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  1. #141
    Quote Originally Posted by Daemos daemonium View Post
    In preaches own video he says some people will see traits differently and more impactful then he does, so no your not sharing facts.

    Other wise I’ve gone though 5 expans with out azerite or legion legendarys so I see them as the bonus rather they are impactful or not.
    Its not a bonus if you consider they are a shell of what legions systems offered for classes... its a pure downgrade on all fronts. Yea there might be something cool everyone gets that changes some playstyles or w/e... but what... at this point were trying to build back to playstyles weve had in the past.
    "I'm Tru @ w/e I do" ~ TM

  2. #142
    The Unstoppable Force Lorgar Aurelian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tru View Post
    Its not a bonus if you consider they are a shell of what legions systems offered for classes... its a pure downgrade on all fronts. Yea there might be something cool everyone gets that changes some playstyles or w/e... but what... at this point were trying to build back to playstyles weve had in the past.
    its still a bonus even if its not as impactful as the legion legendary's.

  3. #143
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Daemos daemonium View Post
    If you think the core of the game is bad why are you playing the game?
    maybe.. because the core was fine until now ???

    dont be so fucking retarded please

  4. #144
    The Unstoppable Force Lorgar Aurelian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ripslyme View Post
    maybe.. because the core was fine until now ???

    dont be so fucking retarded please
    for me the core is still fine for the classes i play if they weren't i wouldn't still be playing and id suggest if you don't enjoy it you unsub as i would.

  5. #145
    My biggest issue with BFA has always been the lack of creative class design. It's difficult to keep pouring new ideas into a game that's almost 15 years old, but what we have seen so far from the azerite system has been lackluster. My reasoning behind that is I personally think MOP had some of the best class design in the game, but with the removal of skills and abilities with the release of WoD and Legion, it started to feel rather bare-bones to me. The addition of everything that was artifacts and legendaries helped, even though I disliked the initial grind behind the artifacts and the legendary system was atrociously bad with it's RNG. Moving into BFA, we're back to the bare-bones slate we started with at the beginning of Legion, sans the artifact ability.

    An additional row of talents at 120 would have probably satisfied a lot of the community who see class design as a glaring issue. Of course, it would be a lot of work to implement 3 new talents for each spec, but it would have been better than the glorified tier bonus sets we are seeing in the current azerite traits. Blizzard may surprise us and update the raid sets with awesome traits right before BFA comes out, but honestly we probably won't see anything substantial until 8.1 is released. And to me, not knowing how Blizzard is planning to effectively "fill the gaps" before the expansion release is very disconcerting.

  6. #146
    Quote Originally Posted by Daemos daemonium View Post
    its still a bonus even if its not as impactful as the legion legendary's.
    Eyes of Rage Azerite Power
    Instant
    Requires Demon Hunter
    Eye Beam deals an additional

    Blind Fury
    180

    120 damage. Consuming a Soul Fragment reduces the cooldown of Eye Beam by 1.0 sec.

    __________________________________________________________________________________________

    Furious Gaze Azerite Power
    Requires Demon Hunter
    When Eye Beam finishes fully channeling, your Haste is increased by 10 for 8 sec.


    The 2 "Best" Havoc traits have been watered down and diluted so much from the tier set / baseline functionality of DH that even though they are best I dont think they can even save the demonic spec, we will still be running momentum and just using eyebeam because its there not because of how awesomely it affected us in legion with demon form.

    "Were going to take away things you use now, that you like. Make you reearn them at 120 so its not even exciting since you have HAD them before. But were also going to make them fantastically worse by all accounts. AZERITE SYSTEM IS SO COOL GUYS GET HYPE"

  7. #147
    Quote Originally Posted by Makina View Post
    Eyes of Rage Azerite Power
    Instant
    Requires Demon Hunter
    Eye Beam deals an additional

    Blind Fury
    180

    120 damage. Consuming a Soul Fragment reduces the cooldown of Eye Beam by 1.0 sec.

