I really hope Sylvanas dies in BfA

[Rend Blackhand]

Sylvanas needs to be kicked out and killed but it MUST be a Horde only quest chain/scenario. We cannot have a second Siege of Orgrimmar where horde players are left feeling like losers.

[Minikin]

Well I've been theorizing that she's going to become a Sarah Kerrigan character and Anduin's going to ascend being High King and become God Emperor of the Universe to fight the Void Lords. Horde and Alliance will be handed to the players and the fighting will be minimal from here on out at best

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All the Allied races are led by females, so the Horde just got a few

Baine's gonna need a Life Jacket cause he's gonna be drowning in all that... nevermind

Drowning in all of that?

Water?
Sand?
Salt?

What man what?! U can't leave us hanging like this!

[Gavll]

Yeah not like Genn tried to assassinate a faction leader who was just trying to ensure the future of her people by getting the Vrykul to rez dead people.

The Forsaken have no future. They can't reproduce. They are doomed anyway. If she was a good leader, they'd just accept their fate rather than her searching for ways to commit genocide to force people to become Forsaken. That is in itself pure evil. Nobody who's dead wants to be rezzed as a Forsaken.

If she was a benevolent leader, she'd take all the Forsaken and find a party island somewhere far away from everyone where they'd just live (forever?) and not bother anyone.

[Minikin]

I love how angry she makes some neck beards, so i hope she remains undead and well.

That and how deeply in love some neck beards are with her lol. Honestly at times I feel both parties can't tell if she is fiction or not, with how much they obsess over her

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yeah because he knew she would do that at the start of stormheim

he just attacked her because shes sylvanas, not to stop some shemes

Well it's not like she killed his son and wrecked his home.

[Raetary]

and you couldn't post this in any of the hundred other "SYLVUNUS IS SUTUUUUUUUN!" threads because why exactly?

[Deleted]

Well, I hope Sylvanas is still the warchief at the end of BFA. She is one of the last decent horde characters we have left (imo).

[Varitok]

If war is boring then I'd consider playing something else as I stated previously. Only "war" we have been recently at has been against some supernatural threat be it scourge, legion, deathwing, anything that can just wipeout the world. I agree with that's something I'd call boring. There cannot always be something that can just snap the world out of existance and we just by some huge luck manage to win it.

But some real war action between the factions we've really seen with Sylvanas vs Genn most recently. I really like if we are heading a bit more towards the release of WoW. We need some shakeup with the factions. For example Nelves have been really really boring since Warcraft 3, maybe the following events will let them be more interesting. Have them do something else than Malfurion sleeping in various places.

Fuck off with that, The war has gotten stale, absolutely. How can you realistically be okay with factions resolving their issues and immediately opening the wounds back up for no fucking reason. The war should be with whatever evil or anything before us, not with this tired ass tit for tat Alliance vs Horde shit.

I've been playing this game a lot long than most people here. There is nothing fresh about the faction wars, nothing can change that. We have been in a constant faction war for 14 years, this expansion is just gonna slip into normal mobs and shit immediately then culminate in a Siege of Stormwind or some shit, a treaty being signed and then guess what for next expac? THE DRUMS OF WAR SOUND ONCE AGAIN.

[Verdugo]

and you couldn't post this in any of the hundred other "SYLVUNUS IS SUTUUUUUUUN!" threads because why exactly?

Because JustRob still didnt figure out how to respond, he is only capable of creating new threads.

Or, more likely explanation, its a troll account.

[Super Dickmann]

[JustRob]

LOL go read a fairytale then... Really, how old are you if you have a problem with a story like this?

Yes, it is disturbing but it is very clear that undead are not the same as living humans. They have a racial that's called cannibalize. They died, they were raised from the dead and became undead, usually all rotting. We've learned that they are capable of feelings but you have to understand that they think and act differently. Their boundaries are set much lower. They don't share the same values with the orcs or with the taurens. I don't think it's impossible to understand the decision Sylvanas has made. I think it's more surprising that there were characters like Nathanos who were actually surprised or whatever because of what she did. I would expect that they would immediately understand her and wouldn't even question why she did it. I don't think her decision was that much of a shock if you really consider what race we are talking about. The forsaken usually don't give a damn.

You are obviously a huge fan of the human kingdom. And because of that, I don't think you can understand this. I don't think Sylvanas became more evil over the time. She is basically the same. She just has more screentime this time.

