a future battle with the void lords, a storyline about the tension between the moralistic ideals of the alliance and their own "ends justify the means" philosophy, or even an ethereal based storyline that could see them move away from their elven roots to establish relations with other sane void users as Alleria did with Locus Walker.
Basically anything that doesn't end up with a replica Blood Elf faction for the Alliance complete with Kael'thas. I mean giving the Alliance the Thalassian Elf model was pushing it, but faction changing the single most important and influential figure in Blood Elf history (who was ironically enough responsible for them leaving the Alliance the first place lol) would just be a definitive kick in the balls to Blood Elf RP.

[ThePallyRanger]

Um... The Lich King, with Frostmourne and the full might of the Scourge is a force that the Alliance cannot possibly compare to. Not really a valid comparison.

Wasn't he just Death Knight Arthas at the time? Yet to put the crown on his head.

[MrSaggins]

...a more introspective storyline explaining what they actual intend to change about Blood Elf society should they take Silvermoon...

A struggle to return home is one thing, but what motive would the Ren'dorei have to seize Silvermoon? Do they have the numbers? Would they wittingly pollute the Sunwell?

I mean giving the Alliance the Thalassian Elf model was pushing it, but faction changing the single most important and influential figure in Blood Elf history (who was ironically enough responsible for them leaving the Alliance the first place lol) would just be a definitive kick in the balls to Blood Elf RP.

But the faction change here would be from the largely defunct Burning Legion faction back to his Alliance roots, correct? I'm not sure that Kael ever formerly withdrew from the Alliance, and he certainly never swore fealty to Warchief Thrall. Any association the Prince technically had with the Horde would merely be by proxy; vicariously through the co-regent of Silvermoon and the Sin'dorei. Silvermoon's alliance with the Forsaken, and eventually Orgrimmar, had been borne out of necessity, partly because Kael'thas had abandoned them for Outland.

That said, I can admit a staunchly pro-Alliance Kael post-Garithos would be a very hard sell to me. It would require a great deal of build up, expression of remorse, blame-shifting on to Lordaeroneans (now Forsaken - Garithos didn't hail from Stormwind), and a personal motive to reclaim his throne explained to only be possible through the aid of the Alliance.

And thank you for clarifying.