    __________________________________________________________________________________________

    Furious Gaze Azerite Power
    Requires Demon Hunter
    When Eye Beam finishes fully channeling, your Haste is increased by 10 for 8 sec.


    The 2 "Best" Havoc traits have been watered down and diluted so much from the tier set / baseline functionality of DH that even though they are best I dont think they can even save the demonic spec, we will still be running momentum and just using eyebeam because its there not because of how awesomely it affected us in legion with demon form.

    "Were going to take away things you use now, that you like. Make you reearn them at 120 so its not even exciting since you have HAD them before. But were also going to make them fantastically worse by all accounts. AZERITE SYSTEM IS SO COOL GUYS GET HYPE"
    #1 that first trait is perfectly fine in aoe and 2nd trait was always meh. #2 It seems pretty clear they don't want you using Eye Beam in single target and it being a viable way to do things unless you have talented so it generates fury. #3 those are not the "best havok traits" there are no "best traits" for anyone for every scenario OR TALENTS FOR THAT MATTER. Problem is you're trying to build cookie cutter and that's not how this shit is supposed to work. Hence you have OPTIONS. That means there is no "best".
    Last edited by Shakou; 2018-07-21 at 01:31 AM.

  8. #148
    Quote Originally Posted by Shakou View Post
    #1 that first trait is perfectly fine in aoe and 2nd trait was always meh. #2 It seems pretty clear they don't want you using Eye Beam in single target and it being a viable way to do things unless you have talented so it generates fury. #3 those are not the "best havok traits" there are no "best traits" for anyone for every scenario OR TALENTS FOR THAT MATTER. Problem is you're trying to build cookie cutter and that's not how this shit is supposed to work. Hence you have OPTIONS. That means there is no "best".
    Revolving Blades Azerite Power
    Requires Demon Hunter
    Blade Dance deals 60 additional damage, and the cost of your next Blade Dance is reduced by 5 Fury for each enemy struck by the final slash.

    ________________________

    Thirsting Blades Azerite Power
    Requires Demon Hunter
    Every 1.5 sec, increase the damage of Chaos Strike by 0 and reduce its cost by 1 Fury. This effect stacks.

    ________________________

    Unbound Chaos Azerite Power
    Requires Demon Hunter
    Your inner demon slams into nearby enemies at the end of your Fel Rush, dealing 125 Chaos damage.

    __________________


    There plus the original linked this is all of Havocs non defensive tier traits. I struggle to find any that I go "this will be so amazing in raids."

    The Uldir specific "raid traits" are generic and do nothing to any of the classes outside of MORE DEEPS IN ULDIR which is frankly boring as crap.

    Some classes actually got good traits that truly alter their play, others like mine are so meh its unreal. I will probably be using Unbound Chaos because Momentum is becoming the defacto choice as of the recent rounds of changes.

  9. #149
    The Unstoppable Force Lorgar Aurelian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Makina View Post
    The 2 "Best" Havoc traits have been watered down and diluted so much from the tier set / baseline functionality of DH that even though they are best I dont think they can even save the demonic spec, we will still be running momentum and just using eyebeam because its there not because of how awesomely it affected us in legion with demon form.

    "Were going to take away things you use now, that you like. Make you reearn them at 120 so its not even exciting since you have HAD them before. But were also going to make them fantastically worse by all accounts. AZERITE SYSTEM IS SO COOL GUYS GET HYPE"
    I have not and will not play a demon hunter so I really can’t speak to any thing about them other then they haven’t had a core class before legion and haven’t gone though the multiple core changes other classes have so the bonuses are Proabbly far more impactful as they haven’t been gaining and losing different play styles for years.

  10. #150
    Quote Originally Posted by Makina View Post
    Revolving Blades Azerite Power
    Requires Demon Hunter
    Blade Dance deals 60 additional damage, and the cost of your next Blade Dance is reduced by 5 Fury for each enemy struck by the final slash.

