Personal loot on pre patch?

[Tradu]

A lot of "ups i clicked it by mistake guys for realz " in shitty toxic guilds incoming will be hillarious to see all those officers whining on forums since they can no longer abuse guildies for it their tears will be delicious

Yeah, how dare people want control over who gets the mount. Not even just officers, but in the case of my guild we have a few people that don't want the mount, so if they get it and can't trade it, that screws everybody else over(including the potential buyer). Master looter is a superior system to PL for mounts in every single way.

[JackWest]

A lot of "ups i clicked it by mistake guys for realz " in shitty toxic guilds incoming will be hillarious to see all those officers whining on forums since they can no longer abuse guildies for it their tears will be delicious

Yes they will. Until they get PL helper and start demanding their raiders trade every piece they can, and guild kick those who dont obey You know, ‘abusive’ guilds wouldnt exist if people werent staying in them. They’d just fall apart So now maybe they will, after they start kicking their own raiders

[Blorgo]

If I were in a guild that didn't distribute loot in a way that has the raidteam benefit the most from itemdrops, I'd just leave.

[n0n3]

I have mixed feelings about this change, during progression having ML is quite useful but I am not keen on the idea of people paying gold for items or mounts and I understand Blizzard's motivation behind it.

Items should be a tool and reward for those who put the time and effort to defeat a boss, it shouldn't be something you can buy with your card as you can easily convert real money into gold via the token system.

[Deleted]

If only people didn't horribly abuse the system we wouldn't be here. But they did. So PL for everyone! It was a good choice by Blizzard.

No abusing was done, it just blizzard beign stupid with this change. its not a good choice, its a super horrible one.

[Frolk]

If only people didn't horribly abuse the system we wouldn't be here. But they did. So PL for everyone! It was a good choice by Blizzard.

Just cause u have been in a guild or 2 that were shitty in way they did loot, does not been most guild does it.

[DarkAviator]

At first I was rather sad to see the loot roll frame going away, really liked it, then I remembered that when I started the game long ago it was all personal loot, it's the base loot type, and there will be that loot roll frame in classic for those who really miss it. just for those who were a bit sad about this.

Your "long ago" can't be that long, really ...
The base loot type for groups was group loot (iirc), the name already suggests it. There were some issues with ninja looters that had mostly been fixed over the years, such as no longer being able to need on chests or gems. The current version with each item having classes/specs associated with them worked fine.

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I have mixed feelings about this change, during progression having ML is quite useful but I am not keen on the idea of people paying gold for items or mounts and I understand Blizzard's motivation behind it.

Items should be a tool and reward for those who put the time and effort to defeat a boss, it shouldn't be something you can buy with your card as you can easily convert real money into gold via the token system.

Uh, using your logic would mean that a char paying to "see the content" shouldn't get any loot, since his only "effort" is paying for the boost and not hindering the rest of the group in doing the actual strategy.

[Cæli]

Your "long ago" can't be that long, really ...
The base loot type for groups was group loot (iirc), the name already suggests it. There were some issues with ninja looters that had mostly been fixed over the years, such as no longer being able to need on chests or gems. The current version with each item having classes/specs associated with them worked fine.

vanilla, first mob you killed, that's PL so that's a return to our earliest wow moments in a way, before we entered our first group.
pleasure comes from seeing stuff near your cursor, instead of seeing stuff popping up the screen with dices. we could still /roll for loot in organized groups.

[Nahela]

The way it works on ptr/beta is that it gives it to someone that doesn't have it and cannot be traded. If someone gets a duplicate (i.e. everyone has it) then it can be traded. Think of it like an item being higher ilvl than what you have.

It's still an awful idea to not give people the option though.

[Low Hanging Fruit]

Just cause u have been in a guild or 2 that were shitty in way they did loot, does not been most guild does it.

At least we admit there are some and now they are no more. Effective and positive change. Successful move Blizzard. Good job. Great change.

[Deleted]

The way it works on ptr/beta is that it gives it to someone that doesn't have it and cannot be traded. If someone gets a duplicate (i.e. everyone has it) then it can be traded. Think of it like an item being higher ilvl than what you have.