I don't think she stepped through the line. She definitely came to it and squeezed it. I think her character reflects the concept of undead very well. The players (but Blizz as well) just humanized some individuals of the race too much. I am NOT apologizing for her though. Hate or criticize it as you want. I am just saying that when you try to think without the biases and accept the fact that this race simply differs from all the others (which are all consinsting of LIVING members) you can understand what she did and why she did it.

Actually, this book made me like the Forsaken. I always thought they were unnatural monsters that shouldn't even exist, and should just walk themselves into a pool of fire. But it's not that simple. Just like Genn does in the book, I see now that there are Forsaken who still feel and behave like humans. Who still care about others. Sylvanas is nothing like that. Every chance she has had to reunite with her sisters she has fucked up because of her hateful nature. She's incapable of feeling compassion for anyone. Just an empty shell, a monster.

/facepalm Yes... we as readers know that because we read the book... Her people, inside the fictional realm of wow did not read the book.. so they only know what they are told, and that is Sylvanas killed defectors that the Alliance turned.

That doesn't make her reasons any less evil. She's a power hungry maniac who will kill off anyone who she sees as a challenge to her seat of power, even if they aren't.

Sure Ravencrest's Men was not "his own" but thats fine then right,,, right?

Illidan sacrificed them to stop the enemy. Yeah it's definitely not okay to do so, but that's what Illidan is, an anti hero. He does awful things but he does them for a righteous goal. Sylvanas is nothing like that. She will sacrifice anything and anyone to protect herself and her position of power.

No real wartime leader can afford to have defected members running something as big as a city, and more than that, the leaders home. The story was clearly written in a way that makes you bond with the characters about to die. For anyone not used to the politics and ideas of wartime, this sure seems like a betrayal but this is a big powermove by Sylvanas and a lesson to learn from for Nathanos. Easy move with big rewards and minimal losses by Sylvanas, also as described by Anduins thoughts in the book.

She killed them to establish her position and make sure that anyone who thinks he could run to the other side would think twice. Blame Calia for being stupid to even attempt it.

I guess you are another alliance crybaby.

Then kill only the ones running towards the Alliance camp. But no, she also killed the ones who were running back to her. Why? Because these were all members of the Desolate Council, and this was the perfect opportunity for her to annihilate a group of Forsaken she viewed as a threat to her power (which they weren't) without being nailed to the wall for it. She can hide behind that pathetic excuse of "Wuhhh they were defecting" and nobody can do much. But still, the Forsaken and definitely the Horde should see through that weak excuse and put her down. She's poison to both groups.

[Super Dickmann]

Then kill only the ones running towards the Alliance camp. But no, she also killed the ones who were running back to her. Why? Because these were all members of the Desolate Council, and this was the perfect opportunity for her to annihilate a group of Forsaken she viewed as a threat to her power (which they weren't) without being nailed to the wall for it. She can hide behind that pathetic excuse of "Wuhhh they were defecting" and nobody can do much. But still, the Forsaken and definitely the Horde should see through that weak excuse and put her down. She's poison to both groups.

Do any of you even read the book or do you just get your lines from people just as uninformed on the forums? We are privy to Sylvanas' internal monologue, so we know what she was thinking at the time and that wasn't it. If you read the godawful book, you'd be aware of this. She stages the meeting for it to serve as demotivation for the Desolate Council, then acts impulsively because she assumes Calia is guiding the defecting high officials away. Then she kills twelve people, of which four to eleven of which were in fact traitors.

[Satelliteyears0o]

Well right now we only know that Sylvanas wanted to capture Teldrassil not destroy it, which leads me to believe that her reaction in darkshore points to her not knowing about the burning because she is surprised by the event. Instead of trying to prove her innocence which she knows would be futile she just accepted the outcome and accepted the trajectory. Very smart of her, once all is said n done she'll have a chance i think later to discuss things when the REAL threat of BFA surfaces. no pun intended lol

[JustRob]

Do any of you even read the book or do you just get your lines from people just as uninformed on the forums? We are privy to Sylvanas' internal monologue, so we know what she was thinking at the time and that wasn't it. If you read the godawful book, you'd be aware of this. She stages the meeting for it to serve as demotivation for the Desolate Council, then acts impulsively because she assumes Calia is guiding the defecting high officials away. Then she kills twelve people, of which four to eleven of which were in fact traitors.

Her only retort to "They were running back here" is "How much of that is fear" and "How tempted were they". Slaughtering your own people because of a MAYBE is atrocious. Kill them if they openly betray you, don't automatically assume they were going to. But that's what Sylvanas is.