    ________________________

    Thirsting Blades Azerite Power
    Requires Demon Hunter
    Every 1.5 sec, increase the damage of Chaos Strike by 0 and reduce its cost by 1 Fury. This effect stacks.

    ________________________

    Unbound Chaos Azerite Power
    Requires Demon Hunter
    Your inner demon slams into nearby enemies at the end of your Fel Rush, dealing 125 Chaos damage.

    __________________


    There plus the original linked this is all of Havocs non defensive tier traits. I struggle to find any that I go "this will be so amazing in raids."

    The Uldir specific "raid traits" are generic and do nothing to any of the classes outside of MORE DEEPS IN ULDIR which is frankly boring as crap.

    Some classes actually got good traits that truly alter their play, others like mine are so meh its unreal. I will probably be using Unbound Chaos because Momentum is becoming the defacto choice as of the recent rounds of changes.
    You do realize that Uldir is the HIGHMAUL of the xpac, right? RIGHT? The "tier" raid is the next one that will follow.

  11. #151
    Quote Originally Posted by Shakou View Post
    You do realize that Uldir is the HIGHMAUL of the xpac, right? RIGHT? The "tier" raid is the next one that will follow.
    I do realize that which is why these traits are boring as dogmeat, im playing probably 8 months or more with stuff that does almost nothing for me. Unbound Chaos single target, Revolving Blades if there is ALOT of adds. Both are things that I wont even notice happening.

  12. #152
    Quote Originally Posted by Hitei View Post
    You are dumb. We already know legion has outperformed WoD and WoD was 5 mil.
    So Legion is performing better than WoD? Jeez what a shock. An expansion with four content patches has done better than an expansion with one that also happened to be the worst expansion of all time. And outperformed is so vague, outperformed in what ? definetly not in subs.
    When you set the bar so low even garbage(legion) is better then shit(wod) .
    And really( Dumb)? You couldnt come up with something better? I gues thats what happens when you burst someones bubble.
    Last edited by Pancreatin; 2018-07-21 at 01:50 AM.

  13. #153
    Quote Originally Posted by Makina View Post
    I do realize that which is why these traits are boring as dogmeat
    No you don't realize it. You think you do but you don't. You literally wore gear with stats and no bonuses in Highmaul and Emerald Nightmare. It's supposed to be like this. That's why the Uldir gear has one special uldir only trait and then same traits as the dungeon gear. If you're frustrated by this frankly nobody gives a shit and you're lucky we're even responding this much.

  14. #154
    Quote Originally Posted by Pancreatin View Post
    So Legion is performing better than WoD? Jeez what a shock. An expansion with four content patches has done better than an expansion with one that also happened to be the worst expansion of all time. And outperformed is so vague, outperformed in what ? definetly not in subs.
    When you set the bar so low even garbage(legion) is better then shit(wod) .
    And really Dumb ? You couldnt come up with something better? I gues thats what happens when you burst someones bubble.
    Dumb seems appropriate when you type what amounts to "Of course Legion performed better! It definitely didn't perform better though."

    It sequentially out-performed in revenue generation. I.e. following the same curves of ups and downs, it's high points were higher and its low points were higher. In other words, it had more subs. Services were mentioned separately.

  15. #155
    Quote Originally Posted by Shakou View Post
    No you don't realize it. You think you do but you don't. You literally wore gear with stats and no bonuses in Highmaul and Emerald Nightmare. It's supposed to be like this. That's why the Uldir gear has one special uldir only trait and then same traits as the dungeon gear. If you're frustrated by this frankly nobody gives a shit and you're lucky we're even responding this much.
    They said specifically that its replacing Artifact Weapons, which we had in EN aswell as Legendaries, which we had in EN. I am stating that what we are gaining is nowhere near the value in ANY of my traits. Im not talking hollistically im talking specifically as a DH who developers have stated the class was built AROUND the artifact weapon. We are in a somewhat unique area where losing legion systems affects us in a severely adverse manner.