It's still an awful idea to not give people the option though.

Mythic argus mounts do not work like the rest of the mount drops (such as gul'dan etc) and no one has tested mythic argus on beta so I doubt anyone would know.

[Tr1n1ty]

A lot of "ups i clicked it by mistake guys for realz " in shitty toxic guilds incoming will be hillarious to see all those officers whining on forums since they can no longer abuse guildies for it their tears will be delicious

Right because not giving to mount to trial Joe that just stepped in because a main raider dc'd is abuse and not common sense /s

Yes they will. Until they get PL helper and start demanding their raiders trade every piece they can, and guild kick those who dont obey You know, ‘abusive’ guilds wouldnt exist if people werent staying in them. They’d just fall apart So now maybe they will, after they start kicking their own raiders

Maybe people stay because they like having loot distributed so it benefits the raid as much as possible and don't consider it abuse if they don't get a piece every week...so many people talking that have no Idea how good guilds use ML/Council

[Frolk]

At least we admit there are some and now they are no more. Effective and positive change. Successful move Blizzard. Good job. Great change.

Why fuck over everyone when only a handful were affected? most of these ML abusers just do HC anyway as they are cesspool guilds

[Amantino]

So glad we are getting personal loot. What now, greedy officers who abuses master loot? Hah!

[Low Hanging Fruit]

Why fuck over everyone when only a handful were affected? most of these ML abusers just do HC anyway as they are cesspool guilds

Like I said in another post this isn't something I experienced directly but have heard a lot about. But here is the problem with your logic.. that HC only anyways cesspool guilds? They are actually closer to the "everyone" instead of "us". That means they are saving more people then they are actually fucking over. Which is why this is a really good change. I mean if your guild isn't good enough to kill stuff without loot stacking certain people recruit better or get better. If content lasts a little longer I cannot say I got a problem with that. If it takes a guild a little longer to get to that wall then its less burn out. If it's less time mindlessly farming something for 6 months then that is actually for the better too. This change is a good one. Sorry, I know you hate it and if loot was more the center of how I play then I would feel the same. But since it isn't I have to say this will end up not changing much for me and end up being a great change.

[Tharkkun]

No abusing was done, it just blizzard beign stupid with this change. its not a good choice, its a super horrible one.

Top guilds abused the system doing split runs and funneling gear through alts. That's a big reason for the change. The other was denying people loot based on guild rules which Blizzard didn't agree with.

[friedmudkipz]

Top guilds abused the system doing split runs and funneling gear through alts. That's a big reason for the change. The other was denying people loot based on guild rules which Blizzard didn't agree with.

What I don't understand is why blizzard wouldn't just make master loot exclusive to mythic if your first point was one of their primary concerns. Mythic guilds could still distribute the most meaningful loot in an intelligent manner and split raids would be dead. Yet they didn't go that route.

[Deleted]

Has someone ever looted a push personal loot mount twice (same character)? this would mean that the system just rolls without any "filters".

Yes, one of my raiders got the mistress sass'zine mount twice in our hc runs, which are always set to pl. He couldn't trade the 2nd one and when he opened a ticket to have it redistributed to another raider, the gm refused to do that.
That mount isn't and never was 100% though, so let's hope it's working better on Argus. We won't get enough mounts for all our raiders anyway, and having it drop for someone that already got it would be very annoying.

I really hope blizzard makes every mount in the future check who has it in bags or learned and gives it to someone who doesn't.

[Deleted]

A lot of "ups i clicked it by mistake guys for realz " in shitty toxic guilds incoming will be hillarious to see all those officers whining on forums since they can no longer abuse guildies for it their tears will be delicious

Isn't going to be the officers crying, it's the scrubs.

We have a DK who was around for some early Argus progression but ended up disappearing off the face of the globe, he's back and I wouldn't have minded getting him an Argus kill, but if that's going to potentially shaft someone from the main raiding roster who's still after a mount due to personal loot giving it to him then I can't justify bringing him.

Top guilds abused the system doing split runs and funneling gear through alts. That's a big reason for the change. The other was denying people loot based on guild rules which Blizzard didn't agree with.