[Kithelle]

Saurfang is bloody traitorr that doenst care about horde, he is nto fien with sylvnanas say it to ehr and challenge her to makgorah or so after the abttle, not forsake evryone on middle of a important fight cause suddenly doesnt wanna live anymore Saurfang is ruined. HE doesnt wanan fight for it or even help horde no he just forsakes them in mid of battle;

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no one knew what she was gonan do there, and certainly not genn. He and rogers were and still are idiots for atatcking sylvannas her fleet who at moment had done nothing and he doesnt know what theyre wonna go do there.

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Alliance dint know what they ere mining, adn liners are civilians. Alliance is in fault there not horde.

She was sloppy and left clues...plus you know her sending a entire fleet and her traveling with the fleet...not fishy at all

[Super Dickmann]

Her only retort to "They were running back here" is "How much of that is fear" and "How tempted were they". Slaughtering your own people because of a MAYBE is atrocious. Kill them if they openly betray you, don't automatically assume they were going to. But that's what Sylvanas is.

This horse is not even giblets at this point. Executing high officials for treason is standard in multiple developed countries that aren't autocracies run by an unempathetic zombie. Even more so if, as is the case, she had every reason to believe they were defecting at the time she gave the order to kill, and a third to all but one of them were legitimately traitors. Why you choose this as your hill to die on rather than her much more unambiguously evil acts in Gilneas or Hillsbrad is beyond me.

[Heladys]

This horse is not even giblets at this point. Executing high officials for treason is standard in multiple developed countries that aren't autocracies run by an unempathetic zombie. Even more so if, as is the case, she had every reason to believe they were defecting at the time she gave the order to kill, and a third to all but one of them were legitimately traitors. Why you choose this as your hill to die on rather than her much more unambiguously evil acts in Gilneas or Hillsbrad is beyond me.

Bull. Fucking. Shit.

She set the whole goddamn thing up so she would have a pretext to have the council and just the council banded together in a casus belli.

She had every intention of killing them all before the thing even happened.

[Super Dickmann]

Bull. Fucking. Shit.

She set the whole goddamn thing up so she would have a pretext to have the council and just the council banded together in a casus belli.

She had every intention of killing them all before the thing even happened.

Read the book. Or, if that's too challenging, read the excerpt where you see her thought process. When she learns of the defectors, she calls the horn to recall them. She only goes for the killing order once she learns Calia was there.

[Yriel]

The Forsaken have no future. They can't reproduce. They are doomed anyway. If she was a good leader, they'd just accept their fate rather than her searching for ways to commit genocide to force people to become Forsaken. That is in itself pure evil. Nobody who's dead wants to be rezzed as a Forsaken.

If she was a benevolent leader, she'd take all the Forsaken and find a party island somewhere far away from everyone where they'd just live (forever?) and not bother anyone.

WoW is a fantasy world, biological reproduction is not the only thing. All the elementals, for example, don't reproduce either so should they all die, too? How racist.

[JustRob]

This horse is not even giblets at this point. Executing high officials for treason is standard in multiple developed countries that aren't autocracies run by an unempathetic zombie. Even more so if, as is the case, she had every reason to believe they were defecting at the time she gave the order to kill, and a third to all but one of them were legitimately traitors. Why you choose this as your hill to die on rather than her much more unambiguously evil acts in Gilneas or Hillsbrad is beyond me.

And what if they were defecting? Why is this even a bad thing? Forgive me if I'm wrong, but isn't Sylvanas all about giving the Forsaken "free will"? So what if they went to live with the Alliance. Kill them in battle if they ever take up arms against you.

The whole thing about the Forsaken (which Sylvanas also often used to moan about by the way) was that the living didn't accept them because of what they were. Well, these living DID accept them and welcomed them. But no, Sylvanas can't have that. Can't have innocent civillians going to live with their beloved still living loved ones.

It just shows that even if peace were possible between the humans and the Forsaken, Sylvanas would never allow it. She would never allow the Forsaken to leave her seat of power and live alongside humans. Hell, multiple times throughout the book she tries her damndest to convince the Forsaken that the living hate them. She manipulates them and plays on their fears so they'll stay loyal to her.

[Dalheim]

Well Horde turned their backs on their allies...so retaliation is fair...Alliance destroyed mining equipment, it's the Goblins who decided to attack combatants they couldn't beat! She attacked her own allies in attempt to murder and destabilize them in order to conquer them...it is pretty much her fault.

By not wasting their lives? Sure.