  16. #156
    Quote Originally Posted by Makina View Post
    They said specifically that its replacing Artifact Weapons, which we had in EN aswell as Legendaries, which we had in EN. I am stating that what we are gaining is nowhere near the value in ANY of my traits. Im not talking hollistically im talking specifically as a DH who developers have stated the class was built AROUND the artifact weapon. We are in a somewhat unique area where losing legion systems affects us in a severely adverse manner.
    You are so dense dude. It is the norm for 3 expansions now that you start out the expansion with less exciting gear and it spices up as the expansion moves forward. It was no different in Legion, it's no different now. You're also flat out wrong about legendary items in legion, plenty of people had none or only shit ones in Emerald Nightmare or never got 2 until it was well established you could just get better gear from m+.

    Also they literally fixed the fucking Havok spec so you're not tied down to bullshit demonic/demon blades build but can do wtf you want. Their issues are entirely numbers tuning.
    Last edited by Shakou; 2018-07-21 at 02:35 AM.

  17. #157
    Quote Originally Posted by Hitei View Post
    Dumb seems appropriate when you type what amounts to "Of course Legion performed better! It definitely didn't perform better though."

    It sequentially out-performed in revenue generation. I.e. following the same curves of ups and downs, it's high points were higher and its low points were higher. In other words, it had more subs. Services were mentioned separately.
    I didnt even say that legion didnt outperformed wod youre just strawmaning, the revenue generation doesnt mean more subs that why i said that their statements are vague, most of their revenues are microtranscrions wich are amplified even now by thos recolored skin that they call alied races.
    They may profit now with less subs but there is a limit, eventually the game will not be able to sustain itself and it will go in to maintanence mode, and they are preparing for it aka legacy servers classic.

    Even now they arent spending alot of development time on the game, why would they? Just take the same quests and and repeatable dungeons make it so that there are rewards baked in there with a huge ton of rng, and dont forget to make it as easy as posible so the mouthbreathers are able to do it and you have a perfect low budge korean mmo. Oh yeah lets not forget the legendarie there is no better example of a carrot on a stick.

  18. #158
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Pancreatin View Post
    I didnt even say that legion didnt outperformed wod youre just strawmaning, the revenue generation doesnt mean more subs that why i said that their statements are vague, most of their revenues are microtranscrions wich are amplified even now by thos recolored skin that they call alied races.
    They may profit now with less subs but there is a limit, eventually the game will not be able to sustain itself and it will go in to maintanence mode, and they are preparing for it aka legacy servers classic.

    Even now they arent spending alot of development time on the game, why would they? Just take the same quests and and repeatable dungeons make it so that there are rewards baked in there with a huge ton of rng, and dont forget to make it as easy as posible so the mouthbreathers are able to do it and you have a perfect low budge korean mmo. Oh yeah lets not forget the legendarie there is no better example of a carrot on a stick.
    tldr: wow is dieing and i know it!

  19. #159
    Quote Originally Posted by Menax View Post
    tldr: wow is dieing and i know it!
    Sadly it is

  20. #160
    Quote Originally Posted by Shakou View Post
    You are so dense dude. It is the norm for 3 expansions now that you start out the expansion with less exciting gear and it spices up as the expansion moves forward. It was no different in Legion, it's no different now. You're also flat out wrong about legendary items in legion, plenty of people had none or only shit ones in Emerald Nightmare or never got 2 until it was well established you could just get better gear from m+.

    Also they literally fixed the fucking Havok spec so you're not tied down to bullshit demonic/demon blades build but can do wtf you want. Their issues are entirely numbers tuning.
    It is different, we could see the traits, tier bonuses and legendaries we would get until 7.2. There's little indication right now that we will get significantly improved systems any time soon when you have the game director saying "well some of the azerite traits you might get are interactive" when just as many and more are not, not to mention the other issues such as less permanence. I don't think blindly trusting that they'll deliver something is very smart, at least if you don't want just another netherlight crucible.

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