Blizzard have explicitly said it's not to cater to top 100 guilds doing split runs. It's completely retarded to design the game around those as well - that's the kind of thinking that gets tier sets removed from LFR or makes it so that there's one save between heroic and mythic.

Both changes that would "help" the top 100s not feel over worked.
Both changes that would be absolute cancer to have to deal with for the other 99% of the playerbase.

At least we admit there are some and now they are no more. Effective and positive change. Successful move Blizzard. Good job. Great change.

I can only see it making things more toxic if anything.

The boss dropping an item and you not getting it when you feel entitled to it is one thing.
The item appearing in your inventory and then you being told to trade it when you have pretty good reason to feel entitled to it is a damnsight more toxic, and it's what's going to end up happening in cases where trade is eligible, even if the item might technically be an upgrade for the person.

Ontop of that you also get retarded situations where items can't be traded due to the idiotic system Blizzard have in place. I've already been denied a trinket during Gul'dan progression from an M+ because our tank couldn't trade an item that was a lower item level than 4 of his 5 trinkets because the system is bad and the GMs can't do anything about it- I can't wait to see that happening on progression.


It's a badly thought out change to "fix" toxic guilds that abuse loot.
Even if we pretend they're not a vast minority and this is punishing to guilds that are ran properly, I don't think making loot personal is going to fix that, it's still going to be a shit environment and they're still going to abuse whatever they can. The solution Blizzard SHOULD be doing is merging more realms and making the cost of leaving a guild and finding a new one less obnoxious - I don't blame people for feeling trapped when I look at server transfer and character faction swap fees, but this isn't the fix, it's nonsense.

At the very least they could have made it so that ML was still available for Mythic raid groups with 20 guild members making up the group.

[Low Hanging Fruit]

I can only see it making things more toxic if anything.

The boss dropping an item and you not getting it when you feel entitled to it is one thing.
The item appearing in your inventory and then you being told to trade it when you have pretty good reason to feel entitled to it is a damnsight more toxic, and it's what's going to end up happening in cases where trade is eligible, even if the item might technically be an upgrade for the person.

Ontop of that you also get retarded situations where items can't be traded due to the idiotic system Blizzard have in place. I've already been denied a trinket during Gul'dan progression from an M+ because our tank couldn't trade an item that was a lower item level than 4 of his 5 trinkets because the system is bad and the GMs can't do anything about it- I can't wait to see that happening on progression.


It's a badly thought out change to "fix" toxic guilds that abuse loot.
Even if we pretend they're not a vast minority and this is punishing to guilds that are ran properly, I don't think making loot personal is going to fix that, it's still going to be a shit environment and they're still going to abuse whatever they can. The solution Blizzard SHOULD be doing is merging more realms and making the cost of leaving a guild and finding a new one less obnoxious - I don't blame people for feeling trapped when I look at server transfer and character faction swap fees, but this isn't the fix, it's nonsense.

At the very least they could have made it so that ML was still available for Mythic raid groups with 20 guild members making up the group.

I can imagine the very toxic people that made this happen pushing for the trade. With the hopes of it being a lower item level of course than what the person has equipped or its simply impossible anyway.

No doubt there will be techincal issues but you also pointed out that they are there now. So that is kinda voided in the damned if you do or don't.

It is just something you are going to have to get used to. Sometimes the people that think the whole game is centered around them (sounds like you) don't get what they want and the people that have been getting screwed over the the cake. I can explain how to unsub if its that big of a deal. If you plan to stay then I would say the only protest that works for this is out the window. If you are are already unsubbed.. why the F do you care..

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Isn't going to be the officers crying, it's the scrubs.

We have a DK who was around for some early Argus progression but ended up disappearing off the face of the globe, he's back and I wouldn't have minded getting him an Argus kill, but if that's going to potentially shaft someone from the main raiding roster who's still after a mount due to personal loot giving it to him then I can't justify bringing him.

If you are so toxic that you throw way people and possibly friends for a cosmetic reward then you need to look in the mirror and say.. my god.. why was I this way.. why did I do what it took to make this change happen..

The same logic should have you thinking to never bring someone that has it either then. It could go to them and not beable to trade it..

Jesus you people are so horrible to each other..